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Most memorable doped perfomances?

The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

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Re:

14 Jul 2015 15:21

fantomas wrote:Well, that was som Saunier Duval **** today.

Saunier Duval was maybe what we saw from Saxo getting Contador into 11th. SD never in their wildest dreams could have gotten within a minute of Froome today.
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15 Jul 2015 16:36

I called the "Leonardo Portepoli" nickname back in June 2013, so you know.
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Re:

15 Jul 2015 16:43

Libertine Seguros wrote:I called the "Leonardo Portepoli" nickname back in June 2013, so you know.

LOL :D :D :D
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Re: Most memorable doped perfomances?

15 Jul 2015 18:14

Floyd in Morzine 2006 was big. I never thought that in 21st century a single rider could destroy the peleton with 100km+ breakaway like Merckx.

Santiago Perez at Vuelta 2004 was also spectacular. A man from nothing doing 1800-2000 m/h of VAM for 15 minutes and making Heras look like an amateur.

Jose Enrique Gutierrez at Giro 2006. A heavy man (78 kg) with no grand tour success is 2nd at the Giro ahead of Simoni and only behind ET Basso.

Pantani and Indurain on Alpe d'Huez 1995. Pantani goes under 37' and Indurain (80 kilograms!) doing a little over 38 minutes! Pantani doing well over 1800 m/h of VAM (close to 7 watts/kg) for such a long period is incredible. But what can you say about Indurain? This 80-kg giant with locomotive-like engine achieved VAM of about 1750 m/h and could overtake uphill our skinny Alien :D What a mutant! Wonderful 90s. Compared to them todays cycling is clean :p

For me sustained greatness of Pantani and Indurain (for many years, not a single shot like Landis) represent peak of capabilities of very gifted cyclists on doping.
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Re: Re:

16 Jul 2015 04:15

The Hitch wrote:
fantomas wrote:Well, that was som Saunier Duval **** today.

Saunier Duval was maybe what we saw from Saxo getting Contador into 11th. SD never in their wildest dreams could have gotten within a minute of Froome today.

Not even Ricco 2008? His effort at Super Besse was something else.
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Re:

16 Jul 2015 07:03

Most memorable for doping? Hard to think of anything more "over the top" than Horner. Partially memorable for it occuring during a time where there was so much hype about cycling entering a "new era", LOL. Horner shat on the whole circus. Up until that point I thought it couldn't get any more ridiculous than Perez or Nozal.

ChewbaccaD wrote:Yea, still love what Floyd did that day regardless.

I'll add this one: Tyler during the 2003 TdF. His ride on Alpe d'Huez was amazing regardless of how many bags of blood he might have had. He rode it with a broken collarbone and more than once got out of the saddle to get back to Armstrong and Beloki after attacks. I just kept thinking "how in the fu*k can you do that?" All the PED's in the world don't make someone tough enough to do that. He's just a natural bada$$.


He actually attacked them once on l'Alpe as well. Don't remember if it was Armstrong who chased him down.
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Re: Re:

16 Jul 2015 07:16

BrentonOfTheNorth wrote:Most memorable for doping? Hard to think of anything more "over the top" than Horner. Partially memorable for it occuring during a time where there was so much hype about cycling entering a "new era", LOL. Horner shat on the whole circus. Up until that point I thought it couldn't get any more ridiculous than Perez or Nozal.

ChewbaccaD wrote:Yea, still love what Floyd did that day regardless.

I'll add this one: Tyler during the 2003 TdF. His ride on Alpe d'Huez was amazing regardless of how many bags of blood he might have had. He rode it with a broken collarbone and more than once got out of the saddle to get back to Armstrong and Beloki after attacks. I just kept thinking "how in the fu*k can you do that?" All the PED's in the world don't make someone tough enough to do that. He's just a natural bada$$.


He actually attacked them once on l'Alpe as well. Don't remember if it was Armstrong who chased him down.


Armstrong was on Beloki's wheel.
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Re:

18 Jul 2015 06:40

Tonton wrote:Hands down, Floyd Landis in his 2006 impersonation of Eddy Merckx. This episode was also nominated for 'the most memorable Phil and Paul part of the problem not the solution' and 'the most memorable justifications by Robbie Ventura'.


I would call it more of a Claudio Chiappucci impersonation. Agree though, both bloody 'good' doped performances.

Would add in the Saunier Duval duo for the sheer audacity of it.
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Re: Most memorable doped perfomances?

20 Jul 2015 10:32

Pjotr Ugrumov dropping Indurain after trying 10x already @ Oropa - Giro 1993

Marco Pantani winning and passing the whole peloton after a flat tire @ Oropa - Giro 1999

Team Clas in the whole Tour de France of 1993 - Escartin, Rominger, Unzaga, Mauleon, Echave. They were actually teammates of Indurain (he told them what to do on the climb of the Bonnette to Isola 2000). I still remember some mountain stages with a group of 15 riders, and 5-6 Clas riders. The whole Banesto team was nowhere to be seen, which why I've always said that there was no doping culture in that team during Indurain's era. I think Indurain himself got prepared, not so much.

Festina - Col du Glandon TDF 1997. 8 out 9 riders leading the pack.
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21 Jul 2015 11:02

Pantani les deux alpes tour 1998.
Also my brother telling me about pantani to oropa giro 99 after I got home from school or something. Good times.
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21 Jul 2015 14:04

Really, nobody has mentioned Indurain's La Plagne?

I think its a microcosm of cycling culture. Nothing matters if you don't win.

Even if you ride every major contender but Zulle (20-odd guys doped to the gills) straight off your wheel without attacking, teammates, changing cadence or standing up. Guy puts out 500W+ sustained for half an hour, double dares Pantani et al. to keep if they mfcking can. "I'll pull it's no biggie. Y'all ain't got nothing anyway."

Nope, he didn't win, so it isn't memorable.
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27 Jul 2015 19:49

Not to forget.

Lugano Worldchampionships U23.

1) Giuliano Figueras (Ita)
2) Roberto Sgambelluri (Ita)
3) Luca Sironi (Ita)
4) Paolo Bettini (Ita)

At one point all four heading to the last climb.

Funny thing Bettini got beat in the sprint for 3rd place because he stopped sprinting.
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Re:

27 Jul 2015 19:52

carton wrote:Really, nobody has mentioned Indurain's La Plagne?

I think its a microcosm of cycling culture. Nothing matters if you don't win.

Even if you ride every major contender but Zulle (20-odd guys doped to the gills) straight off your wheel without attacking, teammates, changing cadence or standing up. Guy puts out 500W+ sustained for half an hour, double dares Pantani et al. to keep if they mfcking can. "I'll pull it's no biggie. Y'all ain't got nothing anyway."

Nope, he didn't win, so it isn't memorable.

However, it was the main reason I picked that version of Indurain over the '92 version as pick #1 in the doping draft.
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Re:

27 Jul 2015 20:08

carton wrote:Really, nobody has mentioned Indurain's La Plagne?

I think its a microcosm of cycling culture. Nothing matters if you don't win.

Even if you ride every major contender but Zulle (20-odd guys doped to the gills) straight off your wheel without attacking, teammates, changing cadence or standing up. Guy puts out 500W+ sustained for half an hour, double dares Pantani et al. to keep if they mfcking can. "I'll pull it's no biggie. Y'all ain't got nothing anyway."

Nope, he didn't win, so it isn't memorable.
this was training for that:

https://youtu.be/tFM7wcMiPdI?t=3078

checking the opposition and than full alien mode
il Mito wrote:“I’m in pension, I don’t give a **** about training,” Ferrari said. “They are all strong without me. Did you see the Tour de France?”
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Re: Most memorable doped perfomances?

27 Jul 2015 20:22

Krzysztof_O wrote:Floyd in Morzine 2006 was big. I never thought that in 21st century a single rider could destroy the peleton with 100km+ breakaway like Merckx.

Santiago Perez at Vuelta 2004 was also spectacular. A man from nothing doing 1800-2000 m/h of VAM for 15 minutes and making Heras look like an amateur.

Jose Enrique Gutierrez at Giro 2006. A heavy man (78 kg) with no grand tour success is 2nd at the Giro ahead of Simoni and only behind ET Basso.

Pantani and Indurain on Alpe d'Huez 1995. Pantani goes under 37' and Indurain (80 kilograms!) doing a little over 38 minutes! Pantani doing well over 1800 m/h of VAM (close to 7 watts/kg) for such a long period is incredible. But what can you say about Indurain? This 80-kg giant with locomotive-like engine achieved VAM of about 1750 m/h and could overtake uphill our skinny Alien :D What a mutant! Wonderful 90s. Compared to them todays cycling is clean :p

For me sustained greatness of Pantani and Indurain (for many years, not a single shot like Landis) represent peak of capabilities of very gifted cyclists on doping.

+1.

I think this summary is excellent. Probably would need to add Riis in Hautacam.
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Re: Most memorable doped perfomances?

27 Jul 2015 22:56

Escarabajo wrote:
Krzysztof_O wrote:Floyd in Morzine 2006 was big. I never thought that in 21st century a single rider could destroy the peleton with 100km+ breakaway like Merckx.

Santiago Perez at Vuelta 2004 was also spectacular. A man from nothing doing 1800-2000 m/h of VAM for 15 minutes and making Heras look like an amateur.

Jose Enrique Gutierrez at Giro 2006. A heavy man (78 kg) with no grand tour success is 2nd at the Giro ahead of Simoni and only behind ET Basso.

Pantani and Indurain on Alpe d'Huez 1995. Pantani goes under 37' and Indurain (80 kilograms!) doing a little over 38 minutes! Pantani doing well over 1800 m/h of VAM (close to 7 watts/kg) for such a long period is incredible. But what can you say about Indurain? This 80-kg giant with locomotive-like engine achieved VAM of about 1750 m/h and could overtake uphill our skinny Alien :D What a mutant! Wonderful 90s. Compared to them todays cycling is clean :p

For me sustained greatness of Pantani and Indurain (for many years, not a single shot like Landis) represent peak of capabilities of very gifted cyclists on doping.

+1.

I think this summary is excellent. Probably would need to add Riis in Hautacam.


Riis wasn't a very gifted cyclist though.
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Re: Most memorable doped perfomances?

28 Jul 2015 06:38

I know it does not rate up there with some of the entries posted here and the opposition was not the toughest but seeing Basso ride tempo for 12km up the zoncolon dropping everyone without sprinting or climbing out of the saddle always makes me laugh
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Re:

28 Jul 2015 21:01

Ricco's Aspin attack was LOL funny: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34AY5epnluw&feature=youtu.be&t=2m16s

carton wrote:Really, nobody has mentioned Indurain's La Plagne?

I think its a microcosm of cycling culture. Nothing matters if you don't win.

Even if you ride every major contender but Zulle (20-odd guys doped to the gills) straight off your wheel without attacking, teammates, changing cadence or standing up. Guy puts out 500W+ sustained for half an hour, double dares Pantani et al. to keep if they mfcking can. "I'll pull it's no biggie. Y'all ain't got nothing anyway."

Nope, he didn't win, so it isn't memorable.


I think that similarly, Armstrong's insane Hautacam performance in 2000 doesn't get talked about so much because he didn't win the stage.

Was that the stage that Pantani attacked early, then Indurain demolished the field catching and passing him in the fog? With Pantani shaking his head in disbelief as Indurain caught him.

Makes me wonder... has any pro endurance athlete regularly come close to the wattage output of Indurain?
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28 Jul 2015 21:18

Floyd on Morzine for me. I can remember laughing at the time and thinking "He's definitely getting popped".
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Re: Re:

28 Jul 2015 21:21

BrentonOfTheNorth wrote:Was that the stage that Pantani attacked early, then Indurain demolished the field catching and passing him in the fog? With Pantani shaking his head in disbelief as Indurain caught him.

No, that was Hautacam 94'. Indurain went on to shake his head himself when he was pipped by LeBlanc on the line. But my favorite shake of the head has to be Armstrong 1994, after the TT. I can't find the footage, but he says something like: "I was in 53-11 and he just blew right by me. I mean, you know, that's just ..."

BrentonOfTheNorth wrote:Makes me wonder... has any pro endurance athlete regularly come close to the wattage output of Indurain?

I'm not sure how you would measure that. The only other sport where that's feasible on principle is rowing, where inefficiencies are generally higher. At least in cycling I doubt anyone will match Indurain's sustained power in a long time.
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