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Dr Steve Peters - Is he really just a confidence trickster?

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17 Mar 2013 01:21

peace in middle east wrote:Is this known?
Jan van Eijden, now full-time coach of BC and Victoria Pendleton's coach in 2008 and 2012, was removed from the German WC squad in 2000 for high hematocrit values.
The UCI gave him a "[SIZE="5"]Sondergenehmigung[/SIZE]" so that he could start all the same.

http://www.rp-online.de/sport/jan-van-eijden-ist-den-doping-makel-los-1.1546407

Is BC a ticking bomb, or what?

This inner chimp thing is crazy by the way.

love the handle, that would sound like a Arbiter, BPC, Polish sig unless I did not read the post...

love those German portmanteaus

Ully had a problem with those, if the offseason donuts had rid him of the portman2 he could have been a champion.
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17 Mar 2013 02:05

mastersracer wrote:The notion of a reptilian brain (part of MacLean's triune brain theory from the 60s) is outdated. The basal ganglia (which MacLean identified with the reptilian brain) is in fact an extremely flexible behavioral system that is nowadays identified with a 'habit' system in the brain, which uses model-free reinforcement learning (Temporal Difference learning, etc.) to build associations between actions and values.

The idea of an 'inner chimp' is also pretty vacuous, as much of what Peters dismisses as irrational and emotional is in fact highly adaptive. Proper neuroscientists and researchers working in judgment and decision-making refer to it as an intuitive system, which is contrasted with a deliberative system, but do not put the deliberative system on a pinnacle the way Peters does (which is very old-fashioned). Depending on the information available in a particular decision context, the output of the intuitive system is normatively a better guide to decision-making than the deliberative system.



Martin hope you are reading ;)

martinvickers wrote:
'Evidence' of this? Or just some fun pop psych 101?

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“Those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it.”

[/SIZE][/SIZE][/SIZE]
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17 Mar 2013 02:07

peace in middle east wrote:
Is BC a ticking bomb, or what?

This inner chimp thing is crazy by the way.


I give you 2 weeks, at most.

Martin, intuition at work.
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17 Mar 2013 02:18

horsinabout wrote:He isn't a sport psychologist he's a psyciatrist there is a difference.



The noteworthy difference in this context is that psychiatrists (can) prescribe drugs.
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17 Mar 2013 05:06

My football team Liverpool FC have been using him...

Basically its up to the players and staff if they want to speak to him... no-one has to speak to him if they dont want to.

2 players last season bought in for big fees during the previous summer - Stuart Downing (£20mill) and Jordan Henderson(£16mill) both had utterly torrid first seasons at the club, they were both hopeless, Downing is an experienced pro whilst Henderson was/is just a youngster.

Both are clearly confidence players... i have no idea why any club is interested in this type of player unless they are hugely talented which Downing isn't, hes never shown the ability to be a top tier player the crazy money paid for him suggests he is, Henderson is young and does at least have the potential to be one i guess.

Anyway both have had much better seasons this season, you could say they couldn't of gotton any worse, but still they have been so much better especially Henderson, they were both rightfully out of favour at the start of this season but now are regulars in the first team, guaranteed if any of the Liverpool players have spoken to Peters these 2 would of been top of the list.

I agree with the OP, he is a confidence trickster in a way, a better way of putting it is a confidence manipulator from what i can see, certainly not a bad thing, if he can get certain Liverpool players playing better then im happy.
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17 Mar 2013 08:11

Anyone who has read Pendelton's autobiography can be in no doubt about his value. And he's no con man either.

Brailsford was looking to get Viccy ready for the WC in the early noughties, and Peters told him, its going to take much more than a year to get her put back together again
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17 Mar 2013 08:32

Like many others I'm suspicious of Skys stage race performances. However, I bought Peters book try to help me manage my depression and anxiety. Though the terms in the book are simplistic I found it very useful to understand what was going on in my mind and manage my emotions. Confidence trickster maybe, but so much of psychology is about confidence, expectation and anxiety. SSRI drugs have bad side effects on many (don't know why the **** Riis thought taking them could do no harm) and in my opinion no better than placebos, so anything that helps with a cognitive based therapy has the thumbs up from me along with a decent exercise regime.
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17 Mar 2013 09:05

WHile he may be funy in his ways cant say hes part of any sort of doping. To be fair cyclking is a lot more in the mind than many might think, digging in is a lot with stopping your brain from telling you to quit.
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17 Mar 2013 11:12

warrenfuk wrote:Like many others I'm suspicious of Skys stage race performances. However, I bought Peters book try to help me manage my depression and anxiety. Though the terms in the book are simplistic I found it very useful to understand what was going on in my mind and manage my emotions. Confidence trickster maybe, but so much of psychology is about confidence, expectation and anxiety. SSRI drugs have bad side effects on many (don't know why the **** Riis thought taking them could do no harm) and in my opinion no better than placebos, so anything that helps with a cognitive based therapy has the thumbs up from me along with a decent exercise regime.


This post and it's replies such as this one, more than any others is why I don't like Dr Peters Modus operandi. Here we have a Dr of psychiatry, who should be subject to the Hypocratic Oath and ethics therein. Selling what appears to be out moded methods in psychiatry, on the strength of reported involvement and betterment of elite athletes in sports performance, mainly in cycling Olympic success stories.

Depression can be for some a serious and debilitating illness, and in the uk at least, very underfunded. And here you have a Dr appearing to follow the money and possible doping in sport, selling success and happiness to those at their most vulnerable, using trite and derisery models, all of which for me is NOT beyond reproach.
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17 Mar 2013 11:24

horsinabout wrote:This post and it's replies such as this one, more than any others is why I don't like Dr Peters Modus operandi. Here we have a Dr of psychiatry, who should be subject to the Hypocratic Oath and ethics therein. Selling what appears to be out moded methods in psychiatry, on the strength of reported involvement and betterment of elite athletes in sports performance, mainly in cycling Olympic success stories.

Depression can be for some a serious and debilitating illness, and in the uk at least, very underfunded. And here you have a Dr appearing to follow the money and possible doping in sport, selling success and happiness to those at their most vulnerable, which for me is NOT beyond reproach.

So someone who suffers from depression says they found the book useful and give it a thumbs up. Yet you use that post as proof that someone is purely in it for the money?

As far as I can see the book does not promote itself as a cure for depression.

I think I have read enough of your posts to realise you are trolling. I, for one, won't be biting again.
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17 Mar 2013 11:25

horsinabout wrote:This post and it's replies such as this one, more than any others is why I don't like Dr Peters Modus operandi. Here we have a Dr of psychiatry, who should be subject to the Hypocratic Oath and ethics therein. Selling what appears to be out moded methods in psychiatry, on the strength of reported involvement and betterment of elite athletes in sports performance, mainly in cycling Olympic success stories.

Depression can be for some a serious and debilitating illness, and in the uk at least, very underfunded. And here you have a Dr appearing to follow the money and possible doping in sport, selling success and happiness to those at their most vulnerable, which for me is NOT beyond reproach.


Just bought the book (no I'm not depressed) and intend to read it just to gain an insight and perhaps guide to bettering performance through training of the mind, rather than just the physical. In my opinion the mind needs training as much as the physical aspects to attain best performances. Interested to see how Dr Peters tackles the subject. I think it's rather unfair to see this book in the context of a self treatment book for depression just because one person has used it as such. For me it's about improving my cycling, simple as. As they say, every little bit helps (marginal gains!!:)).

Once I've read the book though I'll see if my opinion differs.
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17 Mar 2013 12:18

manafana wrote:WHile he may be funy in his ways cant say hes part of any sort of doping. To be fair cyclking is a lot more in the mind than many might think, digging in is a lot with stopping your brain from telling you to quit.


Laughable that anyone thinks he is to be honest, who next? the tealady?
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17 Mar 2013 12:23

Don't be late Pedro wrote:So someone who suffers from depression says they found the book useful and give it a thumbs up. Yet you use that post as proof that someone is purely in it for the money?

As far as I can see the book does not promote itself as a cure for depression.

I think I have read enough of your posts to realise you are trolling. I, for one, won't be biting again.


Ye what a weird post, anything that can help depression is a good thing, i dont read here much, thank god for that.
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17 Mar 2013 12:38

horsinabout wrote:This post and it's replies such as this one, more than any others is why I don't like Dr Peters Modus operandi. Here we have a Dr of psychiatry, who should be subject to the Hypocratic Oath and ethics therein. Selling what appears to be out moded methods in psychiatry, on the strength of reported involvement and betterment of elite athletes in sports performance, mainly in cycling Olympic success stories.

Depression can be for some a serious and debilitating illness, and in the uk at least, very underfunded. And here you have a Dr appearing to follow the money and possible doping in sport, selling success and happiness to those at their most vulnerable, using trite and derisery models, all of which for me is NOT beyond reproach.


Thanks for your expert opinion, but I've been down the long road of NHS drug treatment and I'm no longer vulnerable thanks but given the choice of nasty drugs of dubious benefit and some cognitive behavioural therapy I know what route I would go. Of course it would be ideal for everyone to have the time and attention that CBT requires but a 10 mins with a GP is all most get and a prescription for sleeping pills or SSRIs. Many of the models that Peters uses are not so disimilar to those used CBT treatment in the NHS, it's just a shame that you have to reach a crisis before this treatment is provided. 'using trite and derisery models' call it that if you wish (and some things are a bit silly in the book) but if many find some of it very helpful then so what?
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17 Mar 2013 15:49

Cavendash wrote:Laughable that anyone thinks he is to be honest, who next? the tealady?

Yup. When you think about it, the tealady does have to be considered a prime suspect.

As does a chimp up to mischief.
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17 Mar 2013 19:37

Cavendash wrote:Ye what a weird post, anything that can help depression is a good thing, i dont read here much, thank god for that.

do you hate cancer?
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17 Mar 2013 19:50

coinneach wrote:Anyone who has read Pendelton's autobiography can be in no doubt about his value. And he's no con man either.

Brailsford was looking to get Viccy ready for the WC in the early noughties, and Peters told him, its going to take much more than a year to get her put back together again

after readin Armstrong's autobiography, and hearing about Oscar Pistolero, would one ever believe what they read in print on these tomes of hagiography and marketing newspeak?
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17 Mar 2013 19:51

Don't be late Pedro wrote:So someone who suffers from depression says they found the book useful and give it a thumbs up. Yet you use that post as proof that someone is purely in it for the money?

As far as I can see the book does not promote itself as a cure for depression.

I think I have read enough of your posts to realise you are trolling. I, for one, won't be biting again.

false dichotomy/ not either/or dilemma
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18 Mar 2013 08:31

Don't be late Pedro wrote:So someone who suffers from depression says they found the book useful and give it a thumbs up. Yet you use that post as proof that someone is purely in it for the money?

As far as I can see the book does not promote itself as a cure for depression.

I think I have read enough of your posts to realise you are trolling. I, for one, won't be biting again.


l no more troll than anyone else on here.

I have never implied that Dr Peters book is for mental health. The point is both missed and misinterpreted. He is claiming and those he has helped are claiming to have enhanced their performance, this is subjective. Dr Peters is a psychiatrist. I don't believe that Peter's is doping athletes, but if there is doping he will know about it, and this is enough. It is a fact he is following the money in sport.

I don't know if you are a fan of sky or cycling in general. You may even love cycling. However, it has become nothing more than entertainment, and is all about money and getting the widest audience possible. Wiggins, Brailsford and all on the bandwagon don't care about the fans, they are in it for themselves 110%, they want the fans mind, money and soul, for some they may give it willingly. They want the fans on their bandwagan too, as paying spectators. And will give you any old BS to get you to believe that what you are watching is real.

The forum is the only place I know that is pointing out some of Sky's BS.

Have what ever opinion you like - just don't misinterpret what I write.

Yet again another FUBAR thread.
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18 Mar 2013 08:50

Don't be late Pedro wrote:So someone who suffers from depression says they found the book useful and give it a thumbs up.


wait

how many athletes
are on

selective seratonin re-uptake inhibitors.



this is another piece of brilliance from brailsford. inner chimps, swimming coaches, and psychiatrists. it sounds like an indie band releasing an LP

S
S
RU
I
's
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