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  #5171  
Old 11-18-12, 11:36
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rhubroma rhubroma is offline
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...so let me get this straight...you don't want to keep this Platonic but you're hot for me to go to Rome....geez what kind of floozie do you take me for?...or are you saying that you are already in Rome and you want me to head over?...man, this is getting weird....

...that nonsense aside it would be a hoot to see the look on Rhub's face if we actually showed up at his place in the middle of the night drunk as skunks and demanding to discuss politics...like right now!!....who do you think we should bring in to act as a bouncer...errr...moderator?

Cheers

blutto
That's positively Bernhard-ian in description. Being drunk and dicussing politics is a very dangerous proposition. At least for moi.
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  #5172  
Old 11-18-12, 16:15
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...so let me get this straight...you don't want to keep this Platonic but you're hot for me to go to Rome....geez what kind of floozie do you take me for?...or are you saying that you are already in Rome and you want me to head over?...man, this is getting weird....

...that nonsense aside it would be a hoot to see the look on Rhub's face if we actually showed up at his place in the middle of the night drunk as skunks and demanding to discuss politics...like right now!!....who do you think we should bring in to act as a bouncer...errr...moderator?

Cheers

blutto
i don't think you could go wrong with Glenn Wilson as your moderator
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  #5173  
Old 11-19-12, 15:07
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Glenn_Wilson Glenn_Wilson is offline
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...inspired choice!..though methinks a moderating team may be more appropriate...so I would suggest inviting the estemmed Mr Hammer who I believe would provide a magnificant measure of moderating maturity and also bring much needed humour to the proceedings...and yeah SoCal's mom thought he was funny...well, my mom thought I was a riot...and we all know the reality there...bottom line we desperately need humour...otherwise we risk massive destruction of Rhub's digs...

...looks like we got the makings of a grand stonkin party...now all we have to do is make sure the truck delivering the booze makes it to Rhub's place ok ( like I hope he doesn't live on one of those tiny Italian streets..because that is a big truck....all necessary because we got lots to talk about...)...and oh yeah does anyone in Rome do good pizza?....

Cheers

blutto
Pizza does pose a serious problem.

The booze truck I can help out with that. The streets might be narrow but we can find a way to manage.

Hurt just a little that you would chose the maturity and clarity of Amsterhammer over myself. It is all confusing to me.
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  #5174  
Old 11-19-12, 15:08
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That's right the rabid right-wing cries socialism with federal spending when it has anything to do with public wellbeing and meeting people's needs, because God forbid my money gets spent on anything but me. Here I'm reminded of something I recently read in a daily about what a republican said in regards to why he doesn't feel he should have to contribute to the financing of public education with his taxes, since he doesn't "have any children in school." On that line of thinking, one presumes his reasoning behind why he would never want his taxes to be spent on universal medical care is because "he doesn't yet have a tumor."

The moment, however, their financial interests are hurt, as we saw with Wall Street debacle; well then they immediately become the most fervent socialists: by making sure the government has the people foot the bill for their insolvency and profit losses. The hypocrisy and selfishness of these conservatives is naturally appalling. The worst thing that their neoliberal ideology has disseminated in our epoch, has been the by now engrained materialist philosophy, if that's indeed what it can be called, which proclaims the only person that exists is me. While they make no scruples in taking short-term advantage of the system either with things like hedge funds, to make gobs of cash that they keep in the world's various fiscal paradises, until the moment when their high risk financial practices exploded in a fatal catastrophe that caused the emergence of an epochal rupture we are just beginning to aprehend. They are then unfazed by this fact: namely, that they were the main cause of the latest crisis in capitalism, which the public has been made to refinance and without compunction are even self-appreciative when stealing from society in holding large income revenues off-shore that aren't being taxed. In the end they even, perhaps, complain about how the pittance, relative to their actual earnings, that they pay over to the state is being spent on financing things like public schools, because they personally have no children in them!

Do these folks even have a shred of decency. I think not. They are merely despicable and so quite naturally deserve to be looked at with the contempt that has been recently shown them by movements like Occupy Wall Street. Conservatives of late, because under the leadership of the most reprehensible ideologues, can't be reasoned with either, nor should they be. The only thing they should be dealt is hostility and untoward resistance. It has unfortunately come to this point. They have been f-ing society over for decades now, while leading the country, and the whole world, into the deplorable social state at which it has arrived of late. They even have the gall to accuse the left of instigating a "social war," when they have been fighting the most ferocious and lethal war against society since Reagan; with the result that in no other time in the country's history has there been such an appalling and anti-egalitarian difference between the rich and the middle class-poor. In no other time in the country's existence has wealth, in the interests of which their party has exclusively operated, had such a devastating effect on the rest of the society. While they will stop at nothing less than owning it all with their universal privatization aims. Not content with having just 80% of the state's wealth, they continue to lobby and force policies that will ensure 100% ownership if left unchecked.

Lastly, as if this were not enough, and to your original point, many a very wealthy and conservative farmer (who really often is just a corporate investment speculator) is often paid by the federal government millions not to grow crops, to keep the prices high. If food consumption were not bound by the logic of profit and the laws of capitalism, enough would be grown and produced to feed the whole world in an instant. Thus poverty at the starvation level would have been eliminated by now, if only those that control the economy, largely conservatives, would simply allow what’s right for mankind to take place and not what’s right for their own profit interests. Of course the government should outlaw this practice, but is instead its principal financier, which naturally is perverse especially in a democracy that professes to fight for liberty and endorses a "humanitarian" agenda.
cool story bro.

You forgot the double p in "aprehend".
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Last edited by Glenn_Wilson; 11-19-12 at 15:15.
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  #5175  
Old 11-19-12, 15:27
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prolly not Scott...but the alternative of maybe 4 bucks an hour and no benefits ala china wouldnt have saved em either...perhaps your side should just be honest and forward the idea of bringing back slavery...think about it...housing, some food, and some lame doctor pretending to be on call...lots of folks will fall for it...and then you might get profits...not much, but enough to justify your ideology for abit longer...
That is really what everyone on the right is looking for isn't it? The right wants to have slaves and I guess they would not even feed them either. I am surprised it took you this long to realize what it was that the right was crafting behind our backs. Me I have been keyed in for the long term.

But why stop there. The right want women to not be ****s and ho's either. They want them all to be locked up in a safe house somewhere so they cant "do it". They even had doctors to sign off on stapling the things shut. No entrance if you will.

The other problem is that they want to start another 4 or 6 wars. They stopped at 2 in the last 8 years and have been steaming ever since not to get their chance at North Korea, Iran, Syria, Lebanon, Yemen, all of North Africa, Mylasia, China and Vietnam.

Lendon B Johnsons cousins have been on constant conference calls with George W. and the rest of the Bush's. They have devised a plan that would overthrow President Obama and place Ross Perot as the dictator of the united states. That is when the real slavery begins.
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  #5176  
Old 11-19-12, 15:51
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When you have a little better understanding of exactly how the unions were F'ing over that company then maybe you can contribute something worthwhile.
When you have a little better understanding of exactly how that company was f'ing over the unions then maybe you can contribute something worthwhile.

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Hostess was able to exit bankruptcy in 2009 for three reasons. The first was Ripplewood's equity infusion of $130 million in return for control of the company (it currently owns about two-thirds of the equity). The second reason: substantial concessions by the two big unions. Annual labor cost savings to the company were about $110 million; thousands of union members lost their jobs.
And what was management doing at the time of those "substantial concessions by the two big unions"? ****ing up some more.

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Thus, at the end of the first bankruptcy, Hostess came away not only with concessions from both lenders and unions but with $490 million of fresh capital ($360 million plus Ripplewood's $130 million) -- and Ripplewood's presumed hands-on operational expertise. Ripplewood had kept the CEO who had led Hostess during bankruptcy, Craig Jung, a longtime veteran from Pepsi (PEP). Then Jung left in June 2010 and was replaced by Brian Driscoll, 53, who had held senior positions at Kraft (KFT), Nabisco, Nestlé USA, and Procter & Gamble (PG). The financiers behind Hostess anticipated that these changes would lead to "profitability and long-term sustainability," as one put it. It looked, in short, like a bankruptcy success story -- a model of how Chapter 11 is supposed to work. What could possibly go wrong? Management promised to turn around the company's fortunes through innovation and workplace efficiency. It tried a limited-edition return of original banana-cream Twinkies and published The Twinkies Cookbook, which included such half-baked epicurean delights as Twinkie Sushi and Pigs in a Twinkie. But ancient delivery trucks and plant equipment didn't get replaced. The company's pricing often didn't keep pace with that of competitors. And Hostess still had ludicrous work rules: The Teamsters had separate drivers for deliveries of such goodies as Yankee Doodles and Nature's Pride Nutty Oat. (Of course this jobs-preserving work rule was agreed to by Hostess in the last labor negotiation.) Worse, as the company tried to reinvent itself in 2009 and 2010, external currents were running against it. The Great Recession hurt many consumer brands generally, and the prices of the commodities that Hostess relied on -- corn, sugar, flour -- went up, which is the opposite of what's supposed to happen in a downturn. In addition, the bakery industry underwent more consolidation when Sara Lee sold out to Bimbo.

By late 2011, Hostess was getting, well, creamed. Its sales last year -- $2.5 billion -- were down about 11% from 2008 and down 28% from 2004. (Twinkies remain the best individual seller -- 323 million of them in the 52-week period ending June 29, give or take a splurt.) Overall, Hostess lost $341 million in fiscal 2011, 2½ times the loss of the prior year -- and by early 2012, primarily because of burgeoning interest obligations, its debt had grown to about $860 million.

As revenue declined, the company continued to burn cash -- in the second half of 2011, the rate was $2 million a week. The liquidity crunch forced Ripplewood in the early spring of 2011 to pump in $40 million more in return for more equity as well as debt that was subordinate to that held by Silver Point and Monarch. In August -- to save a company teetering on the edge of fiscal calamity and forced liquidation -- Silver Point, Monarch, and the group of other lenders put up an additional $30 million to see if a negotiated turnaround was possible.

They turned to the unions and demanded new concessions. But the unions, having three years earlier given up thousands of jobs and millions in benefits, flatly refused.
http://management.fortune.cnn.com/20...kies-bankrupt/

It wasn't the unions, dude. They bent over backward.
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  #5177  
Old 11-19-12, 15:56
mikeNphilly mikeNphilly is offline
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It was neither the stupid unions or the bad CEO's, is was the consumer that decided they were not buying any more of their junk.
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  #5178  
Old 11-19-12, 15:59
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It was neither the stupid unions or the bad CEO's, is was the consumer that decided they were not buying any more of their junk.
Similar "junk food" companies are doing just fine, granted partly because they evolved and expanded to meet changing consumer demand. Hostess didn't. It's more profitable to the hedge fund managers that now run it that it be dismantled and the pieces sold off than to invest in upgrading the company.
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  #5179  
Old 11-19-12, 17:27
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...no...no...no...either I mis-wrote or you mis-read but it was decided by the powers on high that a moderating TEAM ( which would consist of both yourself and Mr Hammer ) could better handle the chaos....and as an added bonus it would give parts of the team time to take a break, drink their faces off and participate in a ground breaking discussion in which all of the world's problems would be solved ( ...I mean Mr Hammer's maturity and clarity and your...errr...award winning Glenn-ness could prove essential to smoothing over any inevitible theoretical log-jams...)

...remember that I did call your nomination inspired!...so off with you...go pack your bags...oh and please leave the 50cal at home, those TSA guys often are kinda humourless and may kick up a fuss, and besides, we have a crack security detail already in place ( who according to the ad also deliver pizza so we are covered for every possible eventuality )...

Cheers

blutto
my bad blutto. TEAMing up with Amsterhammer sounds great for me. Not sure he would feel the same way.

No 50cals No problem I will just have to leave all my weapons behind. It is going to feel terrible but I will do it in the name of negotiations.
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  #5180  
Old 11-19-12, 17:39
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Similar "junk food" companies are doing just fine, granted partly because they evolved and expanded to meet changing consumer demand. Hostess didn't. It's more profitable to the hedge fund managers that now run it that it be dismantled and the pieces sold off than to invest in upgrading the company.
It's no Wonder these Ding Dongs have faced two Zingers. This is only going to Sno Ball
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