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General Doping Thread.

The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

Moderators: Irondan, Eshnar, Red Rick, Valv.Piti, Pricey_sky, Tonton, King Boonen

Re: Re:

11 Jul 2017 02:24

Irondan wrote:
cipurian wrote:Here's an interesting article by Leo Konig, he touched on doping in it and says that with current countermeasures PEDs in pro peloton can bring you 3 to 5 percent performance bump.
http://www.bezfrazi.cz/drz-hubu-a-jezdi/

It's tough to follow with google translate, is there an English version?

I'd like to read the whole post, it seemed interesting from what I could make out.

Unfortunately not, but it so well thought out and articulate piece. Even better than what you get to read at players tribune.
cipurian
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Re:

11 Jul 2017 02:31

cipurian wrote:Here's an interesting article by Leo Konig, he touched on doping in it and says that with current countermeasures PEDs in pro peloton can bring you 3 to 5 percent performance bump.
http://www.bezfrazi.cz/drz-hubu-a-jezdi/


If this is true PEDs may be the difference between contending for a GT and missing the time cut. Or, to put it more simply, any rider without PEDs will climb like Kittel and sprint like Landa.
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11 Jul 2017 18:11

Bora rider Ralf Matzka tested positive for something called Tamoxifen in March 2016. Team gives the reason that it was because of 'contaminated water'. Seems unclear why this has been a secret for so long? The UCI knew about it in April...

"The UCI said to demand that the detection of a substance such as tamoxifen should not necessarily follow a provisional suspension. The case against Matzka has not yet been finalized, which is why there will be no further details on the specific case."

http://www.sportschau.de/tourdefrance/doping-bora-ralf-matzka-100.html
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11 Jul 2017 19:04

Well, we can always start a "tamoxifen is useless" thread.
DanielSong39
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11 Jul 2017 19:27

Tamoxifen is mainly used to prevent male gynecomastia from steroid doping.

It is totally justifiably banned and really is a red flag for other substances.
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Ralf Matzka Doping

11 Jul 2017 19:43

Why does the UCI have Ralf on the slow-motion sanction list?

How these cases get resolved is more random than the doping incidents themselves.

http://www.procyclingstats.com/rider.php?id=135252&season=2016
Last edited by DirtyWorks on 11 Jul 2017 19:52, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Re:

11 Jul 2017 19:52

Irondan wrote:
cipurian wrote:Here's an interesting article by Leo Konig, he touched on doping in it and says that with current countermeasures PEDs in pro peloton can bring you 3 to 5 percent performance bump.
http://www.bezfrazi.cz/drz-hubu-a-jezdi/

It's tough to follow with google translate, is there an English version?

I'd like to read the whole post, it seemed interesting from what I could make out.
While my Czech is a bit rusty I did understand most of the entry, it's basically the Czech version of the Sky mantra. Or a combination of Sky and Vaughters.

Konig says all the hard doping took place years ago, with the bio-passport such doping is no longer possible. Way back when it wasn't a matter of having the best nutrition and training, you just needed the best doctor. He believes since he became a pro (2008) clean cyclists started winning...

And then he goes on about the ADAMS system and how screwed clean cyclists are if they don't report their whereabouts accurately and miss their tests, whereas dopers can just disappear into remote areas and can get away with doping.

With apologies to cipurian I didn't really get anything new and enlightening out of this, to me Konig sounds well-rehearsed. In Czech.
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11 Jul 2017 21:29

Btw., this entry of Konig's seems to be from when he was still with Sky.

Isn't he with Bora now?
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Re: Re:

11 Jul 2017 23:24

Tricycle Rider wrote:
Irondan wrote:
cipurian wrote:Here's an interesting article by Leo Konig, he touched on doping in it and says that with current countermeasures PEDs in pro peloton can bring you 3 to 5 percent performance bump.
http://www.bezfrazi.cz/drz-hubu-a-jezdi/

It's tough to follow with google translate, is there an English version?

I'd like to read the whole post, it seemed interesting from what I could make out.
While my Czech is a bit rusty I did understand most of the entry, it's basically the Czech version of the Sky mantra. Or a combination of Sky and Vaughters.

Konig says all the hard doping took place years ago, with the bio-passport such doping is no longer possible. Way back when it wasn't a matter of having the best nutrition and training, you just needed the best doctor. He believes since he became a pro (2008) clean cyclists started winning...

And then he goes on about the ADAMS system and how screwed clean cyclists are if they don't report their whereabouts accurately and miss their tests, whereas dopers can just disappear into remote areas and can get away with doping.

With apologies to cipurian I didn't really get anything new and enlightening out of this, to me Konig sounds well-rehearsed. In Czech.


Personal nature of this article and very little awareness of this blog in czech republic alone makes pretty doubtful there was any sort of PR in it.
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26 Jul 2017 20:16

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-sport-doping-russia-zaripov-idUSKBN1AA11C
Russian forward Danis Zaripov, a three-time world champion who played at the 2010 Olympics, has been suspended for two years after failing a doping test last season in the Kontinental Hockey League, the KHL said on Tuesday.

A statement on KHL's website said the International Ice Hockey Federation (IIHF) had suspended Zaripov until May 22, 2019, after one of his samples contained banned stimulants plus substances prohibited as diuretics and masking agents.

Two other KHL players, former National Hockey League (NHL) player Derek Smith and Russian defenseman Andrei Konev, were also suspended for using banned stimulants, the KHL said.
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29 Aug 2017 12:55

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl-russia-s-zaripov-cleared-to-seek-deal-1.841348

Professional leagues in USA apparently doesn´t give a .... about doping :rolleyes:
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29 Aug 2017 18:48

You don't get OOC testing during a doping ban right?
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Re:

29 Aug 2017 19:26

Brullnux wrote:You don't get OOC testing during a doping ban right?


I think you do.

I remember that Santambrogio's 2nd positive was during his doping ban.
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Re: Re:

29 Aug 2017 21:52

Ricco' wrote:
Brullnux wrote:You don't get OOC testing during a doping ban right?


I think you do.

I remember that Santambrogio's 2nd positive was during his doping ban.

Ok, because Sharapova has come back pretty strongly and I thought I had found a great loophole there, but apparently you can't jack yourself up with anything and everything.
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10 Sep 2017 12:31

The worse thing from the Armstrong 'Reasoned Decision' was all these people who went after Armstrong have been caught for making it personal.

None of them give a shyte about cheating or doping. They all went after Armstrong becuase he hurt them in some way or people they knew.

What Sky have done has made Armstrong look like a Merkcx. At least Armstrong had some palmares before decideing to crush everyone in July for 7 years. Wiggins and Froome were grupetto fodder hanging on to arrive before time limits or motorbikes.

But the silence from JV, Tygart, race radio and others who were so prominent in taking down Armstrong is disgusting.
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Re:

10 Sep 2017 15:45

Benotti69 wrote:The worse thing from the Armstrong 'Reasoned Decision' was all these people who went after Armstrong have been caught for making it personal.
Many of them may have done it for personal reasons, but not all. I don't think it was personal with Big George. And I don't think it was personal with Emma O'Reilly.
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14 Sep 2017 14:33

https://www.europol.europa.eu/newsroom/news/criminal-group-involved-in-large-scale-trafficking-of-illegal-doping-substances-disrupted

112 types of illicit substances were seized, including 4 million doses of anabolic steroids, hormones, sexual enhancers and other substances, worth EUR 650 000 in the illegal market.

Big money in doping.
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Re: Re:

14 Sep 2017 16:01

Ricco' wrote:
Brullnux wrote:You don't get OOC testing during a doping ban right?


I think you do.

I remember that Santambrogio's 2nd positive was during his doping ban.


I don't have a source for this but from what I understand, OOC testing starts towards the end of the ban where the individual has demonstrated an intent to compete by renewing his/her racing licence. Unlike at team level, this sort of testing is irrespective of the category (Conti/ProConti/WT) in which the banned individual intends to make his/her return.
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14 Sep 2017 16:15

doping will be Always more advanced than antidoping , especially for the team with money and political power as team sky
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18 Sep 2017 19:13

So it appears WADA has insufficient evidence to charge the first tranch of 95 athletes in the Russian Doping Saga - No big surprise if the samples have been destroyed.
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