Robert21 wrote: thehog wrote:
I used the term "given context"; which demonstrates you're looking for anyway to given Sutton a pass.
I am not looking to "give Sutton a pass". Rather, I am highlighting the 'guilt must be assumed' mob-rule mentality that seems to take over as soon as someone is accused of 'sexism' these days. (Just look at what happened to Nobel prize winner Tim Hunt for another example.)
As to the 'facts'. Bottom line is we don't know what the facts are, only having the opinions of various parties, all of whom seem to have an agenda to play, to base our own opinions on.
Sorry but that attitude is what has kept the whole macho culture of bullying alive and well for so long.
In so many walks of life the idea is that it is the liberal / PC left sensitive types that complain and they should just suck it up and let the "real" workers get on with doing what is necessary.
Even Tim Hunt admitted his comments were sexist !!!
Just because he never meant to cause offence doesnt mean it was ok. It means he really isn't as smart or thoughtful as he should have been.
Sorry - but in no walk of life is it ok to be a bully. And the fact that as you point out in Robert Millars post, Sutton had a tendency to forget who he was talking to, further points to a bully who thought he was untouchable and would get away with whatever he wanted.
"Not being PC" is now bully speak for being a macho, misogynistic oik. Luckily for the world at large the vast majority of right minded people who have half a brain can see that this is unacceptable and people like that are being booted out of positions of power in civilised countries.
Which is why people like Sutton will go back to Aus and work in a country where it is still ok to go to a pub where women daren't walk into, and brag about kicking the cat and beating the wife.
Finally the reason that we know enough facts to call this out is that there was an enquiry and they did get to enough facts to take action. As has been pointed out, bully type people are clever enough to make sure that all of their actions take place in private and behind closed doors - so the facts can be argued as hearsay and opinion. Most people who are genuine and open and who are in positions of power do not hold all their meetings behind closed doors in one on one situations and are happy to be seen conducting their business.
Personally as a coach I would never have a one on one meeting with a female athlete out of respect for the athlete (who may feel intimidated or uncomfortable in that situation) and out of a sense of preservation for myself so anything I did say or do could not be misconstrued or taken badly and that there would be witnesses to help me prove that I did not do anything untoward or say anything I shouldn't.
Funnily enough this is one of the basic tenets of the British Cycling Coaching qualifications!!!