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La Plagne 1995: Lotto Riders out of Time Limits (TV Show)

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La Plagne 1995: Lotto Riders out of Time Limits (TV Show)

15 Nov 2016 21:40

http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/660335SAMMIEMOREELSHUMO20161115.png

(Article from Humo)

Belga Sport was a series of TV show on Canvas, public broadcaster in the Northern part of Belgium. It has now been taken over by Telenet. Sadly I can't get Telenet, so impossible to watch the show but interesting things are already revealed by the article.

Sammie Moreels was a youth hero of mine along with Edwig Van Hooydonck and I've long heard about the fact he was one of the Belgian talent to get screwed by the EPO storm. The show programmers seem to suggest likewise. Sammie was 9th at the Tour of Lombardy as a neopro in 1989. 3rd at the GP de Wallonie in 1992 (I was rooting for him at that time, remember that weird race very well, though I was 8). [Edit: correction, He was 9th at the 1991 Tour of Lombardy but 4th and 5th at the Walloon Arrow and Liège-Bastogne-Liège, resp. in 1989 as a neopro.]

The title says The Pancake Generation Comes Back

I think Peter Post referred to a "potato generation" or something of the sort. That is how the Dutch and Belgian generation of the nineties got qualified for poor performances.

"Mario De Clercq and Sammie Moreels didn't lack great legs, they lacked EPO."

In La Plagne on 11 July 1995 (Golden Spurs Day), 4 Lotto riders came out of time limits. Another one had called it quit during the race. Lotto was the laughing stock of the cycling world. [If I remember well, only two Lotto riders finished the Tour of France that year: Andrei Tchmil and Peter Farazijn]

Dan Van Nijverseel, the programmer of the show says that the riders could feel there was something going on.
Certainly since the spring classics in 1995 in which they were dropped as though they had been laying on the sofa for the whole winter. They only didn't know exactly what played a role. Only on the evening after La Plagne they did talk it over for the first time with Jean-Luc Vandenbroucke after the latter had pested against them but he didn't want to believe it. Perhaps he wanted to stick his head in the sand but Vandenbroucke started as DS at a moment there was no talk of EPO and with respect to medical back up Lotto was lagging far behind the rest of the world. There was no team doctor and the riders had only one heart beat monitor that they had to share to each other. For as much as we can tell, they really were in obscurity.


The riders feel that they had been the victims of an injustice. Alex Zulle who won in La Plagne was later caught and punished but he could earn a lot of money in cycling while a rider like Rudy Verdonck had to get back to work after his career. Sammie Moreels finished top5 in Liege-Bastogne-Liege as neopro in 1989 and in what should have been his prime years he was blown away. That insincerity hurts. Plus the image that they were remembered for: "The Pancake Generation", lazy bones who did not live for their sport. This label has shadowed their whole career.

About the fact that Mario De Clercq also was involved in a doping affair later [the Landuyt-Versele Affair along with Museeuw] the show did not investigate. It stops in 1995. But it's clear how hard this La Plagne day affected Mario and he also said he would trade his great palmares in cyclocross for the road career that he's been stolen. The show is not meant to be a doping investigation but rather a human story about these honest riders who could not follow and thus had to keep on living with the blame.

------

It should be said that once Vandenbroucke was promoted from DS to manager he started defending dopers in his team such as Abdujaparov. By the late nineties things had already changed, riders started to perform as if they were doing like everybody else. And all of a sudden, Vandenbroucke got fired by Lotto for the 2000 season.
Last edited by Echoes on 21 Oct 2017 10:14, edited 1 time in total.
Echoes
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Re: La Plagne 1995: Lotto Riders out of Time Limits (TV Show

20 Oct 2017 10:37

The show has been aired on Canvas last September. Unfortunately I missed it on TV but could find a vid on their website: https://www.vrt.be/vrtnu/a-z/belga-sport/7/belga-sport-s7a1/

It can be viewed until 30 November 2017. Brilliant eye-opening piece of television.

Unfortunately they've dropped subtitles. :mad: Since I'm Walloon and only speak Standard Dutch, I'd like to ask any Dutchophone to please help me because those former riders are usually speaking their own local dialects.

All you need to do is create a free account and watch for free.

For instance, I'd like to understand what Rudi Verdonck says about Peter De Clercq at 50'40". All I understood is that he rated Peter a level above him.

Thanks in advance.
Echoes
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Re: La Plagne 1995: Lotto Riders out of Time Limits (TV Show

20 Oct 2017 11:33

Echoes wrote:The show has been aired on Canvas last September. Unfortunately I missed it on TV but could find a vid on their website: https://www.vrt.be/vrtnu/a-z/belga-sport/7/belga-sport-s7a1/

It can be viewed until 30 November 2017. Brilliant eye-opening piece of television.

Unfortunately they've dropped subtitles. :mad: Since I'm Walloon and only speak Standard Dutch, I'd like to ask any Dutchophone to please help me because those former riders are usually speaking their own local dialects.

All you need to do is create a free account and watch for free.

For instance, I'd like to understand what Rudi Verdonck says about Peter De Clercq at 50'40". All I understood is that he rated Peter a level above him.


Thanks in advance.


He says that peter won 3 or 4 semi classics every year so he doesnt get why peter was let go from the team
Lo squalo di messina
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Re: La Plagne 1995: Lotto Riders out of Time Limits (TV Show

20 Oct 2017 16:06

Thank you, Squalo. Much obliged. :)
Echoes
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Re: La Plagne 1995: Lotto Riders out of Time Limits (TV Show

04 Nov 2017 09:57

A few other passages I'd like to understand, please. :)

40'12": Rudi Verdonck says something before saying "It was a bit abnormal at that time".

40'32": Marc Sergeant says that Jean-Luc (Vandenbroucke) was rather naive. Then I don't really understand.

41'14": I don't understand anything at what Sergeant says but at the end "everybody is here better"

44'20": Sammie Moreels says he was really ashamed and then ...

45'33": I don't understand anything at what Rudi Verdonck is saying

47'22": Very first sentence by Mario De Clercq I don't understand. And then he says that for Jean-Luc Vandenbroucke, for the press, for the outside world, the fan themselves, they were the greatest XXXX that were cycling around (he uses a word that probably means "clowns" or something)

47'43": I'd like to understand what Sergeant says

48'22": The journalist Roger De Maertelaere says: "What could they do? They said: 'Figure that out'". Then he said that the guys were almost ... starving?

Thanks in advance to anyone with good command of Dutch in its Belgian variety who can help. ;)
Echoes
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Re: La Plagne 1995: Lotto Riders out of Time Limits (TV Show

04 Nov 2017 20:48

Echoes wrote:A few other passages I'd like to understand, please. :)

40'12": Rudi Verdonck says something before saying "It was a bit abnormal at that time".

40'32": Marc Sergeant says that Jean-Luc (Vandenbroucke) was rather naive. Then I don't really understand.

41'14": I don't understand anything at what Sergeant says but at the end "everybody is here better"

44'20": Sammie Moreels says he was really ashamed and then ...

45'33": I don't understand anything at what Rudi Verdonck is saying

47'22": Very first sentence by Mario De Clercq I don't understand. And then he says that for Jean-Luc Vandenbroucke, for the press, for the outside world, the fan themselves, they were the greatest XXXX that were cycling around (he uses a word that probably means "clowns" or something)

47'43": I'd like to understand what Sergeant says

48'22": The journalist Roger De Maertelaere says: "What could they do? They said: 'Figure that out'". Then he said that the guys were almost ... starving?

Thanks in advance to anyone with good command of Dutch in its Belgian variety who can help. ;)


My Flemish is not perfect, as I'm not a native in it. But I have watched many, many hours of cycling on Sporza, so here we go,

40'12": Rudi Verdonck says something before saying "It was a bit abnormal at that time".

I'm not sure what he says, but it is something like this: "I don't know what those other men were riding around on.'

40'32": Marc Sergeant says that Jean-Luc (Vandenbroucke) was rather naive. Then I don't really understand.

"He (Vandenbroucke) would just say: 'that (doping/EPO) is not it guys, you are just not training hard enough, those other men do a lot more for it and those do a lot more for it. (referring to different riders)"

41'14": I don't understand anything at what Sergeant says but at the end "everybody is here better"

"And that it (EPO) did something, has been proven. You always had people that were more talented, but now suddenly there was a wave where everybody was getting better (than us). In the year that we are talking about, I think that a large amount of the peloton was riding around on it (EPO).

44'20": Sammie Moreels says he was really ashamed and then ...

I'm not entirely sure what he says, but I believe he says that "that was really poor. (missing the time cut was a really terrible performance) "

45'33": I don't understand anything at what Rudi Verdonck is saying

"And then I stumbled into the hotel and went upstairs, where Herman (Frison) and I slept. I laid down on my bed. The pus (from an earlier injury) was sitting in my shoe. Yes, and then you get a blast (from someone else, probably Vandenbroucke) like nothing else."

47'22": Very first sentence by Mario De Clercq I don't understand. And then he says that for Jean-Luc Vandenbroucke, for the press, for the outside world, the fan themselves, they were the greatest XXXX that were cycling around (he uses a word that probably means "clowns" or something)

Just before that a journalist (guessing from the voice, Michel Wuyts) asks Rudi Verdonck whether under these circumstances he would consider doing something else (another job). Mario De Clercq then says: "That is what hurt me the most. That you knew that you could do something, that you did a lot for, but with regard to Jean Luc Vandenbroucke, etc. The word Mario De Clercq then uses is 'klungel', which is hard to translate. It means something like: a person who is very incompetent, clown, loser.

47'43": I'd like to understand what Sergeant says

"Then an atmosphere gets created that 'that gang' didn't live for it, they don't do what they should do. And I think that was unjust."

48'22": The journalist Roger De Maertelaere says: "What could they do? They said: 'Figure that out'". Then he said that the guys were almost ... starving?

De Maerteleare says the word: 'blijten' which I believe means crying in Flemish. "And they were sitting there almost crying, those boys, 'cursing in Dutch'."

It was sometimes difficult to tell what exactly was said, but this is the best I can make from it. I hope it clarifies some things.
Ursus
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Re: La Plagne 1995: Lotto Riders out of Time Limits (TV Show

05 Nov 2017 09:49

Echoes wrote:A few other passages I'd like to understand, please. :)

40'12": Rudi Verdonck says something before saying "It was a bit abnormal at that time".
"I don't know what kerosine those guys were riding on"

40'32": Marc Sergeant says that Jean-Luc (Vandenbroucke) was rather naive. Then I don't really understand.
"Jean-Luc used to say, 'you guys just don't train hard enough, the other guys train much harder"

41'14": I don't understand anything at what Sergeant says but at the end "everybody is here better"
He says it's clear EPO did something. There were always riders who were better than others, but suddenly nearly everyone improved. Most of the peloton was on EPO.

44'20": Sammie Moreels says he was really ashamed and then ...
Haven't got a clue

45'33": I don't understand anything at what Rudi Verdonck is saying
He crawled into bed with pus coming out of his feet, only to get scolded (by Vandenbroucke?)

47'22": Very first sentence by Mario De Clercq I don't understand. And then he says that for Jean-Luc Vandenbroucke, for the press, for the outside world, the fan themselves, they were the greatest XXXX that were cycling around (he uses a word that probably means "clowns" or something)
"That hurt the most" (he says "kwestehe" but means "kwetste"). The biggest "Klungels", which I think translates best to "klutzes" in English

47'43": I'd like to understand what Sergeant says
Everybody started saying they were a bunch of lazy bums who didn't work hard enough; and he thinks that was unfair

48'22": The journalist Roger De Maertelaere says: "What could they do? They said: 'Figure that out'". Then he said that the guys were almost ... starving?
Almost crying

Thanks in advance to anyone with good command of Dutch in its Belgian variety who can help. ;)
User avatar Gung Ho Gun
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05 Nov 2017 13:12

thanks for sharing
bossohboss
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Re: La Plagne 1995: Lotto Riders out of Time Limits (TV Show

05 Nov 2017 17:43

Many Thanks, Gung Ho. I know understand pretty much the whole of it. This show means a lot to me, brings back a lot of memories and explains a lot of things.
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