Race Design Thread - Page 194 - Cyclingnews Forum

Go Back   Cyclingnews Forum > Road > Professional road racing

Professional road racing A place to discuss all things related to current professional road races. Here, you can also touch on the latest news relating to professional road racing. A doping discussion free forum.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1931  
Old 10-31-12, 23:17
togo95 togo95 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Bratislava, Slovakia
Posts: 249
Default

Nice idea for a race. I would like to see it happen at .1 level preferably. And the towns you present look beautiful, especially Bautzen, but others too.
Reply With Quote
  #1932  
Old 11-01-12, 14:36
Netserk's Avatar
Netserk Netserk is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 13,455
Default

French National Road Race (Banyuls-sur-Mer)

Located south of Perpignan close to the border of Spain and the coast to the Mediterranean Sea.

Clockwise circuit 15 laps of 15 km (225 km total):


Main climb (tops at 6.1 km): 3.9 km @ 6.6 %
Little hill (tops at 13.5 km): 0.82 km @ 6.3 %
__________________
Cancellara is like The Black Album. Really good but way overrated.
Quote:
Definition of Wheelsucking:
When a rider refuses to take a pull even though it is tactically and/or strategically more sound to take a pull
*Refusing to pull when it is tactically and/or strategically more sound not to is therefore not wheelsucking
Change my pitch up/Smack my bitch up
Reply With Quote
  #1933  
Old 11-01-12, 18:32
rghysens rghysens is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 718
Default

Further with my 2013 tour de France.
The next stages until the second rest day.

Stage 10: Saint-Gildas-des-Bois - Saint-Malo, 193km.
I'll use the same stage as proposed by aso. Crossing Brittanny, probably rolling terrain. I expect a mass sprint.

Stage 11: Avranches - Mont Saint-Michel, 52km
Also a time trial, but I made it longer than aso did. 33km for a flat tt is just ridiculous. Plus, it will compensate the past and future mountain stages.

Stage 12: Fougères - Tours, 218km. Same stage as ASO

Stage 13: Tours - Saint-Amand-Montrond, 173km. Same stage as ASO.

Stage 14: Saint-Pourçain-sur-Sioule - Lyon, 190km.
Rolling stage with a finish on the colline de la Fourvière.



Stage 15: Givors - Annécy/Le Semnoz, 197km.



A flat first half of the stage, followed by the climbs to Col de la Crusille (4.4km @ 5.3%), Mont du Chat (11.8km @ 9%), Mont Revard (20.5km @ 5.9%) and the finish at Le Semnoz (20.8km @ 5%). This side of Le Semnoz is definitely easier than the side they'll climb in next year's tour, but I hope this will be compensated by the fact that it is closely linked with Mont du Chat and Mont Revard.

Stage 16: Le Grand Bornand - Alpe d'Huez, 230km. The stage isn't fully shown in the link to the traks4bikers profile, but I made another one:



So, today the riders will climb:
Col de l'Aravis, from Saint-Jean-de-Sixt: 10.2km @ 5.1%
Col de Forclaz (the one near Albertville): 5.4km @ 8%
Col de la Madeleine, northside: 24.5km @ 6.3%
Col du Télégraphe: 11.8km @ 7.3%
Col du Galibier: 18.1km @ 6.9%
Col de Sarenne: 12.8km @ 7.5%

Without any doubt the queen stage of this tour.

Last edited by rghysens; 11-01-12 at 18:39.
Reply With Quote
  #1934  
Old 11-01-12, 20:36
Libertine Seguros's Avatar
Libertine Seguros Libertine Seguros is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Land of Saíz
Posts: 14,120
Default

But... you've only climbed Alpe d'Huez once! How can you have a proper ASO race without climbing one of the overused climbs twice? You've just dropped the ball on the ASO's big selling point of the race
__________________
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrFiUlhAPes

Forever tête de la course.
Reply With Quote
  #1935  
Old 11-01-12, 20:55
Netserk's Avatar
Netserk Netserk is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 13,455
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Libertine Seguros View Post
But... you've only climbed Alpe d'Huez once! How can you have a proper ASO race without climbing one of the overused climbs twice? You've just dropped the ball on the ASO's big selling point of the race
He doesn't climb Alpe d'Huez at all It is Col de Sarenne. (or did I miss something obvious?)
__________________
Cancellara is like The Black Album. Really good but way overrated.
Quote:
Definition of Wheelsucking:
When a rider refuses to take a pull even though it is tactically and/or strategically more sound to take a pull
*Refusing to pull when it is tactically and/or strategically more sound not to is therefore not wheelsucking
Change my pitch up/Smack my bitch up
Reply With Quote
  #1936  
Old 11-01-12, 21:40
Libertine Seguros's Avatar
Libertine Seguros Libertine Seguros is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Land of Saíz
Posts: 14,120
Default

Very true. In which case the ASO will doubly cry, since lord knows they love overselling Alpe d'Huez.

It could be interesting too, Phil and Paul will need to learn the name of a new climb that they can explain in factors of Alpe d'Huez.
__________________
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrFiUlhAPes

Forever tête de la course.
Reply With Quote
  #1937  
Old 11-01-12, 22:24
Libertine Seguros's Avatar
Libertine Seguros Libertine Seguros is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Land of Saíz
Posts: 14,120
Default

Stage 2: Bautzen - Forst im Lausitz, 160km





The second stage of the Lausitz Rundfahrt is a comparatively short and straightforward trip from Bautzen to the border city of Forst (Baršć in the local Lower Sorbian), crossing from Oberlausitz to Niederlausitz (and therefore from Saxony to Brandenburg). This means a vague sauntering downwards in the early phases of the stage, as Oberlausitz is objectively hillier than its northern neighbour. The early parts of the stage are therefore pretty simple, with the first cobbles being the same stretch in Lohsa that we saw yesterday, before a trip through the lakes, through narrow roads past Speicherbecken Lohsa II and across the Land border into Brandenburg. Next up are some very easy cobbles in the centre of Spremberg (Grodk), before a short trip up the L47 takes us to a killer stretch of Kopfsteinpflaster as the road passes through the village of Bagenz. This pretty village on the shores of the Spremberger Stausee is home to some of the toughest cobbles in the region, large, rough and uncompromising for 1100m. This shouldn't be decisive today, though; there are still 98km remaining.

The majority of the remainder of those kilometres come in the form of 7,5 laps of a 10km circuit in today's stage town, Forst. Forst is a struggling former textile city on the Neiße (and thus, on the German-Polish border) that is the capital of the Spree-Neiße district as well as its largest city. It hosted the national championships ITT in 2001 and 2006 (its larger neighbour, Cottbus, hosted the road race), but since the Brandenburg Rundfahrt went the way of the dinosaurs it has been absent from race calendars at the pro level. It does, however, host the Forst Derny-Rennen, a (surprise) derny race along a 600m course in the city centre chocked full of cobbles. Lots of cobbles. Cobbles everywhere, in fact. Now, obviously, finding 10km worth of consecutive cobbles would be difficult, and 600m is too short for laps at the end of a pro-race for obvious reasons. However, I have done my best to live up to the spirit of the race, nicknamed the "Hölle von Forst" after Roubaix ("The Hell of Forst"). Therefore, there are three stretches of cobbles in my final closing circuit. The first is Keunescher Kirchweg, a kilometre-long street whose final passing will come just 2km from the line. The second is the Innenstadt, where I use the vast majority of the roads from the Hölle von Forst, with a couple of other cobbled roads to link the parts of the circuit to the tarmacked roads on the outside of the centre. The final stretch is the 250m long Töpferstraße. As with yesterday, none of these stretches on the final circuit are super difficult, but there are a few technical corners on the loop, and with the changing surfaces and these technical challenges, if the sprinters (even those cobble-capable ones) want to have their day they will really need to work, as this circuit will give maximum opportunity for attackers to make gains.

Bautzen:


Forst:
__________________
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrFiUlhAPes

Forever tête de la course.
Reply With Quote
  #1938  
Old 11-02-12, 21:18
Libertine Seguros's Avatar
Libertine Seguros Libertine Seguros is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Land of Saíz
Posts: 14,120
Default

Stage 3: Cottbus - Cottbus, 206km





The hardest stage of the Lausitz Rundfahrt could also, feasibly, be a pretty useful one-day race in its own right, circling around Niederlausitz for over 200km before returning to the capital of the Lower Lusatians, which they call Chóśebuz. There are a total of fourteen Kopfsteinpflasterstraßen on this route, in addition to one Plattenweg, so riders will need to be tough to survive here. Especially as in large areas of the stage, the establishment of large kolkhozes have robbed the area of anything to break up the winds rolling in along these endless fields, so the wind can undoubtedly play a factor, as can the weather at the time of year the race would be likely to be held.

Although a city of over 100.000 people, Cottbus is a city in decline, suffering from high unemployment in recent times and seeing a 'brain drain' of educated people mostly heading for Berlin and Dresden, the nearest true metropoles. It is not as historic and traditional as Bautzen, nor is its Sorbian identity as strong. However, it is the cultural centre of Lower Sorbian, more isolated and under more threat than Upper Sorbian, but still with its own history. Far fewer young people speak Lower Sorbian than Upper Sorbian, but Chóśebuz can boast bilingual signage throughout the city and a Gymnasium with Dolnoserbski as the main medium of instruction. Its position as the centre of the declining Niedersorbisch language and culture makes it the perfect place to centre our main stage on.

The first part of the stage is heading northwest from Cottbus over normal tarmac. It is some time before we reach our first cobbles, certainly longer than in the preceding two stages, as it is not until 40km have passed that we reach the centre of Lübben (Lubin) and its city centre cobbles. Heading back out of the town takes us onto Cottbuser Straße, a nodal route in the town but also a lengthy stretch of Kopfsteinpflaster. 10km later we reach Lübbenau (Lubnjow), which features Belgian-style concreted roads and more Kopfsteinpflaster on Poststraße, before a bit of respite, then the town centre is one long cobbled road called Ehm-Welk-Straße. The stretches around Lübbenau then lead us into some false uphill flat (barely perceptible) for about 13km, before we head into Calau. Tragically the people of Calau have seen much of their cobbled streets tarmacked recently, but we've taken steps to include Ringstraße on the route, a semicircular road of cobbles that encircles the now-asphalted town centre. At this point the riders can relax with a long stretch of asphalt before the short stretch of stones at Sonnewalde Markt.

Just after the halfway point the riders pass through the pretty Sorbian town of Finsterwalde (Grabin). Here the whole town centre is on easy brick-cobblestones, so to mitigate their relative ease I have included some technical corners in order to extend the length of the sector. The riders get a few kilometres to compose themselves, but the next sector is the first one that could be a real factor in deciding the race. With 80km to go, the riders tackle the 700m of rough, half-repaired cobbles, dirt, grass and rutted pavement that is Sallgast Bahnhofstraße. At the end of the sector there is a sharp right hand bend as well, which could catch people out. However, a full 12km before the next sector means well-organised teams should be able to retain some level of control. Then we head into Senftenberg (Zły Komorow), which has given its name to the Senftenberger See, one of the best-known of the artificial lakes in the Lausitzer Seenland. With just under 70km to go, there are two stretches of Kopfsteinpflaster within Senftenberg. Firstly, the long and straight August-Bebel-Straße, but more importantly the twisty and lengthy Steindamm.

These are followed in short order by the very punishing stretches in the village of Sedlitz, with over 2,5km of cobbles overall as we wind our way through the streets to take in as many as possible. Immediately after leaving the main road we hit Muhlenstraße, which eases the riders into it; the rest of the village's Kopfsteinpflasterstraßen are not so well maintained, rough and potentially slippery if it rains. 60km remain after this, but this stretch from 80km to go to 60km to go is where the key moves ought to be made - several stretches of difficulty here. After this it's narrow roads to try to make things hard for the chase and encourage earlier attacks, as we head along the Sedlitzer See. Here we transition from looking at Lausitz's future to its past... and it's kind of the other way round to how you'd expect as the future is the beautiful lakeland, and the past is the Kraftwerk known as Schwarze Pumpe. This is actually a new addition, set into operation in the late 90s, but it is representative of Lausitz's past as a major lignite producer. Shortly after this we head through Spremberg and its old town as we did yesterday, followed by the short hill and then, with 25km to go, they hit the large, rough cobbles of Bagenz. This 1100m stretch with a couple of tight bends and no respite is where I would expect key moves to be made in the stage, because from here it's the real start of the roll back into Cottbus. With 19km to go there is a stretch of Plattenweg as the riders pass Neuhausen Bahnhof and move into the outskirts of Cottbus itself. There, they have one final stretch of cobbles to face, 900m of messily maintained stones on Ströbitzer Hauptstraße to deal with, which finish with just under 4km to go, so if teams have been able to exert more control than I would like up until this point, this would give one final opportunity for the attackers to get away from the bunch (I think that while the stage may not have everybody finishing solo, we could well have several different groups on the road, and it won't be a group of 70-80 pursuing attackers here) on the fairly simple run-in with only a few corners, the last coming with 600m to go. The finishing straight is in part cobbled, but only in the same way as the Champs-Elysées can be considered 'on cobbles'.

Cottbus:


__________________
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrFiUlhAPes

Forever tête de la course.
Reply With Quote
  #1939  
Old 11-03-12, 00:02
Libertine Seguros's Avatar
Libertine Seguros Libertine Seguros is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Land of Saíz
Posts: 14,120
Default

Stage 4: EuroSpeedway Lausitz - EuroSpeedway Lausitz, 11,0km (ITT)





Yes, yes, I know, after the mediæval castles of Oberlausitz, and the waterways of the Lausitzer Seenland, this is a pretty unappealing way to finish, heading around a quiet motor racing venue (in typical fashion for oval-racing facilities outside of the USA, there are far more seats than could ever be envisaged filling them), but this is a useful facility to have right there, and it even has cycling pedigree, in two ways. Firstly, it is where Damjan Zabovnik and Francesco Russo have set hour records for streamlined HPVs. Secondly, it is the site of the horrific accident that nearly killed Alessandro Zanardi and left him without his legs, an accident which has led (via a circuitous route) to his double Paralympic gold medals earlier this year.

The Lausitzring consists of two ovals, the main, tri-oval-shaped Lausitzring used for Champ Car racing a few years ago, and the Dekra Test Oval, an elongated oval used for autotesting that has not been used in racing and is therefore best known for the tragic death of former F1 driver and Le Mans winner Michele Alboreto in a testing accident. Within the Lausitzring there are a number of circuit configurations used in DTM, F3 and other series. One of the permutations of the circuit, originally envisaged for the running of an endurance race of several hours in length, combines the longest of these courses with two adjoining strips of tarmac attaching the Lausitzring to the Dekra Test Oval, creating an 11km circuit (they planned to put chicanes into the straights on the Test Oval for safety purposes, like at Le Mans and Daytona). It has never been used in racing. Until now.

Ultimately, with this, what you see is what you get. It's a short ITT, just long enough to settle small gaps in the GC, but not long enough to make it totally decisive and discourage riders from making the other three stages worth it. After all, with a long ITT riders wouldn't dare spend a long time solo or in a small group in the Cottbus stage, but this is short enough that if they were able to get away they could defend their lead in the ITT - it's a bit influenced by De Panne that way, I guess. Either way, this is designed as a short stage race full of narrow roads, exposed countryside, pretty scenery and cobbles - a tune-up race for the spring or a late-season event. Therefore you don't want it to be too long, but plenty tough. Hopefully I've managed that.

EuroSpeedway Lausitz:
__________________
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrFiUlhAPes

Forever tête de la course.
Reply With Quote
  #1940  
Old 11-03-12, 20:17
Netserk's Avatar
Netserk Netserk is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Denmark
Posts: 13,455
Default

So in these modern days, where we have to humanize the routes and have queen-stages of 150 km, is it possible to create well-designed mountain stages? Yes.

Based on 2013's second mountain stage I have made two changes, though still maintaining the soft-route-cr@p. The stage is 178 km long without any HC mountains, and a peak of 1580 meters.

The first change is a detour from Saint-Béat to Bagnères-de-Luchon, and a change of finishing town (and of course how to get there, which is from the top of Col de Ancizan over Aspin) to Arreau.



(So little change for such a big difference )
__________________
Cancellara is like The Black Album. Really good but way overrated.
Quote:
Definition of Wheelsucking:
When a rider refuses to take a pull even though it is tactically and/or strategically more sound to take a pull
*Refusing to pull when it is tactically and/or strategically more sound not to is therefore not wheelsucking
Change my pitch up/Smack my bitch up
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 08:40.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2006 - 2009 Future Publishing Limited. All rights reserved. Future Publishing Limited is part of the Future plc group. Future Publishing Limited is a company registered in England and Wales with company registration number 2008885 whose registered office is at Beauford Court 30 Monmouth Street Bath, UK BA1 2BW England.