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Doping in Soccer/Football

The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

Re:

09 Mar 2017 11:00

Red Rick wrote:Turning a 4 goal deficit into a win and advance in CL? No **** problem

I mean obviously there was a lot of stuff at play there. They got very lucky towards the end, with how the ball fell, with the decisions, PSG made mistakes etc. It was more than just strong play, but there was also skill.

However, to beat a team like PSG 6-1 in 90 minutes, and outplay them the way Barcelona did, controlling the ball throughout, is a massive physical effort too.

The parts of the game I watched, the commentators were talking about what a tragedy it is that Barca lose this game, and leave the competition at such an early stage. The pressure on the team from the whole city and wider community of Catalunya is massive.

Lets just say that if the tests in football weren't so strict and prevalent, there would be very little to stop a team from doping under this situation.
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Re:

09 Mar 2017 17:56

Red Rick wrote:Turning a 4 goal deficit into a win and advance in CL? No **** problem


Did anyone ask the same question when PSG won the first leg by 4 goals ?

Strange indeed !
yaco
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Re: Re:

09 Mar 2017 18:50

yaco wrote:
Red Rick wrote:Turning a 4 goal deficit into a win and advance in CL? No **** problem


Did anyone ask the same question when PSG won the first leg by 4 goals ?

Strange indeed !


yeah, and win discrepancy does not = proportion.

#randomness
“Nothing can ever touch the purity of what we accomplished now. Nothing can ever change it” -Johan Bruyneel
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Re: Re:

09 Mar 2017 18:55

yaco wrote:
Red Rick wrote:Turning a 4 goal deficit into a win and advance in CL? No **** problem


Did anyone ask the same question when PSG won the first leg by 4 goals ?

Strange indeed !


Yes they did and the assumption was PSG outdoped Barca. Similar behaviours could be identified during the Euros when an average Italian team outdoped Spain.

I maintain that England did not dope during that championship and played out of their skin to beat Wales with a doped Bale. Only to lose to a heavily juiced Icelandic team who in turn were outdoped by France.
buckle
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Re: Re:

10 Mar 2017 17:42

buckle wrote:
yaco wrote:
Red Rick wrote:Turning a 4 goal deficit into a win and advance in CL? No **** problem


Did anyone ask the same question when PSG won the first leg by 4 goals ?

Strange indeed !


Yes they did and the assumption was PSG outdoped Barca. Similar behaviours could be identified during the Euros when an average Italian team outdoped Spain.

I maintain that England did not dope during that championship and played out of their skin to beat Wales with a doped Bale. Only to lose to a heavily juiced Icelandic team who in turn were outdoped by France.


Can you show me the posts in this thread where PSG were called out after defeating Barcelona ?

Yours is another ' throw it away ' post which lacks credibility.
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Re:

10 Mar 2017 20:00

Like this?

AlbineVespuzzio wrote:Whoever saw PSG vs Barcelona knows PSG just stepped up another level. Making a team full of World Class footballers looking like children, even though PSG also has first level players demands something else.

Basically PSG did to Barcelona what Barcelona did to everybody else for the past decade, they entered the pitch more charged than the opponents.
Great match to watch though


The Barcelona pressing games was insane on Wednesday. Mascherano was non stop.
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 14:01

T_S_A_R wrote:Like this?

AlbineVespuzzio wrote:Whoever saw PSG vs Barcelona knows PSG just stepped up another level. Making a team full of World Class footballers looking like children, even though PSG also has first level players demands something else.

Basically PSG did to Barcelona what Barcelona did to everybody else for the past decade, they entered the pitch more charged than the opponents.
Great match to watch though


The Barcelona pressing games was insane on Wednesday. Mascherano was non stop.


The "tell" is the ability to press. It's not clear that all the players are charged for every game of a given season. I suspect that, just like in cycling, certain games (races) are targeted and certain players agree to charge up.

As a "non-believer" (as inexperienced as I am) I was intrigued by England under Roy Hodgson. I have suspicion that firstly under Gerrard and then Rooney, an agreement was reached by the players with the coach not to charge during summer tournaments (in other words, they made me a temporary "believer" again). As a measure of the advantage doping affords a committed team therefore I offer the Icelandic pub XI who made their relatively clean English opponents look ridiculous in 2016.

I further contend that doping was behind the tensions during the Capello regime especially in South Africa 2010 as a dispute broke out between the Chelsea dopers and the then England captain Steven Gerrard.
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 17:45

T_S_A_R wrote:Like this?

AlbineVespuzzio wrote:Whoever saw PSG vs Barcelona knows PSG just stepped up another level. Making a team full of World Class footballers looking like children, even though PSG also has first level players demands something else.

Basically PSG did to Barcelona what Barcelona did to everybody else for the past decade, they entered the pitch more charged than the opponents.
Great match to watch though


The Barcelona pressing games was insane on Wednesday. Mascherano was non stop.


This has been happening in football for the last 30 years - Go back to AC Milan and especially Juventus who were running around like supermen.
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Re: Re:

11 Mar 2017 21:36

yaco wrote:
T_S_A_R wrote:Like this?

AlbineVespuzzio wrote:Whoever saw PSG vs Barcelona knows PSG just stepped up another level. Making a team full of World Class footballers looking like children, even though PSG also has first level players demands something else.

Basically PSG did to Barcelona what Barcelona did to everybody else for the past decade, they entered the pitch more charged than the opponents.
Great match to watch though


The Barcelona pressing games was insane on Wednesday. Mascherano was non stop.


This has been happening in football for the last 30 years - Go back to AC Milan and especially Juventus who were running around like supermen.


30 years

So going back to the mid 80's. When EPO and steroids exploded on the sports scene.

Is that what you mean?
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11 Mar 2017 21:39

Haha. This is hillarious:

Messi manages a top speed with the ball faster than one of the best NFL running backs does while doing a timed sprint.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFyr0oVJSXE
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11 Mar 2017 22:18

Not a single reason to believe, football isn't one of the most juiced up sports around. Combine the immensely financial strength with the utter lack of control and you could put the puzzle together. Also the profile of a world class player is complex. Run like an endurance athlete, while having the needed strength and top that of with agility that needs to be preserved.
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Re: Re:

12 Mar 2017 17:58

The Hitch wrote:
yaco wrote:
T_S_A_R wrote:Like this?

AlbineVespuzzio wrote:Whoever saw PSG vs Barcelona knows PSG just stepped up another level. Making a team full of World Class footballers looking like children, even though PSG also has first level players demands something else.

Basically PSG did to Barcelona what Barcelona did to everybody else for the past decade, they entered the pitch more charged than the opponents.
Great match to watch though


The Barcelona pressing games was insane on Wednesday. Mascherano was non stop.


This has been happening in football for the last 30 years - Go back to AC Milan and especially Juventus who were running around like supermen.


30 years

So going back to the mid 80's. When EPO and steroids exploded on the sports scene.

Is that what you mean?


The difference is that some and probably most of the substances taken at time were probably legal - Not that it helps a number of Italian footballers who suffered serious health issues.
yaco
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Re: Re:

12 Mar 2017 18:13

yaco wrote:
The Hitch wrote:
yaco wrote:
T_S_A_R wrote:Like this?

AlbineVespuzzio wrote:Whoever saw PSG vs Barcelona knows PSG just stepped up another level. Making a team full of World Class footballers looking like children, even though PSG also has first level players demands something else.

Basically PSG did to Barcelona what Barcelona did to everybody else for the past decade, they entered the pitch more charged than the opponents.
Great match to watch though


The Barcelona pressing games was insane on Wednesday. Mascherano was non stop.


This has been happening in football for the last 30 years - Go back to AC Milan and especially Juventus who were running around like supermen.


30 years

So going back to the mid 80's. When EPO and steroids exploded on the sports scene.

Is that what you mean?


The difference is that some and probably most of the substances taken at time were probably legal - Not that it helps a number of Italian footballers who suffered serious health issues.


Interesting. I didn't know that, the details of football doping has kinda passed me by.
Just did a quick google and found this article an interesting ( and quick) read:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2005/apr/30/newsstory.sport9

Exactly as you say, 'legal' drugs, and used openly.
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12 Mar 2017 18:21

Is there any reason to assume they weren't also taking loads of illegal substances though?
frisenfruitig
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Re:

12 Mar 2017 18:53

The Hitch wrote:Haha. This is hillarious:

Messi manages a top speed with the ball faster than one of the best NFL running backs does while doing a timed sprint.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFyr0oVJSXE

Maybe Messi looks cleaner when he gets tackled by some NFL players
Kwibus wrote:So much quesions they have. Answers they will never get.
So why questions? If no answers?
-Kwibus, one of the great philosophers of the 21st century
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Re:

12 Mar 2017 18:59

frisenfruitig wrote:Is there any reason to assume they weren't also taking loads of illegal substances though?


Not sure if directed at me but no! there's no reason to assume that. Probably up to their eyeballs on everything innit.
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Re:

12 Mar 2017 19:12

The Hitch wrote:Haha. This is hillarious:

Messi manages a top speed with the ball faster than one of the best NFL running backs does while doing a timed sprint.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFyr0oVJSXE


Yep, good illustration of Messi's...erm...'amazingness.'
Really impressive too though cos the NFL players are about as juiced up as you can get.

(As an aside, what a incredibly annoying effing video. Why the hell does American TV present stuff like this. I felt like smashing the laptop half way through).
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Re: Re:

12 Mar 2017 20:23

Dan2016 wrote:
frisenfruitig wrote:Is there any reason to assume they weren't also taking loads of illegal substances though?


Not sure if directed at me but no! there's no reason to assume that. Probably up to their eyeballs on everything innit.


You'd have to be stupid not to tbh.
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Re:

13 Mar 2017 18:51

frisenfruitig wrote:Is there any reason to assume they weren't also taking loads of illegal substances though?


It's only illegal if its on the prohibited list - Back in the 1980's/1990's there was no WADA Code underpinning all sports - So different sporting federations had a hot potch of banned substances and the IOC tended to over-arch all Olympic Sports - Remember we are discussing professional football, so their list of banned substances would be limited 30 years ago.
yaco
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Re: Re:

13 Mar 2017 18:55

Dan2016 wrote:
frisenfruitig wrote:Is there any reason to assume they weren't also taking loads of illegal substances though?


Not sure if directed at me but no! there's no reason to assume that. Probably up to their eyeballs on everything innit.


We are talking about Italian football Seria A going back 30 years ago - Different drug codes ( if any at all ) were in existence at that time - There was no WADA so sports ran their own race - Because a sporting team used substances that are banned in 2017, doesn't mean they were banned in 1987 - My guess is few have thought through the issue.
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