Sky/Froome Talk Only (No Way Sky Are Cleans?) - Page 67 - Cyclingnews Forum

Go Back   Cyclingnews Forum > Road > The Clinic

The Clinic The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #661  
Old 11-26-12, 16:57
will10's Avatar
will10 will10 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 5,992
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcat View Post
see the Queen Stage. climbing at the final HC ascent with heads of state.

Chronos very impressive.
I have a Tour 2008 DVD and I I may be mistaken but I honestly don't think Froome appears on it at all. Trying to sell us his 2011/2012 seasons off the back of his 2008 Tour is laughable.
__________________
Quote:
...[Walsh] thinks we're ahead of the curve. But think about it for a sec. We're building long-lasting, trusting relationships with people who are spending a lot of money - Coke, Nike, Subaru. If we're f***ing lying, we can kiss it all goodbye. And if we were lying we'd do some stupid stuff to try to cover it up, wouldn't we? Does anybody think for a second that a secret that big wouldn't come out? Bill Stapleton

Last edited by will10; 11-26-12 at 17:01.
Reply With Quote
  #662  
Old 11-26-12, 17:33
thehog's Avatar
thehog thehog is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 14,912
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by will10 View Post
I have a Tour 2008 DVD and I I may be mistaken but I honestly don't think Froome appears on it at all. Trying to sell us his 2011/2012 seasons off the back of his 2008 Tour is laughable.
Sadly it appears many are trying to pass it off along with some obscure U23 race in Italy.

Like Liberty says. If Froome was Spanish he’d be called out by one and all as a fraud.
Reply With Quote
  #663  
Old 11-26-12, 18:22
Mellow Velo's Avatar
Mellow Velo Mellow Velo is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 9,424
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by will10 View Post
I have a Tour 2008 DVD and I I may be mistaken but I honestly don't think Froome appears on it at all. Trying to sell us his 2011/2012 seasons off the back of his 2008 Tour is laughable.
Funny you should bring this up.
I've got all of Eurosport's 2008 TDF coverage archived to DVD
which shows quite a bit of Froome riding towards the head of the bunch on all the climbs....................
..........until CSC put the hammer down and then he quickly disappears.

Taking of ET moments, the 2008 most "unbelievable" award must go to Fabian Cancellara, who pulls for most of the Croix de Fer, into a headwind, decimates the contenders group and takes back biggest part of 10 minutes on the break, all on his lonesome.


Quote:
Originally Posted by thehog View Post
Sadly it appears many are trying to pass it off along with some obscure U23 race in Italy.
You really would be better off trying to get over your rather embarrassing mistake over that race, instead of bringing it back up.
Even some of your "supporters" thought you were being silly.
__________________
They use thought only to justify their injustices, and speech only to disguise their thoughts. Voltaire
Reply With Quote
  #664  
Old 11-26-12, 18:25
thehog's Avatar
thehog thehog is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 14,912
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mellow Velo View Post
You really would be better off trying to get over your rather embarrassing mistake over that race, instead of bringing it back up. Even some of your "supporters" thought you were being silly.
Spin it anyway you like but I'm the only one here who knew it was an U23. Froome19 passing it off as some mainstrram ProRace! LOL!

I'm sure there's a race thread on said race?
Reply With Quote
  #665  
Old 11-26-12, 18:40
Mellow Velo's Avatar
Mellow Velo Mellow Velo is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 9,424
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thehog View Post
Spin it anyway you like but I'm the only one here who knew it was an U23. Froome19 passing it off as some mainstrram ProRace! LOL!

I'm sure there's a race thread on said race?
You are the one spinning......or, actually lying in this case.
Blackcat and I know the race well.
You, on the other hand, clearly knew nothing about it.

I remember Simon Clarke in his Aussie U23 RR champs jersey either in the break, or on the attack, in every stage of the 2008 edition.

If necessary, I'm sure some of our Italian posters in the RR section can confirm this.
Not something you can google and find on wiki.
__________________
They use thought only to justify their injustices, and speech only to disguise their thoughts. Voltaire
Reply With Quote
  #666  
Old 11-26-12, 18:48
thehog's Avatar
thehog thehog is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 14,912
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mellow Velo View Post
You are the one spinning......or, actually lying in this case.
Blackcat and I know the race well.
You, on the other hand, clearly knew nothing about it.

I remember Simon Clarke in his Aussie U23 RR champs jersey either in the break, or on the attack, in every stage of the 2008 edition.

If necessary, I'm sure some of our Italian posters in the RR section can confirm this.
Not something you can google and find on wiki.
So you and Blackcat speak for one and all?

Also it doesn’t matter if I knew about the race or not. I’m not the one trying to pass it off as the future symbol of clean cycling GT champions!

If you thought it was such an amazing race and you never miss it then why is it only now you mention it? Surely you’d be posting some updates in the Race thread? Or some info on some up and coming riders?

Or is just convenient that it fits into the Froome clean story that you know all about it.

Sorry I’m not buying it. You’re over selling the story and using this race as an excuse.

Sorry.
Reply With Quote
  #667  
Old 11-26-12, 19:05
Mellow Velo's Avatar
Mellow Velo Mellow Velo is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 9,424
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thehog View Post
So you and Blackcat speak for one and all?

Also it doesn’t matter if I knew about the race or not. I’m not the one trying to pass it off as the future symbol of clean cycling GT champions!

If you thought it was such an amazing race and you never miss it then why is it only now you mention it? Surely you’d be posting some updates in the Race thread? Or some info on some up and coming riders?

Or is just convenient that it fits into the Froome clean story that you know all about it.

Sorry I’m not buying it. You’re over selling the story and using this race as an excuse.

Sorry.

Of course, you do speak for one and all.

Trouble is Hog, you insist on winning all the battles as well as the war.

I haven't disagreed with you over Froome's rapid rise.

I have merely pointed out that you were in error over this race,
as I did over the Tenerife-Ferrari-Wiggins connection, due to timeline
"inconsistencies".
When you dig your then heels in, having lost a just a segment of the overall debate, it impacts upon your creditability.
Given that the material you are working with is thin on the ground, credibility becomes paramount.
Lose that and you come across a bit of a crank.
You are well on your way.

Anyhow, I'm done wasting my time, so I'll leave you to have the inevitable final word.
__________________
They use thought only to justify their injustices, and speech only to disguise their thoughts. Voltaire
Reply With Quote
  #668  
Old 11-26-12, 19:31
andy1234 andy1234 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,392
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thehog View Post
Sadly it appears many are trying to pass it off along with some obscure U23 race in Italy.

Like Liberty says. If Froome was Spanish he’d be called out by one and all as a fraud.
You claim to have lived in Italy, yet describe the Regione as provincial and obscure?
I take it you didn't follow cycling at the time?

The more you talk the more it smells of Bull$***.

Froome may be suspect, but you are clearly not the man to provide the case against him.
Reply With Quote
  #669  
Old 11-26-12, 20:03
Libertine Seguros's Avatar
Libertine Seguros Libertine Seguros is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Land of Saz
Posts: 14,116
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcat View Post
see the Queen Stage. climbing at the final HC ascent with heads of state.

Chronos very impressive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by will10 View Post
I have a Tour 2008 DVD and I I may be mistaken but I honestly don't think Froome appears on it at all. Trying to sell us his 2011/2012 seasons off the back of his 2008 Tour is laughable.
Froome did get in the break that day and do a decent job over the two major HC climbs earlier in the stage. However, while blackcat is correct that he got to the final HC ascent with the heads of state after the break was caught, the way he states it is a bit misleading. Froome was dropped around about the same time as Johan van Summeren. His 2008 Tour was not as impressive as, say, Urán's Tour at the same age a year later, when he was in key breaks and moves several days in the final week. Though Froome can argue that a) the 2009 route was softer, and b) he had less experience of the pro péloton, to counter that.

Froome at the 2008 Tour showed that he had the potential to be a decent pro level rider. Claiming it showed anything more is to exaggerate the significance of those rides. They show that he perhaps had more potential than he achieved in the 2009-11 period, sure, but I don't see "GT winner" there any more than I see a very raw prospect. I would have liked to have seen something a bit more directly noticeable before I would be willing to call him anything special, for sure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thehog View Post
Or is just convenient that it fits into the Froome clean story that you know all about it.

Sorry I’m not buying it. You’re over selling the story and using this race as an excuse.

Sorry.
Even Blackcat isn't saying Froome's clean. Blackcat is saying that Froome is legitimately a talented rider. I've been through this with him a few times. We seem to concur that Froome is doping (like most of the other contenders), but where we differ is that Blackcat thinks he's a Carl Lewis-style natural talent who would have risen to the top clean or dirty, and I think he's a Ben Johnson-style chemically created alien. I respect the difference.
__________________
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrFiUlhAPes

Forever tte de la course.
Reply With Quote
  #670  
Old 11-26-12, 20:15
thehog's Avatar
thehog thehog is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 14,912
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Libertine Seguros View Post
We seem to concur that Froome is doping (like most of the other contenders), but where we differ is that Blackcat thinks he's a Carl Lewis-style natural talent who would have risen to the top clean or dirty, and I think he's a Ben Johnson-style chemically created alien. I respect the difference.
You're saying "alian", Blackcat is saying "E.T."

I can understand how people want more proof that Froome is doping. But I don't think he deserves to be labeled "clean". He's a long way from that!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 18:26.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2006 - 2009 Future Publishing Limited. All rights reserved. Future Publishing Limited is part of the Future plc group. Future Publishing Limited is a company registered in England and Wales with company registration number 2008885 whose registered office is at Beauford Court 30 Monmouth Street Bath, UK BA1 2BW England.