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The Roche Family and Irish Cycling

The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

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Re: Re:

10 Mar 2017 20:19

TheSpud wrote:
Dan2016 wrote:Stephen Roche will always be a cycling god to me. He won the Tour when I first fell in love with the sport.
I met him once and didn't like him as a person at all.

With that pointless anecdote shared I'll get my coat... :D


Me too - it was the first time a nearly British rider got the Yellow jersey! La Plagne will always be in my memory (incidentally happens to be my favourite ski resort - everytime the coach goes up the hairpins I relive the memories).


How goddam dare you!! :)
The Celts are a proud people.
Nearly British?! That's fighting talk.
Dan2016
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Re: Re:

10 Mar 2017 20:26

fmk_RoI wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:Roche claimed to Kimmage he trained for hours on a slice of toast to try and lose weight. Right of course he did. Not hanging anyone today, but lets be under no illusions, puhleeease.
Not hanging? But definitely twisting. He didn't say he trained on a slice of toast to lose weight. And it wasn't just a slice of toast. Puhleeease, do you have to twist everything?
- What have you eaten today?
- This morning I had toast with a bit of butter with some ginger marmalade.
- One slice of toast?
- Yeah, and a cappuccino.
- That's it?
- Yeah.
- And that was before you went for a ride?
- Yeah, I did two hours.
- You didn't eat during the spin?
- Actually, I did. I stopped for a coffee and it came with a little biscotti.
- And nothing since?
- No, but I'm not hungry. I had a good meal last night.


And there is certainly twisting in the original post.

But a 2 hour ride - not exactly long for a pro cyclist. Be good to understand the context of that day - was it 2 hours early, come back lunch / fuel up and then another few hours later? Or was it just 2 hours?

Context is always important for these comments.
TheSpud
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Re: Re:

10 Mar 2017 20:33

Dan2016 wrote:
TheSpud wrote:
Dan2016 wrote:Stephen Roche will always be a cycling god to me. He won the Tour when I first fell in love with the sport.
I met him once and didn't like him as a person at all.

With that pointless anecdote shared I'll get my coat... :D


Me too - it was the first time a nearly British rider got the Yellow jersey! La Plagne will always be in my memory (incidentally happens to be my favourite ski resort - everytime the coach goes up the hairpins I relive the memories).


How goddam dare you!! :)
The Celts are a proud people.
Nearly British?! That's fighting talk.


I'm Welsh so a pure Celt!

Roche is from Dublin, so not British at all - but close enough in those days! And no offence meant.

Very similar to Barry McGuigan - Irish but a UK citizen and very much adopted as such, even winning Sports Personality 1985.
TheSpud
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Re: Re:

10 Mar 2017 20:59

TheSpud wrote:
Dan2016 wrote:
TheSpud wrote:
Dan2016 wrote:Stephen Roche will always be a cycling god to me. He won the Tour when I first fell in love with the sport.
I met him once and didn't like him as a person at all.

With that pointless anecdote shared I'll get my coat... :D


Me too - it was the first time a nearly British rider got the Yellow jersey! La Plagne will always be in my memory (incidentally happens to be my favourite ski resort - everytime the coach goes up the hairpins I relive the memories).


How goddam dare you!! :)
The Celts are a proud people.
Nearly British?! That's fighting talk.


I'm Welsh so a pure Celt!

Roche is from Dublin, so not British at all - but close enough in those days! And no offence meant.

Very similar to Barry McGuigan - Irish but a UK citizen and very much adopted as such, even winning Sports Personality 1985.


No offense taken Spud, I'm just messing about. :)

And yeah La Plagne stage '87, absolute classic. I remember watching that like it was yesterday. Great memories.

I heard him recounting the story of that stage a few years ago. You probably know the story already: he was stuffed all day, really badly stuffed. When Delgado broke away he knew he would have only one big late effort to try and limit the damage.

In those days the race communications didn't work in the last x number of kilometers on mountain stages. Delgado wouldn't know what was happening behind him in this 'black-out' zone. Roche left his effort to that short window of opportunity, and as you know, drove himself to the point of physical collapse.

I still remember the complete shock from the commentator seeing Roche appearing from the mist just after Delgado crossed the line. It was a genius bit of tactics. A real classic stage. Makes me all nostalgic for the 'good old days'.
Dan2016
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Re: Re:

10 Mar 2017 22:43

Dan2016 wrote:No offense taken Spud, I'm just messing about. :)

And yeah La Plagne stage '87, absolute classic. I remember watching that like it was yesterday. Great memories.

I heard him recounting the story of that stage a few years ago. You probably know the story already: he was stuffed all day, really badly stuffed. When Delgado broke away he knew he would have only one big late effort to try and limit the damage.

In those days the race communications didn't work in the last x number of kilometers on mountain stages. Delgado wouldn't know what was happening behind him in this 'black-out' zone. Roche left his effort to that short window of opportunity, and as you know, drove himself to the point of physical collapse.

I still remember the complete shock from the commentator seeing Roche appearing from the mist just after Delgado crossed the line. It was a genius bit of tactics. A real classic stage. Makes me all nostalgic for the 'good old days'.


That commentator was Phil Liggett -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQojh-wqL04

Go to 1:50 in for the best bit.

Things were 'better' in those days in my view - maybe cos I was a teenager and life was fun and easy ...
TheSpud
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 08:55

Dan2016 wrote:The Celts are a proud people.
Nearly British?! That's fighting talk.


But the Celts (including the Welsh) ARE British, not to be confused with the English, who were later immigrants into the British Isles. The whole King Arthur myth relates to the ancient hope of the British (Celts) that a King of the Britions would one day return and kick out the English who had displaced them and forced them into the peripheries of the British Isles!
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11 Mar 2017 13:50

Roche never has been the sharpest knife in the drawer
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/roche-its-always-the-next-generation-that-pays/
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11 Mar 2017 14:11

Roche likes to pass the problem back to the generation before. Worth noting that Roche and Wiggins were team-mates in Cofidis (2006) and Sky (2015). And that it was to Wiggins Roche turned when he wanted an afterword for his collection of race diaries.
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 14:21

TheSpud wrote:But a 2 hour ride - not exactly long for a pro cyclist. Be good to understand the context of that day - was it 2 hours early, come back lunch / fuel up and then another few hours later? Or was it just 2 hours?
It was the day after Paris-Nice. Technically his first 'rest day' after eight days on the road. The context is easily found if one really wanted to understand it: it's in the interview's intro.
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Re:

11 Mar 2017 14:43

fmk_RoI wrote:Roche never has been the sharpest knife in the drawer
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/roche-its-always-the-next-generation-that-pays/


Or playing to the gullible fans.

Dont expect a rider like Roche to do a Kimmage. Not going to happen. He knows there is no journalistic career for him. He is planning a future in the sport, smart to take a leaf out of the snakeoil salesmens books and speak out of both sides of ones mouth a la Vaughters, Millar and even Brailsford.

Credit to Roche for doing that. The sport is not going to change. It will continue to lurch from scandal to scandal led by the likes of the McQuaids, Cooksons etc who are pocketing as much as they can while ignoring the obvious problems in the sport all the time trying to get onto the IOC gravy train.
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 14:55

Benotti69 wrote:
fmk_RoI wrote:Roche never has been the sharpest knife in the drawer
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/roche-its-always-the-next-generation-that-pays/


Or playing to the gullible fans.
They sent him to Blackrock College. I know which scenario I think is more likely.
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 15:02

fmk_RoI wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:
fmk_RoI wrote:Roche never has been the sharpest knife in the drawer
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/roche-its-always-the-next-generation-that-pays/


Or playing to the gullible fans.
They sent him to Blackrock College. I know which scenario I think is more likely.


You speak as someone who also has 1st hand experience of Blackrock?
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 15:23

Benotti69 wrote:
fmk_RoI wrote:Roche never has been the sharpest knife in the drawer
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/roche-its-always-the-next-generation-that-pays/


Or playing to the gullible fans.

Dont expect a rider like Roche to do a Kimmage. Not going to happen. He knows there is no journalistic career for him. He is planning a future in the sport, smart to take a leaf out of the snakeoil salesmens books and speak out of both sides of ones mouth a la Vaughters, Millar and even Brailsford.

Credit to Roche for doing that. The sport is not going to change. It will continue to lurch from scandal to scandal led by the likes of the McQuaids, Cooksons etc who are pocketing as much as they can while ignoring the obvious problems in the sport all the time trying to get onto the IOC gravy train.


Good point.
It's easy from us out there, behind a computer, to demand that pro or ex-pro riders blow the whistle.
What do we expect?
Most of these guys stopped school quite young and have no real competence or domain of expertise outside of cycling. Let's forget one minute about money, they still want to do something with the rest of their life once they're retired. Cycling is a small world. Why would they burn bridges by going after doping?
Not to mention it would mean go after friends, ex-teamates... I believe it takes a certain state of mind (Kimmage) or specifics motivations (revenge and money à la Landis) to "do a Kimmage."

And in my mouth it's not really a compliment to them to be honest.
If I were in Roche position I don't know excactly what I would do but I know what I wouldn't do : a Kimmage
absolutely_not
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 15:40

Benotti69 wrote:
fmk_RoI wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:
fmk_RoI wrote:Roche never has been the sharpest knife in the drawer
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/roche-its-always-the-next-generation-that-pays/


Or playing to the gullible fans.
They sent him to Blackrock College. I know which scenario I think is more likely.


You speak as someone who also has 1st hand experience of Blackrock?
Inner city scruffs like me don't get to go to Blackrock, not even for the discos.
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 16:04

fmk_RoI wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:
fmk_RoI wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:
fmk_RoI wrote:Roche never has been the sharpest knife in the drawer
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/roche-its-always-the-next-generation-that-pays/


Or playing to the gullible fans.
They sent him to Blackrock College. I know which scenario I think is more likely.


You speak as someone who also has 1st hand experience of Blackrock?
Inner city scruffs like me don't get to go to Blackrock, not even for the discos.


Then why suggest it is a school for dumbasses!
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 16:21

Benotti69 wrote:Then why suggest it is a school for dumbasses!
D'uh, because you don't need to go there to know that? Are you now proposing that we limit knowledge to direct personal experience? Gosh.
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 16:25

fmk_RoI wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:Then why suggest it is a school for dumbasses!
D'uh, because you don't need to go there to know that? Are you now proposing that we limit knowledge to direct personal experience? Gosh.


Got facts or you just spouting more celtic myths.

Private schools in Ireland have a big rugby presence but didn't know the exam results stunk. Maybe you have studied this in depth or work for the Dept of Educ.....

Edit: List of the past pupils of a school for dunces according to Fmk

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Old_Rockmen
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 16:31

Benotti69 wrote:Got facts or you just spouting more celtic myths.
Oh. My. God.
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 16:34

fmk_RoI wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:Got facts or you just spouting more celtic myths.
Oh. My. God.


No facts just prayer.

A good catholic i see. :)
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11 Mar 2017 17:00

Let's cool it a little and get back to the topic at hand please... :)
Darryl Webster wrote:
"Nothing seems to blind peeps as much as patriotism does it!"
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