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JV talks, sort of

The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

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Re: Re:

25 Jul 2016 13:49

Roninho wrote:In that 2003 TDF Euskaltel had Mayo and Zubeldia in the top 6 GQ and a stage win. In 2004 they had no stage wins and nobody in the top 25.


The other teams caught on to Euskaltel using homologous blood doping and did not want to go down that route with the extra dangers it had over autologous transfusions. People were pissed. Armstrong, the skinflint who was loathe to spend money on anyone, donated a machine to detect it. Hamilton was caught in the crossfire. Armstrong gets the blame for being the bad guy instead of those putting everyone in danger.

The original Slipstream team had a few riders who were willing to keep doping. They could get a win or two or high placing. The rest could collect a paycheck while sucking. Management could look the other way if it kept the sponsors happy. After the dopers left for other teams or retired, there was nothing but the suck left. Someone on the team needs to step up.
"Their world is crumbling. Ours is being built."
DamianoMachiavelli
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Re: Re:

25 Jul 2016 15:17

Roninho wrote:Well obviously an awfull result. But i would not just look at a single TDF, to small sample.


How far back do we have to go for a good Tour for JV's selection? The last two years have sucked royally.

Yes, you can try and point to bad luck as a distraction for performance. But when you're looking at this level of bad luck you then have to ask what was being doing in past lives for this level of karmic retribution? Or, if you don't believe in karma, then you have to ask what is being done wrong that lessons are not being learned from?
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Re: Re:

25 Jul 2016 19:13

fmk_RoI wrote:
sniper wrote:anybody know cannondale's annual budget compared to say dimension data's budget?


JV says it's €10m, others have said it's closer to €17m. L'Équipe put Dimension at €13.5m.

Dimension have had what, two sponsors in a decade (MTN, Dimension) while in that same period JV has gone through, Chipotle, Cervélo, Transitions, Barracuda, Sharp and Garmin. Yes, cycling's finances are unstable. When you're JV. How many others teams can boast that number of name sponsors in such a short period?


I dont quite get your point here regards sponsors. Unless you are one of the mega teams with a huge backer, SKY, Astana, Katusha etc or private benefactors BMC/Tinkoff etc, chances are you will have to secure various sponsors to stay afloat. Garmin was the primary sponsor from 2008 until last season was it. 7-8 seasons. Not bad at all. All the other sponsors were secondary sponsors and Barracuda was a third sponsor. Cervelo were on the way out anyway when they ditched their own team.

Lampre have had Merida, ISD, Farnese, NGC and Fondital as secondary sponosors in the same time, Giant-Alpecin have been Giant-Shimano, Argos-Shimano, Skil-Shimano and are changing again next year I think . You mentioned Lotto but they have also had Belisol and now Soudal as secondary sponsors. Boguyes Telecom-Europcar-Direct Energie??? Teams like Radioshack and IAM have been here and gone. What about Columbia-HTC, Milram?

MTN were a continental team for most of their existence, not quite the same as backing a WT team, is it? then Pro-continental for a few seasons but they needed Dimension Data to move them up to WT level. Will they still be here in 7-8 years time?

No other US team have had consistent backers over long periods other than BMC and as I mentioned before, that is becaue they are bankrolled by Andy Rhiis. This justs seems like a silly notion to start slamming JV with.
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Re:

25 Jul 2016 23:12

CheckMyPecs wrote:This thread summed up in one sentence:

"We all say we want clean cycling, but when someone comes up and actually does it we all make fun of how lousy they are"

Not really. There are two issues here - and the situation certainly is not as clear cut as your summary implies.

Firstly, are Cannondale clean or are they dirty but just rubbish?

Secondly, if Cannondale are clean; does JV still stand by his statement that this is a clean era of cycling? Because, if so, he must be a pretty awful manager to get such appalling results in a clean sport.

If Cannondale are clean, then obviously it's commendable in this sport. But if they are clean, then their manager should really be shouting from the rooftops about the unrealistic power outputs and performances from certain other riders and teams. The last thing he should be doing is maintaing the omerta - not least because it makes his own leadership look so poor.
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04 Aug 2016 16:14

Jack Robertson

“Those involved in running sport are former athletes, so somehow I figured that they would have honor and integrity. But the people in charge are basically raping their sports and the system for self-interest. Sport is seriously broken.”



........
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04 Aug 2016 16:25

Vaughters silence on his own riders positive test shows the true side of Jonathan Vaughters.
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Re:

04 Aug 2016 16:56

Benotti69 wrote:Vaughters silence on his own riders positive test shows the true side of Jonathan Vaughters.


JV isn't going to speak out, if he did he'd kill his cash cow. Why else is he doing college degrees? He's aware/guessing the milk train isn't going to run forever, so he's making hay while the sun shines.

JV, Millar etc should never have been allowed back into cycling. But when you have dopers running teams/coaching/being a guru to young riders you just end up with the same outcome as before.
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Re: Re:

04 Aug 2016 17:01

BYOP88 wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:Vaughters silence on his own riders positive test shows the true side of Jonathan Vaughters.


JV isn't going to speak out, if he did he'd kill his cash cow. Why else is he doing college degrees? He's aware/guessing the milk train isn't going to run forever, so he's making hay while the sun shines.

The sooner JV, Millar etc are kicked out of cycling the better it is for cycling. But when you have dopers running teams/coaching/being a guru to young riders you just end up with the same outcome as before.


Jack Robertson former WADA investigator says it best

..the people in charge are basically raping their sports and the system for self-interest......
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Re: Re:

04 Aug 2016 17:04

Benotti69 wrote:
BYOP88 wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:Vaughters silence on his own riders positive test shows the true side of Jonathan Vaughters.


JV isn't going to speak out, if he did he'd kill his cash cow. Why else is he doing college degrees? He's aware/guessing the milk train isn't going to run forever, so he's making hay while the sun shines.

The sooner JV, Millar etc are kicked out of cycling the better it is for cycling. But when you have dopers running teams/coaching/being a guru to young riders you just end up with the same outcome as before.


Jack Robertson former WADA investigator says it best

..the people in charge are basically raping their sports and the system for self-interest......


I agree with Mr Robertson. Millar, JV and the rest should not have been allowed back. I'm guessing they've made some nice and easy $$$$$$$ since 2006.
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Re: Re:

04 Aug 2016 17:17

BYOP88 wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:
BYOP88 wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:Vaughters silence on his own riders positive test shows the true side of Jonathan Vaughters.


JV isn't going to speak out, if he did he'd kill his cash cow. Why else is he doing college degrees? He's aware/guessing the milk train isn't going to run forever, so he's making hay while the sun shines.

The sooner JV, Millar etc are kicked out of cycling the better it is for cycling. But when you have dopers running teams/coaching/being a guru to young riders you just end up with the same outcome as before.


Jack Robertson former WADA investigator says it best

..the people in charge are basically raping their sports and the system for self-interest......


I agree with Mr Robertson. Millar, JV and the rest should not have been allowed back. I'm guessing they've made some nice and easy $$$$$$$ since 2006.


Sport is broken, very broken. Vaughters is part of the problems not the solutions.
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Wiggins post-Garmin envy

19 Sep 2016 04:59

JV makes it in on the last paragraph here https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/sep/18/bradley-wiggins-world-anti-doping-agency-hackers-russian-leak

Jonathan Vaughters, a former American cyclist who now runs his own team, suggested a way forward that is being advocated increasingly loudly. “Want a good solution for TUEs? Make it compulsory to publicly disclose all TUEs,” he said. “Any athlete would think twice unless they really needed it.”


Wiggins post-Garmin envy?
;)
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19 Sep 2016 08:36

Vaughters always was a clever guy with good ideas.
No discussion.
The problems began when he started claiming cycling is clean and sky are clean and you can now win gts clean etc. Then the calibration errors and more ******.
But fair enough, hes always been a proponent of the mpcc and he s on the mark again here.
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06 Oct 2016 19:47

Tom Danielson gets a reduced 4 year ban and no doubt not a word from the guy who dedicated his life to anti-doping and spends half a million dollars every year testing his own riders...................

http://cyclingtips.com/2016/10/fourteen-months-later-usada-hands-tom-danielson-reduced-four-year-sanction-for-contaminated-supplement/
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07 Oct 2016 14:09

No comment still from Vaughters on Danielson, his rider who was popped and gets a risible 4 year ban.

But hey the guy is happy to talk about the money in cycling and ASO screwing the teams over. JV always was after the money. I reckon he took Armstrong down because he saw the Armstrong threat of taking control of ASO and the sport and leaving him outside.

Sport is about money. Doping is part of that. Always will be as long as the people who run the sport are former athletes/riders who used the doping to get ahead! Stockholm syndrome.
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09 Oct 2016 10:52

Wiggins transformation started at Slipstream under Vaughters.

Why are journalists not putting some hard questions to Vaughters about Wiggins?

Vaughters has made himself out to the anti-doping Jesus of the sport. No one seems to question him and his silence on it all stinks.

Never mind Danielson.
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Re:

09 Oct 2016 18:07

Benotti69 wrote:Tom Danielson gets a reduced 4 year ban and no doubt not a word from the guy who dedicated his life to anti-doping and spends half a million dollars every year testing his own riders...................

http://cyclingtips.com/2016/10/fourteen-months-later-usada-hands-tom-danielson-reduced-four-year-sanction-for-contaminated-supplement/
"Since then, I have spent countless hours, and a significant amount of money, to find out what happened." -- from Danileson's statement.

A CIR for DHEA is available. In fact, had Danielson pushed for it, USADA would've paid for it. I think it runs a little less than $1k.
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15 Oct 2016 17:24

Seriously JV??? Unreal, just unreal...

“With Sky, it’s either intentional malevolence, or the other possibility is that they weren’t fully aware of what that action meant because they effectively eliminated anyone with any doping experience in their employment base,” said Jonathan Vaughters, a former rider who confessed to doping and who is the chief executive of the United States-based Cannondale-Drapac cycling team.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/15/sports/cycling/team-sky-bradley-wiggins-doping-therapeutic-exemptions.html?_r=0
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Re:

15 Oct 2016 17:55

Anaconda wrote:Seriously JV??? Unreal, just unreal...

“With Sky, it’s either intentional malevolence, or the other possibility is that they weren’t fully aware of what that action meant because they effectively eliminated anyone with any doping experience in their employment base,” said Jonathan Vaughters, a former rider who confessed to doping and who is the chief executive of the United States-based Cannondale-Drapac cycling team.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/15/sports/cycling/team-sky-bradley-wiggins-doping-therapeutic-exemptions.html?_r=0
yeah. That's some serious crap from jv. Unreal insult to the brain.
And he knows perfectly well what's going on.
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31 Oct 2016 16:20

Oleg responding to JV in the article CN posted today in the comments section..... Priceless! :lol:

Image

Image

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/jonathan-vaughters-the-worldtour-race-to-the-bottom/
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Re:

31 Oct 2016 16:28

Irondan wrote:Oleg responding to JV in the article CN posted today in the comments section..... Priceless! :lol:

Image

Image

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/jonathan-vaughters-the-worldtour-race-to-the-bottom/



I'd love to be proven wrong, but I highly doubt that's the 'real' Oleg.
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