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  #5151  
Old 11-16-12, 20:34
fatandfast fatandfast is offline
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why don't the old blue hairs just admit that they are going to do whatever it takes to make John Kerry the Sec of State. Why do they have to doormat some woman that is obviously,able, intelligent but not who they want.

John McCain, I never thought you would act like a punk,big unpleasant surprise.
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  #5152  
Old 11-16-12, 20:37
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Alpe d'Huez Alpe d'Huez is offline
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Originally Posted by VeloCity View Post
This is the third time in the past decade that Hostess has filed for bankruptcy. That's bad management, not striking workers or unions.
I would argue it's both to some degree at this point in time, and not objective for anyone to assume it was entirely one or the other.

The union workers however will face a much harder landing than the top executives who have parachutes to stop their fall.
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  #5153  
Old 11-16-12, 20:52
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Scott SoCal Scott SoCal is offline
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Originally Posted by VeloCity View Post
Could be.

What exactly is the scandal here, btw? Oh right. Scandal envy.

https://prospect.org/article/what-be...t-scandal-envy

Really? This again? You know that's crap and yet you keep repeating it. I'm starting to understand why you're so susceptible to the echo chamber.

Anyway, how much have those 33 votes on Obamacare cost the US taxpayer? Oh right. $50 million. On useless and pointless symbolic votes. Money well spent, eh? I'm waiting for your outrage. Still waiting.

But then, Rs do have more pressing concerns.

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012...tions-takeover

At least the Dems are trying not to be completely insane. The Rs seem to revel in it.
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What exactly is the scandal here, btw?
Probably nothing. Don't worry about it.

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You know that's crap and yet you keep repeating it.
Really? Which part?

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Anyway, how much have those 33 votes on Obamacare cost the US taxpayer? Oh right. $50 million.
50 million to potentially save another trillion dollar public expense? Meh.
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  #5154  
Old 11-16-12, 21:05
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Originally Posted by VeloCity View Post
Perhaps Hostess' hedge-fund CEO shouldn't have been given a 300% raise while the company was asking workers to accept pay cuts? Maybe, just maybe, they shouldn't have given top execs 80% raises and then-CEO Driscoll a $3 million compensation package when Hostess was in bankruptcy last year? Just a thought.

This is the third time in the past decade that Hostess has filed for bankrupcty. That's bad management, not striking workers or unions.
Executive compensation aside, 18,500 union workers are now unemployed.

Some maths may be in order. Let's say the average worker is making $15.00 an hour (they are union, so you know that's low). Assuming no overtime, the base pay for the workforce is around $277,000 an hour. In one eight hour shift that's $2.22 million. This is not counting employer payroll taxes which is a little over 6% ($133,000+ per day), health insurance premiums (who knows?), retirement contributions, etc.

So somewhere between $2.5 million and $3 million a day in payroll.

Yeah that CEO's parachute is what sunk 'em.
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  #5155  
Old 11-16-12, 21:08
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Originally Posted by fatandfast View Post
why don't the old blue hairs just admit that they are going to do whatever it takes to make John Kerry the Sec of State. Why do they have to doormat some woman that is obviously,able, intelligent but not who they want.

John McCain, I never thought you would act like a punk,big unpleasant surprise.
Yep. The Admin set her up to be tore apart.

Good thing they are so woman friendly.
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  #5156  
Old 11-16-12, 21:13
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Originally Posted by Alpe d'Huez View Post
I would argue it's both to some degree at this point in time, and not objective for anyone to assume it was entirely one or the other.

The union workers however will face a much harder landing than the top executives who have parachutes to stop their fall.
I actually feel bad for those workers. Union leadership has screwed them yet again.

EDIT:

Quote:
A new White House petition wants President Obama to nationalize the "Twinkie industry," saving the popular junk food from possible extinction.

"We the undersigned, hereby request Barack Obama to immediately Nationalize the Twinkie industry and prevent our nation from losing her sweet creamy center," a petition on the White House "We the People" website requests.
Hope is not lost.

http://www.politico.com/politico44/2...es-149789.html
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Last edited by Scott SoCal; 11-16-12 at 21:35.
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  #5157  
Old 11-17-12, 01:02
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  #5158  
Old 11-17-12, 13:37
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I offer the following from FB for what it's worth (sn igger) - the wingnuts have finally gotten to the bottom of 'Benghazi'.

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According to sources in the State Department and the CIA, and intercepted communications from the Muslim Brotherhood, Obama "staged" the attack in Benghazi in order to create a monumental "October Surprise" that would guarantee him re-election.

Yes, you read that right, and no, I'm not making this up. Obama, we now know, is and has been working with the Muslim Brotherhood secretly to engineer the release of the "Blind Sheik," Omar Abdel Rahman, the mastermind behind the 1993 World Trade Center attack.

In Obama's October Surprise, he intentionally set up the consulate to have no security so that Chris Stevens could be kidnapped, and held for ransom by Al-Qaeda (and the Muslim Brotherhood). Then, several days before the election, the plan was to trade Chris Stevens for the Blind Sheik, making himself look like a hero, and all but guaranteeing re-election.

This was one of the top reasons why Obama was so insistent on the Muslim Brotherhood getting $1.2 Billion in U.S. Aid. They were to have a primary role in getting Obama re-elected. That is why, even though they knew days before the attack that it was going to occur, no effort was made to bolster security. It was intended to be non-existent. The Libyan security forces were intended to quietly slip into the night when the attack began. And they did, just as planned. That is why, even though 2 C-130U gunships, which were built SPECIFICALLY for this kind of attack, and which could have saved the lives of our people there and were a mere 45 minutes away, were never scrambled at any time during the attack.

There was to be no resistance whatsoever. That is why there were not one, but TWO armed drones flying over the consulate during the conflagration... our CIA operatives on the ground were painting targets because they knew air cover was available. That is why, even though requesting support and backup three times, their requests were NOT ignored, but were intentionally, specifically DENIED three times, and they were told to "stand down," which basically means to "surrender." That was part of Obama's plan.

They were not to fight back. That would potentially undermine the kidnapping effort and cause unnecessary "complications." That is why, even though the CIA operatives and ex-Navy Seals were on the ground, providing real-time reports, and even though they were "lighting up" the source of the mortars attacking the compound with lasers, no gunships or support ever came. They weren't supposed to resist.

That wasn't "part of the plan." It also wasn't part of the plan for one of the CIA operatives to intentionally defy Obama's orders, and who rescued the body of Sean Smith and then stood up again orders, and engaged the enemy who was attacking American soil. It was supposed to be "clean." Quick. Efficient.

Kidnap the Ambassador and get out. Then Save The Day in the "nick of time." They didn't factor in a tiny group of highly trained ex-Navy Seals/CIA operatives... American Patriots and heroes. Even though they eventually lost their lives in the firefight, they managed to employ the full measure of their skills, and took out over 80 attackers in the process... which enraged the attackers, who were led to believe that they would encounter no resistance.

THAT is why Ambassador Stevens was raped (sodomized), murdered, and dragged through the streets. In their warped minds, they believed that they had been betrayed by the U.S. yet again. They believed that Obama was their friend. They believed that they were going to get their beloved Blind Sheik back. And yet, here were 80 of their own... dead by American hands.

Obama was asked directly in an interview if he denied their request for assistance, he refused to answer, and instead droned on with a canned response promising to "bring those responsible to justice."

Former CIA and State Dept. personnel are coming out now with damning evidence that indicts President Obama, and reveals the truth about what is going on. Hillary Clinton, who is now openly laying the blame at the feet of the President, after falling on her sword in a premature show of loyalty for the Administration.

The "Video" defense was carefully crafted WEEKS in advance, to explain the attack. If this doesn't outrage you, If you are not moved enough to contact your congressman about this, you are not worthy of your citizenship.

Serenity is not Freedom from the Storm, but Peace with in it........ IGWT

M. D. McGranahan
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  #5159  
Old 11-17-12, 17:07
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Originally Posted by blutto View Post
...oh and that much maligned connection of rural areas to Wrong Wing voting...here is a little look-see...while not absolutely comprehensive gives a fine glimpse of some of the factors involved in that Wrong Wing/rural love thang...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Surprise!

Just as the Romney class conveniently forgets that they are recipients of federal giveaways, many farmers also have a convenient memory. They just hate the 47% types of people who can’t get enough of those federal tax dollars but hey, it’s completely different when it’s them who are receiving the cash.

It’s not just Red State Socialism that is popular, but Red County Socialism as well. And then there’s Corporate Socialism, CEO Socialism, Wall Street Socialism, Big Oil Socialism and well, you get the picture.

Much like Texas asking to secede, the freeloading farmers who voted for Romney can also turn in their citizenship any time they like. Just pay back what you received and we can call it a day.

Mmmm, smells like hypocrisy:

The BGOV Barometer shows nine of the 10 counties collecting the most in farm subsidies last year backed Romney, with Stoddard County, a rice, corn and cotton producer in southeast Missouri, voting for the Republican over President Barack Obama by the biggest margin, almost three-to-one. Farmers there got $13.5 million in farm subsidies in 2011, ranking seventh on the list.“Farmers vote Republican but they like Democratic programs,” said former Representative Charles Stenholm of Texas, who served as the top Democrat on the House Agriculture Committee while in office and is now a lobbyist. “They consider themselves to be conservative, and if something is important to them, then they don’t consider that liberal.”

Of the top 10, only majority-black Bolivar County, Mississippi, supported Obama. Bolivar County, in the state’s rural Delta region, took in $13.6 million in farm aid in 2011. Seven other counties — four in Arkansas, two in California, and one in Texas — gave Romney at least 60 percent of the vote, according to an analysis of election data and agricultural subsidies. Whitman County, Washington, also favored Romney, though only by a 50-47 percent margin with about 5 percent of the vote left to count
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Cheers

blutto
That's right the rabid right-wing cries socialism with federal spending when it has anything to do with public wellbeing and meeting people's needs, because God forbid my money gets spent on anything but me. Here I'm reminded of something I recently read in a daily about what a republican said in regards to why he doesn't feel he should have to contribute to the financing of public education with his taxes, since he doesn't "have any children in school." On that line of thinking, one presumes his reasoning behind why he would never want his taxes to be spent on universal medical care is because "he doesn't yet have a tumor."

The moment, however, their financial interests are hurt, as we saw with Wall Street debacle; well then they immediately become the most fervent socialists: by making sure the government has the people foot the bill for their insolvency and profit losses. The hypocrisy and selfishness of these conservatives is naturally appalling. The worst thing that their neoliberal ideology has disseminated in our epoch, has been the by now engrained materialist philosophy, if that's indeed what it can be called, which proclaims the only person that exists is me. While they make no scruples in taking short-term advantage of the system either with things like hedge funds, to make gobs of cash that they keep in the world's various fiscal paradises, until the moment when their high risk financial practices exploded in a fatal catastrophe that caused the emergence of an epochal rupture we are just beginning to aprehend. They are then unfazed by this fact: namely, that they were the main cause of the latest crisis in capitalism, which the public has been made to refinance and without compunction are even self-appreciative when stealing from society in holding large income revenues off-shore that aren't being taxed. In the end they even, perhaps, complain about how the pittance, relative to their actual earnings, that they pay over to the state is being spent on financing things like public schools, because they personally have no children in them!

Do these folks even have a shred of decency. I think not. They are merely despicable and so quite naturally deserve to be looked at with the contempt that has been recently shown them by movements like Occupy Wall Street. Conservatives of late, because under the leadership of the most reprehensible ideologues, can't be reasoned with either, nor should they be. The only thing they should be dealt is hostility and untoward resistance. It has unfortunately come to this point. They have been f-ing society over for decades now, while leading the country, and the whole world, into the deplorable social state at which it has arrived of late. They even have the gall to accuse the left of instigating a "social war," when they have been fighting the most ferocious and lethal war against society since Reagan; with the result that in no other time in the country's history has there been such an appalling and anti-egalitarian difference between the rich and the middle class-poor. In no other time in the country's existence has wealth, in the interests of which their party has exclusively operated, had such a devastating effect on the rest of the society. While they will stop at nothing less than owning it all with their universal privatization aims. Not content with having just 80% of the state's wealth, they continue to lobby and force policies that will ensure 100% ownership if left unchecked.

Lastly, as if this were not enough, and to your original point, many a very wealthy and conservative farmer (who really often is just a corporate investment speculator) is often paid by the federal government millions not to grow crops, to keep the prices high. If food consumption were not bound by the logic of profit and the laws of capitalism, enough would be grown and produced to feed the whole world in an instant. Thus poverty at the starvation level would have been eliminated by now, if only those that control the economy, largely conservatives, would simply allow what’s right for mankind to take place and not what’s right for their own profit interests. Of course the government should outlaw this practice, but is instead its principal financier, which naturally is perverse especially in a democracy that professes to fight for liberty and endorses a "humanitarian" agenda.

Last edited by rhubroma; 11-17-12 at 23:47.
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  #5160  
Old 11-17-12, 17:21
fatandfast fatandfast is offline
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lSil...eature=related
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