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Doping In Athletics

The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

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Re: Doping In Athletics

30 Aug 2017 15:24

The basic problem is, how do you encourage people to tell the truth? You need to protect them from the negative consequences of doing so.

This survey uses a clever strategy to make it happen. By introducing a chance that the answer to the doping question is "yes" whether they are doping or not, individuals can be truthful when asked whether they've been doping without their "yes" necessarily indicating that they've been doping.

Even if anonymity would be compromised and the data would be hacked, seeing in that data that an athlete answered "yes" would not be a confession. Because there's a fixed chance, by design, that the response would be "yes" regardless.

Yet when we want to know the fraction of athletes that dope, we can just subtract the noise probability from the fraction of people saying "yes", and that will be an unbiased estimate of the fraction that dopes, provided this setup makes individuals answer truthfully (More realistically, it merely reduces the bias the downwards bias by reducing, but not eliminating, lying).


The statistical cost of this procedure is that the estimator becomes noisier, but with a large enough sample, that doesn't matter.

In theory, you could do the same thing asking just medallists, but because the sample is much smaller, the noise problem would be worse, and in addition, because the sample is smaller and easily googable and recognisable, it might invite unwelcome public speculation about which individuals, if x% of them dope, are the dopers.

Anticipating this, medallists would be more likely to lie regardless of the setup.
User avatar SeriousSam
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30 Aug 2017 15:43

Thanks SS, that was my understanding of it. It might work for finalists and medalists if the sample is large enough (not sure how big it has to be), but the incentive to lie and lower the percentage is greater as it's a smaller group, it's defined and easier to point fingers at.
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User avatar King Boonen
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30 Aug 2017 17:23

Years ago, the basic premise of these was go into a booth.
Toss a coin/roll a die
Heads answer the question part A (doping or whatever sensitive subject)
Tails answer the question part B (did the coin land on tails)

Things have got a bit more sophisticated and a lot of these are done electronically and automatically.
User avatar Catwhoorg
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30 Aug 2017 18:48

I heard the head of ADD (antidoping Denmark) comment on the survey today.

He said the usual stuff:

-Things was bad back then
-Bad leadership back then
-no proper testing back then
-It was to be expected that we would find past issues

It's funny how ,whenever these things come up, it's always a thing of the past.
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30 Aug 2017 19:09

2011 old dirty dopers like Bolt, Rudisha, Farah, not like the clean generation of 2015/2017 of Gatlin, Bolt, Rudisha and Farah.
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09 Sep 2017 04:25

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/olympian-fined-for-steroid-sale-ng-b88592046z

“behaved out of character” when he illegally sold anabolic steroids..."
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13 Sep 2017 07:08

Not only is dope an IOC probelm -

http://www.bbc.com/sport/olympics/41248774
The International Olympic Committee (IOC) has been accused of "doing nothing" about its growing corruption crisis, by senior official **** Pound.

Several IOC officials have been implicated in corruption in 2017.

In the latest case, police last week raided the home of Carlos Nuzman, head of the Brazilian Olympic Committee, as they investigate "strong evidence" of vote-buying to secure Rio's 2016 bid.

"We've taken a severe hit in terms of credibility," Pound told BBC Sport.

"Every time another IOC member is implicated in something potentially nefarious we lose more credibility."

On Monday, IOC president Thomas Bach said the organisation would act on corruption allegations "once evidence is there".

But Canadian Pound, speaking to the BBC's Alex Capstick at an IOC executive board meeting in Lima, Peru, said: "What are we doing taking all these hits and doing nothing about it? We've got to recognise that we haven't done enough.

"If your conduct has put the IOC into disrepute, you should be liable to at least vigorous investigation and potentially sanctioned for it.

"That has not happened."
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Re:

13 Sep 2017 13:51

Robert5091 wrote:Not only is dope an IOC probelm -

http://www.bbc.com/sport/olympics/41248774
The International Olympic Committee (IOC) has been accused of "doing nothing" about its growing corruption crisis, by senior official **** Pound.

Several IOC officials have been implicated in corruption in 2017.

In the latest case, police last week raided the home of Carlos Nuzman, head of the Brazilian Olympic Committee, as they investigate "strong evidence" of vote-buying to secure Rio's 2016 bid.

"We've taken a severe hit in terms of credibility," Pound told BBC Sport.

"Every time another IOC member is implicated in something potentially nefarious we lose more credibility."

On Monday, IOC president Thomas Bach said the organisation would act on corruption allegations "once evidence is there".

But Canadian Pound, speaking to the BBC's Alex Capstick at an IOC executive board meeting in Lima, Peru, said: "What are we doing taking all these hits and doing nothing about it? We've got to recognise that we haven't done enough.

"If your conduct has put the IOC into disrepute, you should be liable to at least vigorous investigation and potentially sanctioned for it.

"That has not happened."


**** Pound is not part any clean solution to sport. Pound said Coe was the man to clean up IAAF??

Coe thinks Federations have 'a role to play' in keeping sport clean! FFS, 'a role to play'.....idiot!
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'dirtiest race in history'

23 Sep 2017 11:29

http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/41371579
'dirtiest race in history'
Former Olympic 1500m champion Asli Cakir Alptekin has been banned for life after a third doping offence.

In 2015, the 32-year-old was stripped of her 2012 Olympic and European titles and suspended for eight years by the Turkish Athletics Federation.

She returned this year after the ban was halved and its start date backdated to 2013, but has since reoffended.

"We are never, ever going to allow doping," said Turkish Athletics Federation chief Fatih Cintimar.

Six of the first nine finishers in the women's 1500m final at the 2012 Olympics have been given drugs bans, leading some to refer to it as the "dirtiest race in history".

Straight after the race, Britain's Lisa Dobriskey, who finished 10th, told BBC Radio 5 live: "I don't believe I'm competing on a level playing field."

Cakir Alptekin previously served a two-year ban following a positive test at the 2004 World Junior Championships.

She finished 11th in the European Champion Clubs Cup Cross Country event in Portugal in February, helping Uskudar Belediyespor win the title.

The nature of her latest offence has not been made public.
Rød pølse - Breakfast of Champions!
"The president is one large S.T.D., and if you’re in close proximity you’re going to get tainted by it.”
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Re: 'dirtiest race in history'

23 Sep 2017 12:44

Robert5091 wrote:http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/41371579
'dirtiest race in history'
Former Olympic 1500m champion Asli Cakir Alptekin has been banned for life after a third doping offence.

In 2015, the 32-year-old was stripped of her 2012 Olympic and European titles and suspended for eight years by the Turkish Athletics Federation.

She returned this year after the ban was halved and its start date backdated to 2013, but has since reoffended.

"We are never, ever going to allow doping," said Turkish Athletics Federation chief Fatih Cintimar.

Six of the first nine finishers in the women's 1500m final at the 2012 Olympics have been given drugs bans, leading some to refer to it as the "dirtiest race in history".

Straight after the race, Britain's Lisa Dobriskey, who finished 10th, told BBC Radio 5 live: "I don't believe I'm competing on a level playing field."

Cakir Alptekin previously served a two-year ban following a positive test at the 2004 World Junior Championships.

She finished 11th in the European Champion Clubs Cup Cross Country event in Portugal in February, helping Uskudar Belediyespor win the title.

The nature of her latest offence has not been made public.



Dirtiest race in history is probably the Seoul 1988 100m men's final...
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23 Sep 2017 12:51

A sad state of affairs when we can argue about the dirtiest race in history.
Rød pølse - Breakfast of Champions!
"The president is one large S.T.D., and if you’re in close proximity you’re going to get tainted by it.”
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27 Sep 2017 08:45

idunno
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Re: 'dirtiest race in history'

27 Sep 2017 09:16

BullsFan22 wrote:
Robert5091 wrote:http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/41371579
'dirtiest race in history'
Former Olympic 1500m champion Asli Cakir Alptekin has been banned for life after a third doping offence.

In 2015, the 32-year-old was stripped of her 2012 Olympic and European titles and suspended for eight years by the Turkish Athletics Federation.

She returned this year after the ban was halved and its start date backdated to 2013, but has since reoffended.

"We are never, ever going to allow doping," said Turkish Athletics Federation chief Fatih Cintimar.

Six of the first nine finishers in the women's 1500m final at the 2012 Olympics have been given drugs bans, leading some to refer to it as the "dirtiest race in history".

Straight after the race, Britain's Lisa Dobriskey, who finished 10th, told BBC Radio 5 live: "I don't believe I'm competing on a level playing field."

Cakir Alptekin previously served a two-year ban following a positive test at the 2004 World Junior Championships.

She finished 11th in the European Champion Clubs Cup Cross Country event in Portugal in February, helping Uskudar Belediyespor win the title.

The nature of her latest offence has not been made public.



Dirtiest race in history is probably the Seoul 1988 100m men's final...


Several of the bolt world and olympic finals are way more dodgy in my eyes. That 2012 800m and some of the city marathon races from the 2009-2015 period as well
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02 Oct 2017 13:36

Brits don't dope
http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/41471489
Image
s/he who has no sin launch the first javelin.
;)
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Re: Doping In Athletics

16 Oct 2017 20:17

Had to smile at this bit from Coe: “Let our imagination run wild,” he proclaimed, warning that purists mightn’t relish athletics being part of the entertainment business but that’s the reality.

Other highlights for me :
Track and field isn’t alone in fighting such cynicism but it is at the forefront of its impact. Anyone able to watch top-flight international athletics entirely at face value has clearly had their credulity gland removed.
and
But athletics needs such a flip. It also needs to acknowledge that for much of the public it has been reduced to little more than a game of guess the pharmaceutical cheat

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/other-sports/athletics-isn-t-staying-relevant-it-s-chasing-relevance-1.3256756
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25 Oct 2017 12:47

User avatar armchairclimber
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25 Oct 2017 14:33

Is the world ever going to find out the truth about Usain Bolt ? or are we witnessing ANOTHER greatest sports cover up ever ? Anything that raises eyebrows in the recent past that anyone has come across ? I'd love to know. thx
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Re: Doping In Athletics

25 Oct 2017 20:26

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/was-sonia-osullivan-cheated-back-in-1993-461530.html

Was Sonia cheated ? Maybe the headline should read were the Chinese doping ? Simple answer is yes...was Sonia doping too ....harder to answer
noddy69
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Re: Doping In Athletics

25 Oct 2017 20:31

noddy69 wrote:http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/was-sonia-osullivan-cheated-back-in-1993-461530.html

Was Sonia cheated ? Maybe the headline should read were the Chinese doping ? Simple answer is yes...was Sonia doping too ....harder to answer
Everything wrong with sports journalism captured beautifully in that headline.
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Re:

26 Oct 2017 01:03

masking_agent wrote:Is the world ever going to find out the truth about Usain Bolt ? or are we witnessing ANOTHER greatest sports cover up ever ? Anything that raises eyebrows in the recent past that anyone has come across ? I'd love to know. thx
Probably not...protected entity? Might be too good of a story (and a money maker) to be tarnished. Kinda like the witness protection program. Lol.
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