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  #5681  
Old 12-17-12, 20:16
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The event in CT will change the landscape on a few fronts.

Ben Stein;

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As usual, the smartest comment about the whole subject came from John R. Coyne, Jr. “There is evil in the world. It’s beyond mental illness, beyond gun control. It is evil.”

The killer got his weapons from his mother, who apparently had bought them legally and registered them. That tells us something about what anti-gun laws would do, although maybe the mother should not have had them either. In this world, a killer devil can kill his mother and steal her guns to kill six year olds. That’s what some humans are and I am not sure what laws will stop them.
We should look at sensible restrictions on guns, magazines, etc. I think Joe Manchin's take is on the money;

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"I don't know anyone who in the hunting or sporting arena that goes out with an assault rifle. I don't know anybody that needs 30 rounds in the clip to go hunting," Manchin said. "I mean, these are things that need to be talked about."
Mental illness and how we as a society deals with it should be on the table as well. This blog post gives some insight in to what parents of mentally ill children are facing right now, today.

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According to Mother Jones, since 1982, 61 mass murders involving firearms have occurred throughout the country. (http://www.motherjones.com/politics/...-shootings-map). Of these, 43 of the killers were white males, and only one was a woman. Mother Jones focused on whether the killers obtained their guns legally (most did). But this highly visible sign of mental illness should lead us to consider how many people in the U.S. live in fear, like I do.

When I asked my son’s social worker about my options, he said that the only thing I could do was to get Michael charged with a crime. “If he’s back in the system, they’ll create a paper trail,” he said. “That’s the only way you’re ever going to get anything done. No one will pay attention to you unless you’ve got charges.”

I don’t believe my son belongs in jail. The chaotic environment exacerbates Michael’s sensitivity to sensory stimuli and doesn’t deal with the underlying pathology. But it seems like the United States is using prison as the solution of choice for mentally ill people. According to Human Rights Watch, the number of mentally ill inmates in U.S. prisons quadrupled from 2000 to 2006, and it continues to rise—in fact, the rate of inmate mental illness is five times greater (56 percent) than in the non-incarcerated population.
Read the entire post here (it's well worth a few minutes of your time);

http://thebluereview.org/i-am-adam-lanzas-mother/

This is a gun issue.

This is a mental health issue.

This is a societal de-sensitization to death and violence issue.

This is an electronic age issue.


If we want to just say it's guns, then that's fine. It would be like saying 9/11 was about planes.
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  #5682  
Old 12-17-12, 20:59
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Originally Posted by Scott SoCal View Post
If we want to just say it's guns, then that's fine. It would be like saying 9/11 was about planes.
More accurately it would be like saying 9/11 was about airline security. Not the whole story but critically important.
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  #5683  
Old 12-17-12, 22:34
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Still little sign that Rs understand what happened in November.

http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.co...n-obamas-birth

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"I'm not satisfied with what I've seen," Morrissey said, according to a local radio station. "I think for somebody in the president's position to not have produced a document that looks more legitimate, I have a problem with that."
This isn't some right-wing nutjob blogger, it's the state GOP Chairman. And "a document that looks more legitimate" than an actual birth certificate? wtf does that even mean?
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  #5684  
Old 12-18-12, 00:37
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Your emphasis is exclusively placed upon a perceived hallowed "right" written down in some antiquated document called the US Constitution, which allows citizens to arm themselves as if commandos going into combat.
A europeanized pseudo intellectual pantywaist won't get far telling Americans that their Bill of Rights is antequated and needs to be repealed or modified to suit the views of countries that have a history of relying on Uncle Sam to protect them. What other amendments do you plan on repealing? How about the first? You could get rid of those pesky violent video games and movies as well as Fox News. What about the fourteenth? You could do something about the majority of violence, which is caused by non-whites. What other rights should we submit to you for your approval?

The problem with liberals is that they have an incredibly poor grasp of the statistics of risk. All they do is wail, "Think of the children!" With their touchy feely crying they refuse to put things in perspective, so they flail around looking for a simplistic solution that always reinforces one of their pet issues.

Every right has a price. The price of gun rights is more murders and the occasional mass shooting by crazies. The chance of dying in a mass shooting in the United States is on par with the chance of being killed by lightning. For every mentally ill person involved in a mass shooting, there are hundreds that kill one or two people; but they don't get the headlines and cannot be used for the liberal agenda, so no one says anything about those litle tragedies, which add up to a far far greater amount of human damage than a few spectacular ones. It is much easier to pat yourself on the back for making a knee-jerk reaction like banning gun rights than deal with the difficult problem of mental illness where there are no easy solutions that you can champion while congratulating yourself for being morally superior to the savages who live in America.

Roughly 40% of households in the U.S. own guns. That has to be about 60 million households. The vast majority own and use guns responsibly, yet you want to ban guns based on an incident that killed a third as many people as die every day in traffic accidents. I know it will shock you, but a bunch of those who die in auto accidents are children. Their deaths are just as tragic as those killed in mass shootings and there are a hell of a lot more of them. Get your priorities straight so you can advocate doing something that will have the greatest effect.

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Originally Posted by rhubroma View Post
Lastly in consideration of the recent victims’ families, have you no shame in arguing these points?
Have you no shame in demagoguing your hysteria about guns using dead children before their corpses are even cold? How dare you. How dare you!
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  #5685  
Old 12-18-12, 00:46
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Originally Posted by Amsterhammer View Post
I thought you were an intelligent man, but I can no longer take you seriously after this.
That's okay. I cannot take seriously anyone who was stupid enough to believe Lance Armstrong.

I'm sure those sitting on the Supreme Court will be appalled that you don't take them seriously either. They probably lose a lot of sleep over it.

The second amendment is like the liberals version of conservatives and Roe v. Wade.
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  #5686  
Old 12-18-12, 00:55
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But BroDeal, most of the people who don't want any stricter gun control laws are also against universal mental healthcare. And most would be for the federal government banning same-sex marriages. It's not about rights, it's not about individual freedom from federal or state oppression: it's about deeply ingrained and ultimately meaningless political ideology. About taking sides and sticking to what's expected of that side.

Many other rights and aspects of your life are regulated by the government. Why is the right to bear arms so sacrosanct compared to all the others? And is it worth it, in light of the consequences?
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  #5687  
Old 12-18-12, 02:00
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Originally Posted by hrotha View Post
But BroDeal, most of the people who don't want any stricter gun control laws are also against universal mental healthcare. And most would be for the federal government banning same-sex marriages. It's not about rights, it's not about individual freedom from federal or state oppression: it's about deeply ingrained and ultimately meaningless political ideology. About taking sides and sticking to what's expected of that side.
You would have to ask Amsterhammer about that. He seems to be an expert on that sort of thinking. As for me I don't care what most people on one side think.
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  #5688  
Old 12-18-12, 02:25
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Originally Posted by hrotha View Post
But BroDeal, most of the people who don't want any stricter gun control laws are also against universal mental healthcare. And most would be for the federal government banning same-sex marriages. It's not about rights, it's not about individual freedom from federal or state oppression: it's about deeply ingrained and ultimately meaningless political ideology. About taking sides and sticking to what's expected of that side.

Many other rights and aspects of your life are regulated by the government. Why is the right to bear arms so sacrosanct compared to all the others? And is it worth it, in light of the consequences?
+1
Don't see why an individual has rights to carry a semi-automatic - what purpose does this weapon have apart from to kill randoms?

WRT Gun law in the States - there is a reason why they have the most incidents of this and it ain't because they've got more mental people per capita. Anyway right to bear arms was brought about because of Independence war ( I don't think that's being fought anymore? - unless you count an episode of South Park or was it Family Guy where Britain attacked with her so called navy!Funny!)
So what's the point of it? I get that in some parts of the States people like to go hunt but this ain't about them, they are not as far as i'm aware responsible for any of these things (Colombine etc.)
I see it as a bit similar to Britain with knives - people that are scared protect themselves with the thing that is easiest whereas in the old days you'd just have a fight - you might get beaten up but at the end of thew day everyone was still alive ... As Bruce Lee said in 'Enter the Dragon' " Any damn fool can pull a trigger"
Its bollox if i send my son to school i dont' expect to get that call...
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  #5689  
Old 12-18-12, 03:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom375 View Post
+1
Don't see why an individual has rights to carry a semi-automatic - what purpose does this weapon have apart from to kill randoms?

WRT Gun law in the States - there is a reason why they have the most incidents of this and it ain't because they've got more mental people per capita. Anyway right to bear arms was brought about because of Independence war ( I don't think that's being fought anymore? - unless you count an episode of South Park or was it Family Guy where Britain attacked with her so called navy!Funny!)
So what's the point of it? I get that in some parts of the States people like to go hunt but this ain't about them, they are not as far as i'm aware responsible for any of these things (Colombine etc.)
I see it as a bit similar to Britain with knives - people that are scared protect themselves with the thing that is easiest whereas in the old days you'd just have a fight - you might get beaten up but at the end of thew day everyone was still alive ... As Bruce Lee said in 'Enter the Dragon' " Any damn fool can pull a trigger"
Its bollox if i send my son to school i dont' expect to get that call...
Semi-automatic simply means that it is ejects the spent cartridge and loads the next, it doesn't mean that it is a machine gun. Semi-autos are very common for hunting rifles, shotguns etc.
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  #5690  
Old 12-18-12, 03:48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott SoCal View Post
The event in CT will change the landscape on a few fronts.

Ben Stein;



We should look at sensible restrictions on guns, magazines, etc. I think Joe Manchin's take is on the money;



Mental illness and how we as a society deals with it should be on the table as well. This blog post gives some insight in to what parents of mentally ill children are facing right now, today.



Read the entire post here (it's well worth a few minutes of your time);

http://thebluereview.org/i-am-adam-lanzas-mother/

This is a gun issue.

This is a mental health issue.

This is a societal de-sensitization to death and violence issue.

This is an electronic age issue.


If we want to just say it's guns, then that's fine. It would be like saying 9/11 was about planes.
But Scott, what are we to do if the mentally ill can't afford health care?
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