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  #281  
Old 02-12-13, 09:20
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LaFlorecita LaFlorecita is offline
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Originally Posted by airstream View Post
Like probably all people on this forum section, I don't believe in official version from Contador and Saiz.
So what's your theory? That they're actually not close at all?
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  #282  
Old 02-12-13, 09:25
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LaFlorecita LaFlorecita is offline
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Originally Posted by Fearless Greg Lemond View Post
Now you are being silly.

Manolo Saiz is responsible for one of the most sophisticated doping networks of all times. Poisoning young men, poisoning the noble sport cycling is. With the money of blind people. He is a cancer to cycling, turning sprinters into Grand Tour winners. And, do note the number of his former team docs still active in cycling.

No, tell me, should Contador be on his defence?
Yes, if he thinks that's the right thing to do.

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And, please stop labelling people as haters who genuinely have good reasons to doubt as why Alberto should be on Saiz's defence.
I think I actually didn't label you a hater. I labelled airstream as a hater and I think no one, not even airstream is going to disagree with me. This is the man who wishes Alberto gets shot in the head and dies.
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  #283  
Old 02-12-13, 09:42
coinneach coinneach is offline
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Originally Posted by Fearless Greg Lemond View Post
Now you are being silly.

Manolo Saiz is responsible for one of the most sophisticated doping networks of all times. Poisoning young men, poisoning the noble sport cycling is. With the money of blind people. He is a cancer to cycling, turning sprinters into Grand Tour winners. And, do note the number of his former team docs still active in cycling.

No, tell me, should Contador be on his defence?

Smell the coffee la Florecita.

And, please stop labelling people as haters who genuinely have good reasons to doubt as why Alberto should be on Saiz's defence.
Hmmm....I think Contador is a bit more 3 dimensional than some posts would have him be.

He is very loyal (as are Spanish cyclist as a whole, compared to others)
He COULD make a very good witness...to most people in Spain he is among the top 3 sporting idols (despite his doping ban). He really believes his own lies and can convince others.

But that's surely the problem...it COULD turn out to be his "Oprah moment", if the prosecutor is any good at phrasing questions to establish the quality of his evidence.

I think he'll think better of it, now he can't give evidence by video link.
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  #284  
Old 02-12-13, 09:52
Lanark Lanark is offline
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Originally Posted by coinneach View Post
Hmmm....I think Contador is a bit more 3 dimensional than some posts would have him be.

He is very loyal (as are Spanish cyclist as a whole, compared to others)
He COULD make a very good witness...to most people in Spain he is among the top 3 sporting idols (despite his doping ban). He really believes his own lies and can convince others.

But that's surely the problem...it COULD turn out to be his "Oprah moment", if the prosecutor is any good at phrasing questions to establish the quality of his evidence.


I think he'll think better of it, now he can't give evidence by video link.
The prosecutor will try his best to give Contador as little trouble as possible. He'll just ham up some cliché's about Saiz being a great guy, never once telling him to dope, in fact the very opposite, the Great Saiz always warned him not to start doping. He'll say he doesn't recognize the picture described by Jaksche and others.
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  #285  
Old 02-12-13, 09:56
del1962 del1962 is offline
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Originally Posted by coinneach View Post
Hmmm....I think Contador is a bit more 3 dimensional than some posts would have him be.

He is very loyal (as are Spanish cyclist as a whole, compared to others)
He COULD make a very good witness...to most people in Spain he is among the top 3 sporting idols (despite his doping ban). He really believes his own lies and can convince others.

But that's surely the problem...it COULD turn out to be his "Oprah moment", if the prosecutor is any good at phrasing questions to establish the quality of his evidence.

I think he'll think better of it, now he can't give evidence by video link.
I suspect the prosecutor will softpedal with Contador

From the trial today, isador nozal who failed a drugs test in 2009 for EPO in 2009 says he does not know why as he doesnt dope, the level of denial runs deep, especially within Spain, very frustrating.
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  #286  
Old 02-12-13, 09:56
Gregga Gregga is offline
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By the way, where is Vino in Fuentes' files ?
According to Hamilton he was a client (he saw him in a café near Fuentes office), he was supposed to share the expensive 'Siberia' fridge with Basso, Hamilton and Ullrich... But Vino doesn't appear anywhere neither is his nickname revealed.
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  #287  
Old 02-12-13, 10:04
airstream airstream is offline
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Originally Posted by LaFlorecita View Post
So what's your theory? That they're actually not close at all?
My theory is that Contador's disclosure will be accompanied with no lesser curses than Armstrong's one. Yes, I won't argue just because it can't be effective.

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Originally Posted by Gregga
Gregga]By the way, where is Vino in Fuentes' files ?
According to Hamilton he was a client (he saw him in a café near Fuentes office), he was supposed to share the expensive 'Siberia' fridge with Basso, Hamilton and Ullrich... But Vino doesn't appear anywhere neither is his nickname revealed.
Vino is just one of many lucky guys. There were about 100-120 guys, however only 25-30 names were revealed. So God knows why Gazzetta decided to write about Cipollini, apparently having much evidence on different non-spanish cyclists.

Last edited by airstream; 02-12-13 at 10:13.
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  #288  
Old 02-12-13, 10:06
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LaFlorecita LaFlorecita is offline
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Originally Posted by airstream View Post
My theory is that Contador's disclosure will be accompanied with no lesser curses than Armstrong's one. Yes, I won't argue just because it can't be effective.
Don't really understand that. Oh well.
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  #289  
Old 02-12-13, 10:19
Gregga Gregga is offline
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Originally Posted by airstream View Post
Vino is just one of many lucky guys. There were about 100-120 guys, however only 25-30 names were revealed.
Sure, but the top cyclists (+the runner Marta Dominiguez) had clearly their blood bags in the main freezer and a nickname. Vino isn't identified among them. Maybe he was one of the unidentified nicknames : Rosa or Goku ?
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  #290  
Old 02-12-13, 10:28
airstream airstream is offline
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Originally Posted by Gregga View Post
Sure, but the top cyclists (+the runner Marta Dominiguez) had clearly their blood bags in the main freezer and a nickname. Vino isn't identified among them. Maybe he was one of the unidentified nicknames : Rosa or Goku ?
Yes, very likely. Though many Fuentes guys donated their blood in May 2006. Vino, Kash and Contador were among them as the riders who planned to fire in the Tour, 100%. It was rumored that the documents which had been found at Ufe's Tenerife villa (his main dossier) were instantly confiscated and classified by Spanish authorities. Then Vino necesserily was in those lists. Nonetheless, his blood bags exist surely if spaniard didn't eliminated them up to this day. I think the omerta can not be cracked because it is something like a sacred cycling traditions. The situation can change only if WADA intervene and require BB's to identify. It is the only chance. If it doesn't happen now, it will never happen in the foreseeable future.

Last edited by airstream; 02-12-13 at 10:32.
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