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Doping in Soccer/Football

The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

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Re: Re:

13 Mar 2017 22:02

yaco wrote:
Dan2016 wrote:
frisenfruitig wrote:Is there any reason to assume they weren't also taking loads of illegal substances though?


Not sure if directed at me but no! there's no reason to assume that. Probably up to their eyeballs on everything innit.


We are talking about Italian football Seria A going back 30 years ago - Different drug codes ( if any at all ) were in existence at that time - There was no WADA so sports ran their own race - Because a sporting team used substances that are banned in 2017, doesn't mean they were banned in 1987 - My guess is few have thought through the issue.


Yep, was just a reply to previous poster agreeing we can't make assumptions, I wouldn't pretend to know much about the footballing nitty-gritty. You seem to know more, do you know what was on the go at that time? I'm interested. Reports of deaths due to doping etc. I wonder if EPO was on the go. Certainly copious amounts of steroids I imagine.
Dan2016
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Re: Re:

13 Mar 2017 22:09

Dan2016 wrote:
The Hitch wrote:Haha. This is hillarious:

Messi manages a top speed with the ball faster than one of the best NFL running backs does while doing a timed sprint.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFyr0oVJSXE


Yep, good illustration of Messi's...erm...'amazingness.'
Really impressive too though cos the NFL players are about as juiced up as you can get.

(As an aside, what a incredibly annoying effing video. Why the hell does American TV present stuff like this. I felt like smashing the laptop half way through).


look at the size of his head Dan2016, and he was on the hgh when he was a child to make him grow. this is on-the-record. not a conspiracy.
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Re: Re:

13 Mar 2017 23:23

blackcat wrote:
Dan2016 wrote:
The Hitch wrote:Haha. This is hillarious:

Messi manages a top speed with the ball faster than one of the best NFL running backs does while doing a timed sprint.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFyr0oVJSXE


Yep, good illustration of Messi's...erm...'amazingness.'
Really impressive too though cos the NFL players are about as juiced up as you can get.

(As an aside, what a incredibly annoying effing video. Why the hell does American TV present stuff like this. I felt like smashing the laptop half way through).


look at the size of his head Dan2016, and he was on the hgh when he was a child to make him grow. this is on-the-record. not a conspiracy.


Seriously? Why was he on hgh as a kid? Is that not complete nuts or did he have a medicalized stunted growth? (whatever I mean by that gobbledygook phrase). Please tell me the hgh wasn't purely for football. And you've obviously got much better vision for what to look for, I can't detect anything unusual about his head size.
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14 Mar 2017 08:15

Messi had/has a growth hormone disorder and was given human growth hormone to treat the condition. The treatment was paid for by Barcelona after they signed him as a 13 year old. This allowed him to grow to normal height and avoid the other health issues relating to his medical problem.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1492546-lionel-messi-and-hgh-the-truth-about-the-best-footballer-in-the-world
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Re: Re:

14 Mar 2017 16:13

Dan2016 wrote:
yaco wrote:
Dan2016 wrote:
frisenfruitig wrote:Is there any reason to assume they weren't also taking loads of illegal substances though?


Not sure if directed at me but no! there's no reason to assume that. Probably up to their eyeballs on everything innit.


We are talking about Italian football Seria A going back 30 years ago - Different drug codes ( if any at all ) were in existence at that time - There was no WADA so sports ran their own race - Because a sporting team used substances that are banned in 2017, doesn't mean they were banned in 1987 - My guess is few have thought through the issue.


Basically Zeman then coach of Roma complained that Juventus were doping - An Italian Magistrate from Turin started an investigation which finally jailed the Juventus Doctor Agricola for 22 months - During the investigation they found Juventus were using 281 drugs, most which weren't prohibited at that time - Though strong convictions they were using EPO. And as an offshoot of this was 36 players/ex suffering from Lou Gehrig disease with at least 13 confirmed deaths

Yep, was just a reply to previous poster agreeing we can't make assumptions, I wouldn't pretend to know much about the footballing nitty-gritty. You seem to know more, do you know what was on the go at that time? I'm interested. Reports of deaths due to doping etc. I wonder if EPO was on the go. Certainly copious amounts of steroids I imagine.
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Re:

14 Mar 2017 21:33

TheGreenMonkey wrote:Messi had/has a growth hormone disorder and was given human growth hormone to treat the condition. The treatment was paid for by Barcelona after they signed him as a 13 year old. This allowed him to grow to normal height and avoid the other health issues relating to his medical problem.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1492546-lionel-messi-and-hgh-the-truth-about-the-best-footballer-in-the-world


Thanks for the link GreenMonkey, really interesting stuff. I'm reading about idiopathic short stature now, just out of general curiosity.

And @blackcat, if you read this, I think I see what you mean about the size of Messi's head in the picture on GreenMonkey's link. You've got much better eyes for this than me but I think I see it.
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Re: Re:

14 Mar 2017 21:43

yaco wrote:
Dan2016 wrote:
yaco wrote:
Dan2016 wrote:
frisenfruitig wrote:Is there any reason to assume they weren't also taking loads of illegal substances though?


Not sure if directed at me but no! there's no reason to assume that. Probably up to their eyeballs on everything innit.


We are talking about Italian football Seria A going back 30 years ago - Different drug codes ( if any at all ) were in existence at that time - There was no WADA so sports ran their own race - Because a sporting team used substances that are banned in 2017, doesn't mean they were banned in 1987 - My guess is few have thought through the issue.


Yep, was just a reply to previous poster agreeing we can't make assumptions, I wouldn't pretend to know much about the footballing nitty-gritty. You seem to know more, do you know what was on the go at that time? I'm interested. Reports of deaths due to doping etc. I wonder if EPO was on the go. Certainly copious amounts of steroids I imagine.


Basically Zeman then coach of Roma complained that Juventus were doping - An Italian Magistrate from Turin started an investigation which finally jailed the Juventus Doctor Agricola for 22 months - During the investigation they found Juventus were using 281 drugs, most which weren't prohibited at that time - Though strong convictions they were using EPO. And as an offshoot of this was 36 players/ex suffering from Lou Gehrig disease with at least 13 confirmed deaths


Thanks Yaco, that's very interesting. Terrible situation and outcome for those players. I'm going to do some googling on this, so thanks for specifying the names etc. I've read before that there is debate as to whether any cycling deaths can be directly attributed to drug use, and of course we see plenty ex cycling pros and ex pros from various sports in apparently good health. I wonder if the safety side of doping has improved, if what the Juve players were doing was complete madness that would never happen with todays knowledge.
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Re: Re:

14 Mar 2017 22:06

Dan2016 wrote:
TheGreenMonkey wrote:Messi had/has a growth hormone disorder and was given human growth hormone to treat the condition. The treatment was paid for by Barcelona after they signed him as a 13 year old. This allowed him to grow to normal height and avoid the other health issues relating to his medical problem.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1492546-lionel-messi-and-hgh-the-truth-about-the-best-footballer-in-the-world


Thanks for the link GreenMonkey, really interesting stuff. I'm reading about idiopathic short stature now, just out of general curiosity.

And @blackcat, if you read this, I think I see what you mean about the size of Messi's head in the picture on GreenMonkey's link. You've got much better eyes for this than me but I think I see it.


no professional players in sport, will have small heads like donald bradman(cricket), corey pavin(golf), kareem abdul jabaar*(basketball), rod laver(tennis), kevin bartlett(australian rules football), michael rasmussen*(cycling).

rasmussen was still on a truckload of growth factors, but his head did not explode, kareem on the other hand, he is exception to the rule, he had a pinhead on a large man.

but there will be no professional sportsmen/sportswomen, with pinheads, because they will imbibe copious growth factor androgens.
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15 Mar 2017 17:06

The finding of 281 different drugs in the Juventus medical cabinet, along with Salazar experimenting with combinations of different substances (mostly legal), shows the mentality of professional athletes - They will take all sorts of substances to obtain an edge, even though many of the substances are useless.
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Re:

15 Mar 2017 23:21

yaco wrote:The finding of 281 different drugs in the Juventus medical cabinet, along with Salazar experimenting with combinations of different substances (mostly legal), shows the mentality of professional athletes - They will take all sorts of substances to obtain an edge, even though many of the substances are useless.


and WADA regulations mean naught

the mean meta-mean, in terms of said regulations must be subverted

john nash game theory
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23 Mar 2017 08:28

http://www.bbc.com/sport/39333763
Elite footballers' "abuse" of legal painkillers risks their health and could "potentially" have life-threatening implications, says Fifa's former chief medical officer.

About half of players competing at the past three World Cups routinely took non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs like ibuprofen, claims Jiri Dvorak.

He says it is still an "alarming trend" among players, including teenagers.

"It has become a cultural issue, part of the game," said Professor Dvorak.

"It is absolutely wrong," added the Czech, who left Fifa in November after 22 years.

"For me it's clearly abuse of the drugs - that's why we use the word alarming."

However, the Professional Footballers' Association - the players' union in England - said misuse of painkillers was "not a major issue" among its members.

...
Professor Dvorak previously raised these concerns when he was employed by Fifa, but claims that the world governing body has still not addressed the issue appropriately.

Fifa says its stance on the issue has not changed since Dvorak first warned about the long-term implications of players misusing painkillers in 2012.

The misuse of legal medication could "potentially" have life-threatening implications for players, claims Professor Dvorak.
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Re: Doping in Soccer/Football

23 Mar 2017 08:29

Haha.

was doing a minute morning trawl through some tabloid nonesence and saw this picture.

From yesterday.

That's HMW is it not, still working for the German national team
Image
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23 Mar 2017 08:56

Kirby, the reason the mute button was invented! :)
LRP - “an angry little man”. “Americanese” - when you want to spread bs
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23 Mar 2017 09:27

healing hans ftw
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Re: Doping in Soccer/Football

29 Mar 2017 13:38

It's widely accepted that Messi was given HGH and no one seems to have a problem with it; that pretty much speaks for itself.
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Re: Doping in Soccer/Football

29 Mar 2017 14:01

DanielSong39 wrote:It's widely accepted that Messi was given HGH and no one seems to have a problem with it; that pretty much speaks for itself.


He was given HGH as a teenager because he was diagnosed with a growth hormone disorder, or GHD. Not what you would call doping.
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Re: Doping in Soccer/Football

31 Mar 2017 07:46

Saido Berahino: Drugs ban
http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/39450446
I got slipped a Micky Finn ...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-4189572/Berahino-s-drug-ban-casts-cloud-West-Brom-return.html
"...the question of whether Stoke manager Hughes was the right man to rehabilitate a player whose positive drug test followed a drink-driving offence and a hippy crack controversy."
Mmmm ....
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Zlatan's varicosity

25 Apr 2017 12:19

http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/24/zlatan-ibrahimovic-knee-injury-legs/

Zlatan's legs have nothing to do with hormone imbalances caused by anabolic drugs ...
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Re: Zlatan's varicosity

25 Apr 2017 14:22

buckle wrote:http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/24/zlatan-ibrahimovic-knee-injury-legs/

Zlatan's legs have nothing to do with hormone imbalances caused by anabolic drugs ...


This guy has played practically every minute of every match he has been available for this season and at 36 years of age he has got better into his 30's. Has been well educated in preparation methods with various different clubs across continental Europe. That vascularity isn't normal.
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