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Samuel Sanchez positive for growth hormone

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Re: Re:

22 Aug 2017 01:57

pmcg76 wrote:
The Hitch wrote:So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling


This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

The Hitch was quoting it as a shot at Vaughters, not out of any belief in the comments JV made.
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Re: Re:

22 Aug 2017 02:00

pmcg76 wrote:
Libertine Seguros wrote:
roundabout wrote:How many of the riders mentioned tested positive in the buildup to a race that Roche was also riding on the same team?

Fofonov tested positive in the 2008 Tour, that Roche was riding with him.
Kreuziger was yanked from the 2014 Tour.

And he didn't say anything about riding alongside Mick Rogers. That's Mick Rogers. MICK. ROGERS.

Mick Rogers.


Would just like to point out that Roche did not ride the 2008 Tour as suggested. He made his Tour debut with AG2R the following year. Bad enough that the usual idiots post non facts as facts, without one of the best posters doing the same.

When did Roche start writing his column in the Irish Independent and how many peope here actually read it on a regular basis? I know I dont and I highly doubt many others on here do so either, yet everyone seems to know every single word Roche has ever put to paper. I know Kimmage had a massive dig at Roche a few years back for not calling out people so I guess he must be happy with Roche now.

Sure, Roche didn't ride the 2008 Tour, but they were on the same team.
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Re: Re:

22 Aug 2017 10:08

42x16ss wrote:The Hitch was quoting it as a shot at Vaughters, not out of any belief in the comments JV made.


It still is redundant. Sella tested positive in August that year. If ever that comment is true (because I cannot believe that poster on face value), Vaughters' comment could already have been criticised at that moment.
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Re: Re:

23 Aug 2017 10:32

pmcg76 wrote:
Libertine Seguros wrote:
roundabout wrote:How many of the riders mentioned tested positive in the buildup to a race that Roche was also riding on the same team?

Fofonov tested positive in the 2008 Tour, that Roche was riding with him.
Kreuziger was yanked from the 2014 Tour.

And he didn't say anything about riding alongside Mick Rogers. That's Mick Rogers. MICK. ROGERS.

Mick Rogers.


Would just like to point out that Roche did not ride the 2008 Tour as suggested. He made his Tour debut with AG2R the following year. Bad enough that the usual idiots post non facts as facts, without one of the best posters doing the same.

When did Roche start writing his column in the Irish Independent and how many peope here actually read it on a regular basis? I know I dont and I highly doubt many others on here do so either, yet everyone seems to know every single word Roche has ever put to paper. I know Kimmage had a massive dig at Roche a few years back for not calling out people so I guess he must be happy with Roche now.


Why would I need to read all that Nicholas Roche wrote in his columns?! It's completely enough to read what he said about Samu to conclude that he's a hypocritical piece of ****!
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Re: Re:

23 Aug 2017 10:36

pmcg76 wrote:
The Hitch wrote:So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling


This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

It was not a throwaway comment I was reacting to but an article penned by Vaughters we dug up a few years ago where he said directly that cyclists don't dope anymore. In 2008.

I used to defend him, but anyone with a shred of integrity would have withdrawn themselves from the sport after being proved wrong so many times (thats assuming he actually believed what he was saying)

Its clear by now that Vaughters is running a basic scam where every year he tells people in the US that cycling is clean so that they keep watching (good for business for him). He even tries to coopt people like Landis behind the scenes to make sure they give the same message and dont go to hard after current cycling and make sure they only talk about the big bad past.

Then everytime he gets proved wrong he will just repeat the same thing the next year and ignore the fact that he said the same **** a year earlier.

Because of this scam, we are entitled to take shots at him for it. Now and for ever. If he ever apologises and shows some humility, sure i wont be an ******* about it, its not like he killed anyone, but since he's a shameless fraud for now, he gets what he deserves
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23 Aug 2017 12:18

animo the hitch!
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Re: Re:

24 Aug 2017 16:38

The Hitch wrote:
pmcg76 wrote:
The Hitch wrote:So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling


This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

It was not a throwaway comment I was reacting to but an article penned by Vaughters we dug up a few years ago where he said directly that cyclists don't dope anymore. In 2008.

I used to defend him, but anyone with a shred of integrity would have withdrawn themselves from the sport after being proved wrong so many times (thats assuming he actually believed what he was saying)

Its clear by now that Vaughters is running a basic scam where every year he tells people in the US that cycling is clean so that they keep watching (good for business for him). He even tries to coopt people like Landis behind the scenes to make sure they give the same message and dont go to hard after current cycling and make sure they only talk about the big bad past.

Then everytime he gets proved wrong he will just repeat the same thing the next year and ignore the fact that he said the same **** a year earlier.

Because of this scam, we are entitled to take shots at him for it. Now and for ever. If he ever apologises and shows some humility, sure i wont be an ******* about it, its not like he killed anyone, but since he's a shameless fraud for now, he gets what he deserves


I'm not sure I understand this line of reasoning and how it's different from everyone else in professional cycling saying the sport is clean.

Do you think he should come clean and tell all, destroying the sport and ruining everyone's life whose career is dependent on pro cycling?

Should he stay silent, effectively implying that doping is indeed rife?
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Re: Re:

24 Aug 2017 17:49

The Hitch wrote:
pmcg76 wrote:
The Hitch wrote:So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling


This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

It was not a throwaway comment I was reacting to but an article penned by Vaughters we dug up a few years ago where he said directly that cyclists don't dope anymore. In 2008.

I used to defend him, but anyone with a shred of integrity would have withdrawn themselves from the sport after being proved wrong so many times (thats assuming he actually believed what he was saying)

Its clear by now that Vaughters is running a basic scam where every year he tells people in the US that cycling is clean so that they keep watching (good for business for him). He even tries to coopt people like Landis behind the scenes to make sure they give the same message and dont go to hard after current cycling and make sure they only talk about the big bad past.

Then everytime he gets proved wrong he will just repeat the same thing the next year and ignore the fact that he said the same **** a year earlier.

Because of this scam, we are entitled to take shots at him for it. Now and for ever. If he ever apologises and shows some humility, sure i wont be an ******* about it, its not like he killed anyone, but since he's a shameless fraud for now, he gets what he deserves


That has to be the most pathetic justification I have seen for bringing someone into a thread that is not related to them. Seems more like a childish move to get the approval of the usual peanut gallery.
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Re: Re:

25 Aug 2017 20:42

pmcg76 wrote:
The Hitch wrote:
pmcg76 wrote:
The Hitch wrote:So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling


This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

It was not a throwaway comment I was reacting to but an article penned by Vaughters we dug up a few years ago where he said directly that cyclists don't dope anymore. In 2008.

I used to defend him, but anyone with a shred of integrity would have withdrawn themselves from the sport after being proved wrong so many times (thats assuming he actually believed what he was saying)

Its clear by now that Vaughters is running a basic scam where every year he tells people in the US that cycling is clean so that they keep watching (good for business for him). He even tries to coopt people like Landis behind the scenes to make sure they give the same message and dont go to hard after current cycling and make sure they only talk about the big bad past.

Then everytime he gets proved wrong he will just repeat the same thing the next year and ignore the fact that he said the same **** a year earlier.

Because of this scam, we are entitled to take shots at him for it. Now and for ever. If he ever apologises and shows some humility, sure i wont be an ******* about it, its not like he killed anyone, but since he's a shameless fraud for now, he gets what he deserves


That has to be the most pathetic justification I have seen for bringing someone into a thread that is not related to them. Seems more like a childish move to get the approval of the usual peanut gallery.


In chronological order:

*JV dopes.
*JV lies about it, makes money and rep, uses rep to rise in the sport.
* JV eventually gets caught lying about some of his lies.
* Negotiates behind the scenes and pretends to come clean.
* Other aspects of JV's story continue to unravel.
* JV continues to lie and break promises.
* years later a poster on an internet form is reminded of JV's lies and makes a throaway comment mocking JV for one of his lies.

Sorry mate but theres something wrong with your view of the world when you think the person making a comment about it is the bad guy and JV isn't.

What is he your father or something that you defend him from any attack? when its deserved as well.

I hate to give you a tutorial to the internet (or life even) but people who **** up and lie can get mocked for it for ever. Thats the price you pay. And its better that way. Teaches future generations that if you act like a slimy prat there might be a very very small price to pay.

As for the motivation you assigned to me, thats just stupid and makes no logical sense. The idea that I pick my opinions in order to please other people is offensive (dont worry im not an sjw so dont care) and more importantly doesn't match at all with my posting history on here.

If I actually did post in order to make people like me I would do it more often. Better yet, I could just go back to twitter, make the same post, and since several of the more popular anti doping people still follow me (tucker, digger, vayer etc), with a bit of luck could get a lot of likes and retweets, if I cared about that ****.

I don't. I just remembered 2 days ago when I made the post, that Samu won the olympics on 2008. I remembered that back then people were trying to sell sport as clean (the Beijing olympics for example) and how could I think about people claiming sport is clean without JV coming to mind, seeing how hard he fought to make himself the centre of the "we made cycling clean" parade for all those years.

Well **** him, the liar. I enjoyed making the little potshot at him, even if he didnt read it, even if no one read it. i will enjoy it again the next time I am reminded of it. If JV doesnt like it he should change and become a better person, or if he gets another chance at life, not cheat and lie to advance his own career. Tough ****. Responsibility is a bitch.
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Re: Re:

25 Aug 2017 20:55

jahn wrote:
The Hitch wrote:
pmcg76 wrote:
The Hitch wrote:So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling


This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

It was not a throwaway comment I was reacting to but an article penned by Vaughters we dug up a few years ago where he said directly that cyclists don't dope anymore. In 2008.

I used to defend him, but anyone with a shred of integrity would have withdrawn themselves from the sport after being proved wrong so many times (thats assuming he actually believed what he was saying)

Its clear by now that Vaughters is running a basic scam where every year he tells people in the US that cycling is clean so that they keep watching (good for business for him). He even tries to coopt people like Landis behind the scenes to make sure they give the same message and dont go to hard after current cycling and make sure they only talk about the big bad past.

Then everytime he gets proved wrong he will just repeat the same thing the next year and ignore the fact that he said the same **** a year earlier.

Because of this scam, we are entitled to take shots at him for it. Now and for ever. If he ever apologises and shows some humility, sure i wont be an ******* about it, its not like he killed anyone, but since he's a shameless fraud for now, he gets what he deserves


I'm not sure I understand this line of reasoning and how it's different from everyone else in professional cycling saying the sport is clean.

Do you think he should come clean and tell all, destroying the sport and ruining everyone's life whose career is dependent on pro cycling?

Should he stay silent, effectively implying that doping is indeed rife?



Yep, he is a hero.

Especially when crying on twitter about his budget compared to Sky's.

Or when he hails his team (himself really) as being the «special one»

That aside, i agree that you cant really make any win/win comments (on doping) when being part of the game as long as he has.
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25 Aug 2017 21:01

There is often talk of the culture of pro cycling.
Thing is, its a house of cards.
You cannot make serious impact without tearing the whole thing down.

All you can do is ride clean/never tested positive.

This is what uci strives to with HC levels first, then the blood passport/adams.

Dope within the lines and everyone is fine.

Just dont be a skinny dane, and a few other examples.
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Re: Re:

27 Aug 2017 06:25

Echoes wrote:
42x16ss wrote:The Hitch was quoting it as a shot at Vaughters, not out of any belief in the comments JV made.


It still is redundant. Sella tested positive in August that year. If ever that comment is true (because I cannot believe that poster on face value), Vaughters' comment could already have been criticised at that moment.

Vaughters has been criticised for his stupid comments since the inception of this forum in 2009. Hitch has consistently been one of the people highlighting JV's snake oil. I'm not sure what your point really is here...
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27 Aug 2017 13:46

I am not sure why we are discussing Vaughters in this thread anyway...

Unless of course a poster who was a massive Sanchez supporter some years back deliberately wanted to change the subject...
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Re:

28 Aug 2017 10:47

roundabout wrote:I am not sure why we are discussing Vaughters in this thread anyway...

Unless of course a poster who was a massive Sanchez supporter some years back deliberately wanted to change the subject...


Change the subject? By reviving the thread?

You mean the same poster who always said Sanchez doped?

Eg, from 2012:
The Hitch wrote:
For me the biggest apparent doper (not been caught) would probably be

1 samuel Sanchez Gonzalez. this is not just for the idiotic thing he said about Lance but also for the fervent defense of Contador last year where he didnt even bother denying contador doped, just said that Contador should be allowed to race.


:D

You really should be better at this internet thing after all these years ;)

I'm the one who is proven right when a guy I said was the most obvious doper, who also was a star in the post armstrong, clean doping era.

You on the other hand, seem genuinly upset that people are still pointing fingers at Vaughters, and that in general people still accuse riders other than your favourite boogyeman Contador, of doping.
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Re: Re:

28 Aug 2017 12:22

42x16ss wrote:Vaughters has been criticised for his stupid comments since the inception of this forum in 2009. Hitch has consistently been one of the people highlighting JV's snake oil. I'm not sure what your point really is here...


If you don't see what is wrong with what you are yourself noticing, I cannot help. It's widely off topic and because of such posters, this part of the forum constantly revolves around the same characters, usually Anglophone ones, as though the rest does not exist or does not matter.

And it was not too hard to note that Sanchez doped. Only some posters like me refuse to make unfounded allegations, as a rule.
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Re: Re:

28 Aug 2017 13:01

Echoes wrote:
42x16ss wrote:Vaughters has been criticised for his stupid comments since the inception of this forum in 2009. Hitch has consistently been one of the people highlighting JV's snake oil. I'm not sure what your point really is here...


It's widely off topic and because of such posters, this part of the forum constantly revolves around the same characters, usually Anglophone ones, as though the rest does not exist or does not matter.


Ironically this is also off topic. But also it is fun so i cant resist.

Bluntly, yes, to me many of the things you care about do not exist and do not matter.

If you want them to "matter" and be talked about more you can post more about them yourself. Not force others to do so like all your political idols.
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Re: Samuel Sanchez positive for growth hormone

28 Aug 2017 14:06

If a post is crap, I'm saying it and it's my freedom to do so. If one cherishes freedom of expression, one should also be ready to face criticism. There's nothing dictatorial in that. I'm not the one iconising Trotsky and I'm not on a mission to make CNF a more interesting place. It's not my job. Better things to do. I'm only reacting at posts because sometimes it feels good to and I need to relax a bit from work. If I want to share my passion for cycling with people, there are better places than CNF for that ...
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01 Sep 2017 08:37

Good to see existing processes are sufficient to catch out a seasoned pro on a big team. It is essential that there are occasional results like this to make those in the peloton who want to dope at least think about the consequences. Three cheers for scientists.
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Re: Re:

02 Sep 2017 08:40

The Hitch wrote:
roundabout wrote:I am not sure why we are discussing Vaughters in this thread anyway...

Unless of course a poster who was a massive Sanchez supporter some years back deliberately wanted to change the subject...


Change the subject? By reviving the thread?

You mean the same poster who always said Sanchez doped?

Eg, from 2012:
The Hitch wrote:
For me the biggest apparent doper (not been caught) would probably be

1 samuel Sanchez Gonzalez. this is not just for the idiotic thing he said about Lance but also for the fervent defense of Contador last year where he didnt even bother denying contador doped, just said that Contador should be allowed to race.


:D

You really should be better at this internet thing after all these years ;)

I'm the one who is proven right when a guy I said was the most obvious doper, who also was a star in the post armstrong, clean doping era.

You on the other hand, seem genuinly upset that people are still pointing fingers at Vaughters, and that in general people still accuse riders other than your favourite boogyeman Contador, of doping.


You still changed the subject. Not sure what sense it makes to discuss pretty much the same things about Vaughters that have been discussed in many other threads. Maybe you could answer that first, before letting your imagination run amok.

And since you are supposedly good at the internet thing, could you please provide evidence that I care about people pointing fingers at Vaughters (hint, me writing that this is not the thread for it, is not the answer) or that Contador is my favorite boogyeman (whatever that is)?

Edit: and especially that I am apparently genuinely upset that riders other than Contador are accused of doping?

Frankly considering the various subjects that I have posted about in the clinic, your last paragraph is so ridiculously wrong, that maybe you should tone down the smugness a little?
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05 Oct 2017 07:01

So confirmed:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/samuel-sanchez-doping-positive-confirmed

Apparently Cardoso b sample was negative according to Italian/Portugese press.
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