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Dave Brailsford - cycling genius

The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

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22 Dec 2014 00:19

Girls, girls, mommy and daddy think you're both pretty.
User avatar yespatterns
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22 Dec 2014 00:59

The Hitch wrote:So you won't address Bilharzia?

You will just ignore it?

If you just flat out ignore any real arguments against Sky then you are being extremely dishonest in your claims and posting behaviour. Complaining about posting and calling people trolls, getting involved in flame wars at any chance, but refusing to actually take part in the real issues debates and arguments.


FFS, how many times has it been discussed in the clinic, I am going to say one thing on Bilharzia? That it is a disease that Froome almost certainly had.

It proves nothing either way and because non experts in sub tropical diseases don't always get all the facts about it correct then different explanations from those non experts on sub tropical diseases are quite normal. People often make contradictory statements especially on things they don't fully understand.
del1962
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22 Dec 2014 01:12

Almost?





......
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22 Dec 2014 01:42

del1962 wrote:FFS, how many times has it been discussed in the clinic,

A lot. But you have never weighed in which made me very surprised to see you now claim you have dismissed the arguments against Froome when you have never even addressed the most damning evidence against him.

That it is a disease that Froome almost certainly had..


No one said he never had it. That is a totally meaningless sentence. It has nothing to do with the actual discussion since the possibility of Froome having had it, isn't the Red mark against him.

It proves nothing either way and because non experts in sub tropical diseases don't always get all the facts about it correct then different explanations from those non experts on sub tropical diseases are quite normal.


But that is 100% incorrect and easily disproven. The claims against Froome are fully backed by a mountain of evidence, including all manner of university papers into the subject, all governmental health websites, text books and the top experts at the top institutions.

So again. How can you dismiss the clinic and the arguments made in it, if you flat out refuse to actually address or take part in any of the debates?:confused:
The Hitch: Winner 2013 Vuelta cq game. Winner, Velorooms prediction game 2012, 2013. 2nd all time cq rankings.
The Father of Clean Cycling, Christophe Bassons wrote:When I look at cycling today, I get the impression that history is repeating itself: riders who are supposed to be rouleurs are climbing passes at the front of the race, and those who are supposed to be climbers are riding time trials at more than 50 kilometres per hour.

The story is beginning again, just as it did 14 years ago


journalist with integrity.
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22 Dec 2014 01:50

Congratulations are in order for Pinarello, Jaguar,
Sir Dave Brailsford and Team SKY
on their recent
win at the very prestigious 2014 London Design Awards.
http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2014/12/09/120553-pinarello-jaguar-and-team-sky-win-gold-london-design-awards.html

Well done to all those involved in the project!!
Team GB 2016: victoRIOus, happy and gloRIOus
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22 Dec 2014 03:41

Well this is the clinic so congratulations to brailsfraud for hiring the chemist who looks after froome, truely an outstanding job.
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22 Dec 2014 04:17

What really irks me about Brailsfraud is he dopes up two complete lemons and effectively ruins two TDFs.

First donkey off the rank is Wiggons in 2012, who effectively bores his competitors to submission. Then in 2013 we have froomedog who has the tactical aplomb of a sponge pudding which does make for some exciting racing but his spastic style is just so ugly.

At least Vino and Riis have the good sense to super charge riders with some panache.
ralphbert
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22 Dec 2014 05:22

ralphbert wrote:What really irks me about Brailsfraud is he dopes up two complete lemons and effectively ruins two TDFs.

First donkey off the rank is Wiggons in 2012, who effectively bores his competitors to submission. Then in 2013 we have froomedog who has the tactical aplomb of a sponge pudding which does make for some exciting racing but his spastic style is just so ugly.

At least Vino and Riis have the good sense to super charge riders with some panache.


I know, tell me about it. They should have picked Thomas. He'd be be a superstar if was doping like Wiggo/Froome.

Froome is just so beige. And looked terrible when he wasn't doping and hanging into motorbikse, now he looks even worse.
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22 Dec 2014 10:44

oldcrank wrote:Congratulations are in order for Pinarello, Jaguar,
Sir Dave Brailsford and Team SKY
on their recent
win at the very prestigious 2014 London Design Awards.
http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2014/12/09/120553-pinarello-jaguar-and-team-sky-win-gold-london-design-awards.html

Well done to all those involved in the project!!


why is this in the clinic?
bewildered
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22 Dec 2014 11:48

ralphbert wrote:What really irks me about Brailsfraud is he dopes up two complete lemons and effectively ruins two TDFs.

First donkey off the rank is Wiggons in 2012, who effectively bores his competitors to submission. Then in 2013 we have froomedog who has the tactical aplomb of a sponge pudding which does make for some exciting racing but his spastic style is just so ugly.

At least Vino and Riis have the good sense to super charge riders with some panache.


thehog wrote:I know, tell me about it. They should have picked Thomas. He'd be be a superstar if was doping like Wiggo/Froome.

Froome is just so beige. And looked terrible when he wasn't doping and hanging into motorbikse, now he looks even worse.



This glorification of people like vino and riis is annoying and feeds the trolls ammunition. It's bs. There is absolutely nothing romantic about vino riis ricco etcetera. That you like them more for totally non clinic reasons has nothing to do with the clinic. All of them are totally untrustworthy individuals who have gotten rich by being dirty. In the case of the two you mention have a proven track record of lying for.decades both as riders and managers.

I can kind of understand having sympathy for small time dopers who confessed or were scaoegoated but these 2 are no different to the sky mob.
The Hitch: Winner 2013 Vuelta cq game. Winner, Velorooms prediction game 2012, 2013. 2nd all time cq rankings.
The Father of Clean Cycling, Christophe Bassons wrote:When I look at cycling today, I get the impression that history is repeating itself: riders who are supposed to be rouleurs are climbing passes at the front of the race, and those who are supposed to be climbers are riding time trials at more than 50 kilometres per hour.

The story is beginning again, just as it did 14 years ago


journalist with integrity.
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22 Dec 2014 11:57

del1962 wrote:This is the second time in this thread you have accused me of trolling, why don't you ignore me or **** off down the hole you came from, you sad little man

Oh and if there are any mods aroiund, why don't you deal with these accuastions and other harrasment against me by theHiig and Blackcat too, because as far as I can see you (the mods) are about as much use as a chocolate fireguard.


After I ate my pizza I sat down and watched highlights of Bertie dropping Froome . It was really good to watch the greatest GT rider of his generation getting back to but not quite on top form:D
ray j willings
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22 Dec 2014 13:47

hi folks, is someone calling me? i am here to help
"Hitler … didn't even sink to using chemical weapons."
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22 Dec 2014 13:49

The Hitch wrote:This glorification of people like vino and riis is annoying and feeds the trolls ammunition. It's bs. There is absolutely nothing romantic about vino riis ricco etcetera. That you like them more for totally non clinic reasons has nothing to do with the clinic. All of them are totally untrustworthy individuals who have gotten rich by being dirty. In the case of the two you mention have a proven track record of lying for.decades both as riders and managers.

I can kind of understand having sympathy for small time dopers who confessed or were scaoegoated but these 2 are no different to the sky mob.

you are not partial to ricky riccio Hitch?
"Hitler … didn't even sink to using chemical weapons."
User avatar blackcat
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22 Dec 2014 20:09

The Hitch wrote:This glorification of people like vino and riis is annoying and feeds the trolls ammunition. It's bs. There is absolutely nothing romantic about vino riis ricco etcetera. That you like them more for totally non clinic reasons has nothing to do with the clinic. All of them are totally untrustworthy individuals who have gotten rich by being dirty. In the case of the two you mention have a proven track record of lying for.decades both as riders and managers.

I can kind of understand having sympathy for small time dopers who confessed or were scaoegoated but these 2 are no different to the sky mob.


But isn't the lying and the cheating been part of the doping culture of cycling. They could hardly say the were doping and being it's use is almost required then behaving in such a manner in the pro sports environment would just seem and feel normal. Have you noticed how the dopers like Ricco and Di luca just tell it like it is and do not try to sugar coat it in a way like Millar has "boo hooo me , it was not really my fault"

I'm def more with Ricco . He's more honest about his cheating even though he's not the smartest cookie.
ray j willings
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23 Dec 2014 05:34

ray j willings wrote:But isn't the lying and the cheating been part of the doping culture of cycling. They could hardly say the were doping and being it's use is almost required then behaving in such a manner in the pro sports environment would just seem and feel normal. Have you noticed how the dopers like Ricco and Di luca just tell it like it is and do not try to sugar coat it in a way like Millar has "boo hooo me , it was not really my fault"

I'm def more with Ricco . He's more honest about his cheating even though he's not the smartest cookie.

which is why the doping is insidious on the meta level. it cotorts the ethical norm in a way outside the boundaries of cycling.

this, in part, is the negative effect of the puritan Anglophone ethical pov on doping. They have to buy piecemeal from this "virtue". Or holus bolus, like slipstream, and more expedient but still puritan with Sky.

But the cognitive dissonance reigns because they still imbibe dope. It is Shelly frankensteinian
"Hitler … didn't even sink to using chemical weapons."
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12 Jan 2015 10:19

Brailsford acknowledged that Sky’s marginal gains have been adopted by other teams and that those teams have caught up with the British outfit. But he insisted, “Our challenge is to stay ahead of the game. We spent some time thinking about what it is that we in the backroom staff actually enjoy as a group. After a lot of discussion, we came back to the idea that we love that process of development and continuous improvement. Winning is the outcome but it is striving for that outcome that really motivates us.”


lol... what?

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/brailsford-we-want-to-be-the-worlds-best-team
MC: I don’t think Chris fully understood that (Vinokourov) had doped.

CF: No, I knew.

MC: Not fully.
User avatar the sceptic
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genius

12 Jan 2015 10:28

so how does one describe criteria for genius?..............................

surely making tour winners of wiggo/froome qualifies

Mark L
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12 Jan 2015 10:51

ebandit wrote:so how does one describe criteria for genius?..............................

surely making tour winners of wiggo/froome qualifies

Mark L


Indeed, if Brailsford's success is down to doping then he was still beating everyone else on a level playing field. You don't achieve that by being a clueless idiot as many on here seem to think. That said, I cannot stand the guy.
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12 Jan 2015 10:53

ebandit wrote:so how does one describe criteria for genius?..............................

surely making tour winners of wiggo/froome qualifies

Mark L


Brailsford had nothing to do with that. He is the David Brent village idiot who they bring out to spout garbage so skybots can sleep better at night.
MC: I don’t think Chris fully understood that (Vinokourov) had doped.

CF: No, I knew.

MC: Not fully.
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12 Jan 2015 10:53

Bernie's eyesore wrote:Indeed, if Brailsford's success is down to doping then he was still beating everyone else on a level playing field. You don't achieve that by being a clueless idiot as many on here seem to think. That said, I cannot stand the guy.

You also think the playing field was level under Armstrong's reign?
Goodbye, Tommeke; thank you for all you have given us!
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