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  #1321  
Old 12-30-12, 17:43
Waterloo Sunrise Waterloo Sunrise is offline
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I didn't make England sound remotely 'godly'. I merely noted the Australia team is very weak, historically and absolutely, with a severe shortage of class in the batting line up, their captain aside. And even their captain still needs to show he isn't as flakey as he was - I just looked up and he only averages 41 away from home, with is really not that sharp at all.

I have full faith in the ability of England to find a way to lose if the mood takes them, but I have very little fear of them being forced in to it by strong play from Australia.
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  #1322  
Old 12-30-12, 18:12
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Alphabet Alphabet is offline
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Clarke is a better batsman than Cook, away average be damned.

All we need are a couple of 50s here and there, and someone to stick around without necessarily scoring too many. Clarke can just keep scoring double hundreds.

Last edited by Alphabet; 12-30-12 at 18:16.
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  #1323  
Old 12-30-12, 18:56
Waterloo Sunrise Waterloo Sunrise is offline
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Yep, middle order batsmen averaging 52 and unable to perform in foreign conditions are definately rarer and more valuable than opening batsmen averaging 49 who get it done everywhere and improve under pressure.
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  #1324  
Old 12-30-12, 22:12
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auscyclefan94 auscyclefan94 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waterloo Sunrise View Post
I didn't make England sound remotely 'godly'. I merely noted the Australia team is very weak, historically and absolutely, with a severe shortage of class in the batting line up, their captain aside. And even their captain still needs to show he isn't as flakey as he was - I just looked up and he only averages 41 away from home, with is really not that sharp at all.

I have full faith in the ability of England to find a way to lose if the mood takes them, but I have very little fear of them being forced in to it by strong play from Australia.
I agree. Clarke is batting very well although I am still sceptical about the rest of the batting lineup and I doubt Clarke will be able to score as many runs in more challenging conditions in England than the batter-friendly conditions in Australia. I also doubt that Australia's bowling attack is potent enough to take 20 wickets, even if they can get their best bowling attack on the field.
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second post ever after reading the forum for the last few years and one thing i must say, ACF94 is probably the most intelligent poster here, never biased to BMC or Cadel, and never gets worked up over anything.
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  #1325  
Old 12-31-12, 04:15
movingtarget movingtarget is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waterloo Sunrise View Post
I didn't make England sound remotely 'godly'. I merely noted the Australia team is very weak, historically and absolutely, with a severe shortage of class in the batting line up, their captain aside. And even their captain still needs to show he isn't as flakey as he was - I just looked up and he only averages 41 away from home, with is really not that sharp at all.

I have full faith in the ability of England to find a way to lose if the mood takes them, but I have very little fear of them being forced in to it by strong play from Australia.
Watson is frustrating to watch. How many times does he look comfortable reaching 60 or 70 then throws his wicket away with a stupid shot. Reminds me of Haddin. He has to improve his concentration and patience in tests but of course the number one problem with him is the injuries. Whenever he starts bowling again he gets injured. They might have to rethink playing him as an all rounder and just use him as a batsmen which would be a shame as he is a handy bowler in the right conditions. I think England were a better team a few seasons ago. We have to blood some young talent now especially bowlers. I still don't like Warner as an opener. Too bash happy. Cowan will do okay and is more of a steady player like Katich. I would put Watson back as an opener as well and drop Warner down the order. The bowling stocks look thin especially with all the injuries. They are talking about Marsh getting another shot. Possible, never thought I would see Hughes back in the team. We have the job ahead and can't keep relying on Clarke to his big scores.
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  #1326  
Old 12-31-12, 05:36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waterloo Sunrise View Post
Yep, middle order batsmen averaging 52 and unable to perform in foreign conditions are definately rarer and more valuable than opening batsmen averaging 49 who get it done everywhere and improve under pressure.
His average means nothing, because Clarke has only really come into his own in the last 18 months or so. He was at best a decent batsman for most of his career, therefore his average is far lower than what his current level of talent is.
Anyway, here are a few statistics:

Average vs. England 45.5
Average in England 46.1

I'm sure he'll bump those latter two up some distance by the end of the tour. If we call up David Hussey, who has an outstanding county cricket record, then all we really need is a century from both of those two and 30's and 40's from everybody else. As it is though, 46.1 in England is a very acceptable average, bearing in mind he hasn't played there in 4 years. Now that he's at the peak of his powers, I'm sure he'll hit 2 or possibly even 3 centuries this time around.

Last edited by Alphabet; 12-31-12 at 08:45.
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  #1327  
Old 12-31-12, 09:59
Waterloo Sunrise Waterloo Sunrise is offline
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Yep, that's fair, we should probably look at more recent time frame, like that last 3 years -


http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...s;type=batting

ooops.
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  #1328  
Old 12-31-12, 10:49
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Originally Posted by Waterloo Sunrise View Post
Yep, that's fair, we should probably look at more recent time frame, like that last 3 years -


http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...s;type=batting

ooops.
In the last 18 months (which I already specified as his best period to date), he's only toured South Africa, West Indies and Sri Lanka. Yes, he didn't set the world on fire, but he's hardly had many chances to, having only played 16 innings since 2011 away from home (still managing 2 centuries and a handful of 50s). Plus in that West Indies series, he was carrying a back injury throughout so to do as well as he did is commendable. If you really doubt his credentials, what about him flaying the world's best bowling attack, who were coming off an absolute demolition of England at home, nearly 600 runs in just 2 innings? He also scored centuries against the same best bowling attack on the planet on their home turf, and against Sri Lanka in Colombo since 2011.

Cook may have been consistently better over his career, but right now, going off pure form, Clarke is the best batsman in the world. The debate can be settled once and for all after the tours of India and England. Also, moving beyond the world of numbers, Clarke can score at any pace, unlike tuktuk Cook. I'd rather have Clarke ahead of Cook in a situation where the opposition have racked 600 in the first innings and are bowling with 4 men around the bat, because he can reverse the pressure in an instant. Cook is only more useful when you're 3/30 chasing 600 on a worn wicket on day 5 with Anil Kumble operating, and lets face it, a situation like that will never happen in England and with the toothlessness of the Indian attack, won't happen over there either.

Last edited by Alphabet; 12-31-12 at 10:58.
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  #1329  
Old 12-31-12, 11:16
Waterloo Sunrise Waterloo Sunrise is offline
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Yes, poor 1 paced Alistair Cook, I'm sure he wishes he could score a run a ball double century against Australia before they went rubbish...

http://www.espncricinfo.com/engvaus/...ch/217971.html



Michael Clarke is a very very good player, but no amount of bizzare attempts to define his ability as only including the innings he plays well in will detract from the reality that it is much easier to be a great middle order batsman than a great opener. Averaging around 50 opening the batting is an historically rare achievement, whilst similar runs in the middle order are much more common. Nearly every side has a top middle order batsman with a record as good or better than Clarke's. Very few have an opener with Cook's record, and even fewer have a player who really turns up when the side most needs it.
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  #1330  
Old 12-31-12, 11:21
Waterloo Sunrise Waterloo Sunrise is offline
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Incidentally, apparently Wade is moving up to 6. Doubt he will stay there - not even Australian levels of self confidence could persuade someone that top 6 is good enough against testing opposition.
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