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View Poll Results: Better Cobblestone rider: Boonen or Cancellara?
Boonen 76 52.05%
Cancellara 70 47.95%
Voters: 146. You may not vote on this poll

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  #241  
Old 12-11-12, 01:27
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Originally Posted by trompe le monde View Post
You're not very good at reading last sentences. I won't convince you, you won't convince me. If Roger De Vlaeminck can think that Boonen's wins at Paris-Roubaix were third rate, I can think he's not the bees knees too. And De Vlaeminck knows more about cycling then I ever will.
He knows a lot about cycling from the '70s and '80s yes. Roger de Vlaeminck can be right about some things, but concerning Boonen the guy is biased. Still ****-hurt about his record being broken.

I'm not trying to convince you, but don't complain when someone reacts to your statements on a discussion forum. Strange attitude you have, not fighting back when someone attacks your standpoint.

Cancellara hasn't won a decent race since 2010, so I guess that makes him irrelevant altogether. Not my logic, but yours.
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Originally Posted by Ryo Hazuki View Post
horrible. boonen just the same guy as years before and this course is too hard for him. that's why he rode like a coward there were at least 3 guys stronger than boonen today and none of them won: sagan, ballan, pozzato
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hitch
Goss will woop boonens candy ass in a sprint he cares about, any day of the week

Last edited by El Pistolero; 12-11-12 at 01:32.
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  #242  
Old 12-11-12, 01:33
trompe le monde trompe le monde is offline
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Originally Posted by El Pistolero View Post
Cancellara hasn't won a fancy time trial since 2010, so is that also irrelevant now?

What on earth has Cancellara competing somewhere to do with the fact that Boonen won a race on a hilly terrain against a much better cyclist than Cancellara?

Boonen actually won the WC road race, not just failed in it.

What you call "hibernating" is called not being able to race because of injuries in 2010-2011 after the spring classics. I guess Cancellara was just hibernating this year and only raced for one day this year. And crashed.

Perfect logic mate. If Boonen was Suisse he maybe could've won the Tour de Suisse as well. But alas, no important stage races to be fixed in Belgium.
? Boonen could win the Tour de Suisse if he wanted to, its open to any nationality. Being champion of Belgium is only open to Belgians. Where is the illogic in mentioning that citing a race that Cancellara can't by all rights compete in irrelevent?

I find your use of logic to be, well, illogical.

But this is really a digression from the topic. I won't say anymore.

Back to the topic of the cobbles.
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  #243  
Old 12-11-12, 01:37
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? Boonen could win the Tour de Suisse if he wanted to, its open to any nationality. Being champion of Belgium is only open to Belgians. Where is the illogic in mentioning that citing a race that Cancellara can't by all rights compete in irrelevent?

I find your use of logic to be, well, illogical.

But this is really a digression from the topic. I won't say anymore.

Back to the topic of the cobbles.
Tour de Suisse route had no mountains in it just so Cancellara could win his home Tour. A mountainous country with no mountains in its national Tour... I hope you're not that naive.

You were the one saying Boonen only performed in the cobbled classics, so don't moan when I give you evidence he doesn't. And that includes the Belgian Championship. Which takes place in June, without cobbles. Enough logic for you?

By your logic the discussion is closed because Cancellara is irrelevant on cobbles. Remember, didn't win an important race since 2010.
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Originally Posted by Ryo Hazuki View Post
horrible. boonen just the same guy as years before and this course is too hard for him. that's why he rode like a coward there were at least 3 guys stronger than boonen today and none of them won: sagan, ballan, pozzato
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hitch
Goss will woop boonens candy ass in a sprint he cares about, any day of the week

Last edited by El Pistolero; 12-11-12 at 01:41.
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  #244  
Old 12-11-12, 01:40
trompe le monde trompe le monde is offline
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He knows a lot about cycling from the '70s and '80s yes. Roger de Vlaeminck can be right about some things, but concerning Boonen the guy is biased. Still ****-hurt about his record being broken.

I'm not trying to convince you, but don't complain when someone reacts to your statements on a discussion forum. Strange attitude you have, not fighting back when someone attacks your standpoint.

Cancellara hasn't won a decent race since 2010, so I guess that makes him irrelevant altogether. Not my logic, but yours.

Okay, honestly, last post on this.

But why should I fight back? Is the internet really an electronic forum where people spar until someone relents? Should I try and beat someone down to a verbal pulp until they take my side? Is this what participating in a forum is all about?

People have different opinions. I can accept that. Isn't one of the points of being able to discuss something also the ability to tolerate other people's opinions?

Sure, I may have worded my dislike of Boonen strongly, but I'm not here to convince anyone to be pro-Cancellara. Again, you have your opinion and I have mine.
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  #245  
Old 12-11-12, 01:53
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Originally Posted by trompe le monde View Post
Okay, honestly, last post on this.

But why should I fight back? Is the internet really an electronic forum where people spar until someone relents? Should I try and beat someone down to a verbal pulp until they take my side? Is this what participating in a forum is all about?

People have different opinions. I can accept that. Isn't one of the points of being able to discuss something also the ability to tolerate other people's opinions?

Sure, I may have worded my dislike of Boonen strongly, but I'm not here to convince anyone to be pro-Cancellara. Again, you have your opinion and I have mine.
Don't act surprised when you get reactions to your strongly worded opinions, you were probably bating for them as well. There's such a thing as being too tolerant by the way, so grow a pair and defend your opinion!

It just so happens to be that my opinion is that your opinion is bogus.

You said Boonen only rides for 8 days a year, but now you're unable to stand by that. Ok, whatever.

When someone makes a racial comment do you also say "you have your opinion and I have mine"? Just curious.
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Originally Posted by Ryo Hazuki View Post
horrible. boonen just the same guy as years before and this course is too hard for him. that's why he rode like a coward there were at least 3 guys stronger than boonen today and none of them won: sagan, ballan, pozzato
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hitch
Goss will woop boonens candy ass in a sprint he cares about, any day of the week

Last edited by El Pistolero; 12-11-12 at 02:01.
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  #246  
Old 12-11-12, 01:57
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Originally Posted by trompe le monde View Post
Okay, honestly, last post on this.

But why should I fight back? Is the internet really an electronic forum where people spar until someone relents? Should I try and beat someone down to a verbal pulp until they take my side? Is this what participating in a forum is all about?

People have different opinions. I can accept that. Isn't one of the points of being able to discuss something also the ability to tolerate other people's opinions?

Sure, I may have worded my dislike of Boonen strongly, but I'm not here to convince anyone to be pro-Cancellara. Again, you have your opinion and I have mine.
Cats round here wants and feels the need to win an internet discussion, which can be hilarious and annoying for others.
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  #247  
Old 12-11-12, 02:06
trompe le monde trompe le monde is offline
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Originally Posted by El Pistolero View Post
Don't act surprised when you get reactions to your strongly worded opinions, you were probably bating for them as well. There's such a thing as being too tolerant by the way, so grow a pair and defend your opinion!

It just so happens to be that my opinion is that your opinion is bogus.

You said Boonen only rides for 8 days a year, but now you're unable to stand by that. Ok, whatever.
Who is acting surprised? I'm not surprised. Like I said from the beginning, your opinion is yours and mine is mine. There is no surprise there, as I know the outcome to your opinion and I would hope I know the outcome to mine.

Look, opinion is subjective. Different people can look at the same set of facts and come to different conclusions. Discussions such as this, Cancellar v Boonen v cobbles, can't be objectively determined like some logical calculus with only one correct conclusion. Sure there is room for discussion, but all the good points about Cancellara's prowess have been discussed, so I won't rehash them.

I still think that Boonen lives and dies for 8 days of the year, but I stand corrected. It's three weeks of the year. A quote from Boonen himself in this interview:

http://velonews.competitor.com/2007/...m-boonen_11870

'A failure for me would be to arrive to the most important three weeks of my season [northern classics] and you know in your mind you cannot win the races.'

So you're right, I was wrong to say 8 days. I should have said three weeks.
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Last edited by trompe le monde; 12-11-12 at 02:10.
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  #248  
Old 12-11-12, 02:08
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Originally Posted by trompe le monde View Post
Who is acting surprised? I'm not surprised. Like I said from the beginning, your opinion is yours and mine is mine. There is no surprise there, as I know the outcome to your opinion and I would hope I know the outcome to mine.

Look, opinion is subjective. Different people can look at the same set of facts and come to different conclusions. Discussions such as this, Cancellar v Boonen v cobbles, can't be objectively determined like some logical calculus with only one correct conclusion. Sure there is room for discussion, but all the good points about Cancellara's prowess have been discussed, so I won't rehash them.

I still think that Boonen lives and dies for 8 days of the year, but I stand corrected. It's three weeks of the year. A quote from Boonen himself in this interview:

http://velonews.competitor.com/2007/...m-boonen_11870

'A failure for me would be to arrive to the most important three weeks of my season [northern classics] and you know in your mind you cannot win the races.'

So your right, I was wrong to say 8 days. I should have said three weeks.
He said 3 most important weeks of his season, not the only 3 weeks. He has won more races than Cancellara outside March and April.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...Q8sQumrc#t=22s

Here's a nice example of a warm-up race in February(hey if you're counting Strade Bianche...)

And I must have imagined seeing Boonen train hard for the WC this year. I bet he was just pretending, that sly dog!

Oh and you said the WC TTT was irrelevant. That's just your opinion. Boonen considers it his biggest victory of the year actually...

Nothing wrong with a little discussion, so why do you feel the need to quit? I'm not insulting you personally, so relax. I just disagree with what you say. When you think Cancellara is better than Boonen I can accept that opinion, but when you say Boonen is nothing but a cobbled classic rider I'll strongly disagree with you. He was injured for most of 2010-2011, just like Cancellara was this year...
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Originally Posted by Ryo Hazuki View Post
horrible. boonen just the same guy as years before and this course is too hard for him. that's why he rode like a coward there were at least 3 guys stronger than boonen today and none of them won: sagan, ballan, pozzato
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hitch
Goss will woop boonens candy ass in a sprint he cares about, any day of the week

Last edited by El Pistolero; 12-11-12 at 02:35.
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  #249  
Old 12-11-12, 02:38
trompe le monde trompe le monde is offline
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Originally Posted by El Pistolero View Post
He said 3 most important weeks of his season, not the only 3 weeks. He has won more races than Cancellara outside March and April.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...Q8sQumrc#t=22s

Here's a nice example of a warm-up race in February(hey if you're counting Strade Bianche...)

And I must have imagined seeing Boonen train hard for the WC this year. I bet he was just pretending, that sly dog!

Nothing wrong with a little discussion, so why do you feel the need to quit? I'm not insulting you personally, so relax. I just disagree with what you say. When you think Cancellara is better than Boonen I can accept that opinion, but when you say Boonen is nothing but a cobbled classic rider I'll strongly disagree with you. He was injured for most of 2010-2011, just like Cancellara was this year..

I am strongly contradicting myself here, but I can ask you the opposite question: why do you feel the need to persist?

Why must I provide every nook and cranny to my opinion until I have exhausted it of any relevance?

It, my opinion, may be incorrect in your eyes, but so what? I live every day comfortable in the knowledge that I believe Boonen is less of a rider than Cancellara, and I have not suffered for it.

-begin scene

I have not been struck down by lightning bolts from an angry pro-Boonen Zeus, nor has my social status been in some way impinged by viewing Tomke with a furrowed brow and shaken fist. The hands of fate have not crushed me yet for my somewhat malignant anti-Boonen view and I do not think you are in a position to inform me that the winds of fate will soon change if I don't come over to the 'dark side'.

Not even if Nietzsche's Zarathustra, after spending those god awful years atop that mountain alone with no tv or Weekly World News to console him, were to descend from that lonesome hermitage to pronounce to the world 'It is Boonen, my friends, Boonen alone who shall lead the meek atop the crooked and cobbled bicycle path' even I would not believe him.

For I decree, and with a thousand trumpets blazing, "Cancellara till I die!!!!!!"



-end scene.
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  #250  
Old 12-11-12, 02:47
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Originally Posted by trompe le monde View Post
I am strongly contradicting myself here, but I can ask you the opposite question: why do you feel the need to persist?

Why must I provide every nook and cranny to my opinion until I have exhausted it of any relevance?

It, my opinion, may be incorrect in your eyes, but so what? I live every day comfortable in the knowledge that I believe Boonen is less of a rider than Cancellara, and I have not suffered for it.

-begin scene

I have not been struck down by lightning bolts from an angry pro-Boonen Zeus, nor has my social status been in some way impinged by viewing Tomke with a furrowed brow and shaken fist. The hands of fate have not crushed me yet for my somewhat malignant anti-Boonen view and I do not think you are in a position to inform me that the winds of fate will soon change if I don't come over to the 'dark side'.

Not even if Nietzsche's Zarathustra, after spending those god awful years atop that mountain alone with no tv or Weekly World News to console him, were to descend from that lonesome hermitage to pronounce to the world 'It is Boonen, my friends, Boonen alone who shall lead the meek atop the crooked and cobbled bicycle path' even I would not believe him.

For I decree, and with a thousand trumpets blazing, "Cancellara till I die!!!!!!"



-end scene.
Actually stating Boonen only rides 8 days a year is not an opinion, but something you consider to be a fact. Which is not true as I showed. You feel the need to dismiss that proof, but that doesn't change the fact that you were wrong.

Why do I feel the need to persist? Simple, it's in my nature to not give up. I'm not ashamed of it lol.

An opinion can be factually wrong in case you didn't know. This isn't about whether you think Cancellara is better(it's your right to think that), but about you thinking Boonen only rides 8 days a year.
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Originally Posted by Ryo Hazuki View Post
horrible. boonen just the same guy as years before and this course is too hard for him. that's why he rode like a coward there were at least 3 guys stronger than boonen today and none of them won: sagan, ballan, pozzato
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hitch
Goss will woop boonens candy ass in a sprint he cares about, any day of the week

Last edited by El Pistolero; 12-11-12 at 02:50.
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