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Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)

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Re: Re:

22 Apr 2018 11:32

fmk_RoI wrote:
thehog wrote: But again, you should make it in to a blog post or something
You seem to be obsessed with this idea and what I do off this board. I'd talk to someone about it, if I were you.


No not really. Let’s stick on topic and not veer off when you can’t respond to a post, yes? :p
Last edited by thehog on 22 Apr 2018 11:38, edited 1 time in total.
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22 Apr 2018 11:35

Humor .... Incoming:

DB!

Dan!

BENSON!!!!

Can you throw a mop down here, please!!!

There's so much frickin EGO on the floor here, this morning ... don't know how many people have slipped and bonked their elbows.

How we spost to get our work done, man!?! We're right in the middle of breaking camp.

Thanks in advance, man.

Cheers
Last edited by Alpe73 on 22 Apr 2018 11:36, edited 1 time in total.
Alpe73
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22 Apr 2018 11:36

I read Betsy’s Facebook posts just now. Jesus.

I know she likes to think anyone who criticizes her is doing lance’s Work for him and most be trying to impress lance but I’ve never followed lance nor has he ever followed me. I also don’t follow Johan or vice versa. Lance reminds me of a robot who has to ask himself how a normal human being should react in this situation.
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Re: Re:

22 Apr 2018 11:39

thehog wrote:
rick james wrote:LOL, Now Betsy is the enemy


No, not really. I’m not sure what she is. Her recent Facebook post around Lance was that he referred to his fiancée as his wife and this wasn’t in line with gods principles! Taking issue with his children born out of wedlock is right up their with the rightest of right wing republicans. Stirring stuff.


Rancor and a supple rosary ... is another nasty cocktail ... really nasty.
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Re: Re:

22 Apr 2018 11:39

thehog wrote:
fmk_RoI wrote:
thehog wrote: But again, you should make it in to a blog post or something
You seem to be obsessed with this idea and what I do off this board. I'd talk to someone about it, if I were you.


No not really. Let’s stick on topic and not veer off when you can’t respond to a post, yes? :p
Oh. My. ****. God. Have you no shame?
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Re: Re:

22 Apr 2018 11:41

Alpe73 wrote:
thehog wrote:
rick james wrote:LOL, Now Betsy is the enemy


No, not really. I’m not sure what she is. Her recent Facebook post around Lance was that he referred to his fiancée as his wife and this wasn’t in line with gods principles! Taking issue with his children born out of wedlock is right up their with the rightest of right wing republicans. Stirring stuff.


Rancor and a supple rosary ... is another nasty cocktail ... really nasty.


Who knows what its all supposed to mean. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but...... sheesh :)
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Re:

22 Apr 2018 11:42

Digger wrote:I know she likes to think anyone who criticizes her is doing lance’s Work for him and most be trying to impress lance
In all seriousness, this is the worst thing about all of this: for too many people it is black and white, for too many people it's if you're not with us you're ag'in us.
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Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession

22 Apr 2018 11:43



Take Team Sky, from Manchester, England. “Team Sky looks exactly like what we were doing—exactly,” Landis said, referring to its current dominance of the cycling world. “So they were able to do that without drugs, but we weren’t? People haven’t evolved over the last eight years.” Sky has won five of the last six Tours, but the legitimacy of its champions has come under scrutiny.


From the Landis article, the Sky comments are interesting. Glad he can call a spade a spade which Armstrong can’t or won’t do on Sky.
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Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession

22 Apr 2018 11:53

thehog wrote:


Take Team Sky, from Manchester, England. “Team Sky looks exactly like what we were doing—exactly,” Landis said, referring to its current dominance of the cycling world. “So they were able to do that without drugs, but we weren’t? People haven’t evolved over the last eight years.” Sky has won five of the last six Tours, but the legitimacy of its champions has come under scrutiny.


From the Landis article, the Sky comments are interesting. Glad he can call a spade a spade which Armstrong can’t or won’t do on Sky.


Article is a piece of romantic shyte ... Clinic has an appetite for sugared donuts. Keeps confirmation bias chubby as she goes.
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Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession

22 Apr 2018 11:59

Alpe73 wrote:
thehog wrote:


Take Team Sky, from Manchester, England. “Team Sky looks exactly like what we were doing—exactly,” Landis said, referring to its current dominance of the cycling world. “So they were able to do that without drugs, but we weren’t? People haven’t evolved over the last eight years.” Sky has won five of the last six Tours, but the legitimacy of its champions has come under scrutiny.


From the Landis article, the Sky comments are interesting. Glad he can call a spade a spade which Armstrong can’t or won’t do on Sky.


Article is a piece of romantic shyte ... Clinic has an appetite for sugared donuts. Keeps confirmation bias chubby as she goes.


That’s one way to look at it but it’s a lot more than that, I think you know that but you have your style to maintain.
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22 Apr 2018 13:22

I just passed 2 kidney stones that were HUGE. Took a month! True story.

I hope this helps everyone heal and move on, as my urinary tract is doing right now.

Good post ChewbaccaDefense!
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Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession

22 Apr 2018 13:44

Mike McCann, SI's legal analyst, had a lot of articles on LA preceding and right after the Reasoned Decision. Here's his take on the settlement:

No matter the rebuttals Armstrong raised, he knew that the government usually wins its false claim cases or at least negotiates a settlement in which the defendant must pay a great deal of money. According to one recent analysis of false claim cases where the government has intervened, approximately 95% lead to a favorable judgment or settlement. These realities likely played a motivating force in Armstrong’s decision to settle in spite of his rebuttals and in spite of the fact that so few qui tam defendants possess the level of resources necessary to retain a legal team of top attorneys as Armstrong had assembled.


For its part, the Justice Department also had plenty of reason to settle after six years of going after Armstrong. As explained above, the government’s case was by no means airtight, particularly in regard to proving that Armstrong harmed USPS. A de facto loss in a trial this fall would have been a setback for the federal government. After all, the government had pursued Armstrong to stress that those who do business with the federal government must fulfill the contractual obligations. Losing to Armstrong would have sent the wrong message in a high-profile trial.


https://www.si.com/cycling/2018/04/21/lance-armstrong-settled-us-government-lawsuit
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22 Apr 2018 14:18

Should be noted that the Fed is not wildly popular these days. And LA exempliflies the neoliberal/neocon bootstrap story if spun well.
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Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession

22 Apr 2018 15:08

Merckx index wrote:Mike McCann, SI's legal analyst, had a lot of articles on LA preceding and right after the Reasoned Decision. Here's his take on the settlement:

No matter the rebuttals Armstrong raised, he knew that the government usually wins its false claim cases or at least negotiates a settlement in which the defendant must pay a great deal of money. According to one recent analysis of false claim cases where the government has intervened, approximately 95% lead to a favorable judgment or settlement. These realities likely played a motivating force in Armstrong’s decision to settle in spite of his rebuttals and in spite of the fact that so few qui tam defendants possess the level of resources necessary to retain a legal team of top attorneys as Armstrong had assembled.


For its part, the Justice Department also had plenty of reason to settle after six years of going after Armstrong. As explained above, the government’s case was by no means airtight, particularly in regard to proving that Armstrong harmed USPS. A de facto loss in a trial this fall would have been a setback for the federal government. After all, the government had pursued Armstrong to stress that those who do business with the federal government must fulfill the contractual obligations. Losing to Armstrong would have sent the wrong message in a high-profile trial.


https://www.si.com/cycling/2018/04/21/lance-armstrong-settled-us-government-lawsuit


Armstrong offered $5m way back when and it was rejected. The government has deep pockets and strong investigative powers. Regardless most civil suits settle just before trial. Nothing unusual at the end of the day.

Bruyneel is fighting his ten year ban and has a book on the way as does Armstrong. I think everyone is exhausted by it all, not really much more to know about what transpired unless LA/JB want to give us the truth on he UCIs collusion.
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Re: Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession

22 Apr 2018 23:35

thehog wrote:
Merckx index wrote:Mike McCann, SI's legal analyst, had a lot of articles on LA preceding and right after the Reasoned Decision. Here's his take on the settlement:

No matter the rebuttals Armstrong raised, he knew that the government usually wins its false claim cases or at least negotiates a settlement in which the defendant must pay a great deal of money. According to one recent analysis of false claim cases where the government has intervened, approximately 95% lead to a favorable judgment or settlement. These realities likely played a motivating force in Armstrong’s decision to settle in spite of his rebuttals and in spite of the fact that so few qui tam defendants possess the level of resources necessary to retain a legal team of top attorneys as Armstrong had assembled.


For its part, the Justice Department also had plenty of reason to settle after six years of going after Armstrong. As explained above, the government’s case was by no means airtight, particularly in regard to proving that Armstrong harmed USPS. A de facto loss in a trial this fall would have been a setback for the federal government. After all, the government had pursued Armstrong to stress that those who do business with the federal government must fulfill the contractual obligations. Losing to Armstrong would have sent the wrong message in a high-profile trial.


https://www.si.com/cycling/2018/04/21/lance-armstrong-settled-us-government-lawsuit


Armstrong offered $5m way back when and it was rejected. The government has deep pockets and strong investigative powers. Regardless most civil suits settle just before trial. Nothing unusual at the end of the day.

Bruyneel is fighting his ten year ban and has a book on the way as does Armstrong. I think everyone is exhausted by it all, not really much more to know about what transpired unless LA/JB want to give us the truth on he UCIs collusion.


Don't need it. Clinic can just make it up.
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23 Apr 2018 11:57

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/lance-armstrong-to-podcast-from-giro-ditalia-in-israel-and-tour-of-california-after-dollar-5m-settlement/

If Lance's and JB's coverage of the Giro (just the P and first 2 stages?) is as good as his TDF "Stages" coverage last year ... will be great stuff. I wish them well.
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23 Apr 2018 13:40

'End of an Error'

https://pvcycling.wordpress.com/2018/04/23/end-of-an-error-2/#comments

Seth Davidsons take on the settlement. I would say he is pretty damn close to the bone.
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23 Apr 2018 14:25

He knows the facts of civil suits as do many. High marks for the armchair psychology. Given that he expresses himself like the sort of juvenile inner bro that armstrong appealed to and doesn’t have a story that anyone wants, I’m not going to take his remarks on writing to the bank.
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Re:

23 Apr 2018 14:26

Benotti69 wrote:'End of an Error'

https://pvcycling.wordpress.com/2018/04/23/end-of-an-error-2/#comments

Seth Davidsons take on the settlement. I would say he is pretty damn close to the bone.
Let's play math:
If Lance started with something around $125M, and lost $100M including legal fees, it’s easy to see that the only money he has left are his two homes ($9.25M in Aspen, $7.5M in Austin), and the balance that he has stuck away in retirement accounts to insulate himself from bankruptcy should he really lose all the marbles. In fact, in his settlement agreement, he promises to make the payments within one year and to put a lien on his Austin home as collateral, guaranteeing that he will make the payments. Should the home sell before his settlement payments are made, he will collateralize his home in Aspen, again as a guarantee. I don’t think that Bill Gates would have to put a lien on his home to pay a $6M fine.
The $125m starting point is frequently quoted. Doesn't mean it's right, but it's generally accepted. So let's pretend. He started with $125m.

The $100m lost. There's two sources for that. The oldest is the claim that, on the day he accepted defeat, he threw away $100m in sponsorship contracts. In other words, he threw away $100m in future earnings. Not $100m of the $125m we're pretending he started with.

A second source for the $100m is LA himself, saying that over the last five years this thing has cost him $100m. What he means there, you decide. Actual cost or opportunity cost.

So, is it easy to see that the only money he has left is wrapped up in two houses? I think there is room for a difference of opinion. But it does help that, by the magic of maths, $125m minus $100m is close to the value of the two properties. The Lord works in mysterious ways. So does math.

WRT the lien and the year to pay: we're supposed to believe that this is out of the ordinary. It doesn't sound extraordinary to me. It sounds perfectly normal. But, maybe someone with some knowledge of these things would like to chime in and say how extraordinary it really is.

None of us know what sort of money LA has left. We can all think of a number, multiply it by three, subtract our age, divide it by the amount of change in our pocket and then multiply it by our height in inches. We could all be writing the Sunday Times rich list, if we wanted to. Point is, we're all going to bring our own biases to the calculation. Those of us who want LA to have suffered, we're going to come up with one figure. Those of us who want LA to still be a winner, we're going to come up with another number. Those of us who think it's possible to be rational about all this and sit somewhere in the middle, we're going to come up with another number.

But. Until someone releases the guy's tax files, none of us can have a **** clue what he's really worth. All we can do is play math.
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Re: Re:

23 Apr 2018 14:39

fmk_RoI wrote:
Benotti69 wrote:'End of an Error'

https://pvcycling.wordpress.com/2018/04/23/end-of-an-error-2/#comments

Seth Davidsons take on the settlement. I would say he is pretty damn close to the bone.
Let's play math:
If Lance started with something around $125M, and lost $100M including legal fees, it’s easy to see that the only money he has left are his two homes ($9.25M in Aspen, $7.5M in Austin), and the balance that he has stuck away in retirement accounts to insulate himself from bankruptcy should he really lose all the marbles. In fact, in his settlement agreement, he promises to make the payments within one year and to put a lien on his Austin home as collateral, guaranteeing that he will make the payments. Should the home sell before his settlement payments are made, he will collateralize his home in Aspen, again as a guarantee. I don’t think that Bill Gates would have to put a lien on his home to pay a $6M fine.
The $125m starting point is frequently quoted. Doesn't mean it's right, but it's generally accepted. So let's pretend. He started with $125m.

The $100m lost. There's two sources for that. The oldest is the claim that, on the day he accepted defeat, he threw away $100m in sponsorship contracts. In other words, he threw away $100m in future earnings. Not $100m of the $125m we're pretending he started with.

A second source for the $100m is LA himself, saying that over the last five years this thing has cost him $100m. What he means there, you decide. Actual cost or opportunity cost.

So, is it easy to see that the only money he has left is wrapped up in two houses? I think there is room for a difference of opinion. But it does help that, by the magic of maths, $125m minus $100m is close to the value of the two properties. The Lord works in mysterious ways. So does math.

WRT the lien and the year to pay: we're supposed to believe that this is out of the ordinary. It doesn't sound extraordinary to me. It sounds perfectly normal. But, maybe someone with some knowledge of these things would like to chime in and say how extraordinary it really is.

None of us know what sort of money LA has left. We can all think of a number, multiply it by three, subtract our age, divide it by the amount of change in our pocket and then multiply it by our height in inches. We could all be writing the Sunday Times rich list, if we wanted to. Point is, we're all going to bring our own biases to the calculation. Those of us who want LA to have suffered, we're going to come up with one figure. Those of us who want LA to still be a winner, we're going to come up with another number. Those of us who think it's possible to be rational about all this and sit somewhere in the middle, we're going to come up with another number.

But. Until someone releases the guy's tax files, none of us can have a **** clue what he's really worth. All we can do is play math.


We can assume he has at least $5m. :D

Iirc, he was a pretty savvy investor when he was racing. He’s probably better now than then. Depending on his portfolio - for a guy his age - he’s likely done reasonably well. I’ll imagine his net worth consists of substantially more than his real estate holdings. Not sure if he still has Mellow Johnnies or not but I think that place probably helps him pay bills. I’ll guess even further with the idea he probably has multiple streams of income from all sorts of business ventures. Wasn’t he a Honey Stinger equity holder?

$5M will hurt him... probably more on the pride side than the financial side. My $0.02.
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