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Re: National Football League

05 Jan 2018 14:28

Big story in Boston is that there's been a major feud between Brady and Belichick. Brady wanted Jimmy Garoppolo. traded, whereas Beli didn't. This makes perfect sense to me. I've been mystified why Beli would trade the best option the team has for a successor to Brady, when the latter has to be near the end of his career. I know Brady thinks he's going to play till he's 60--so of course he doesn't want someone thought of as his successor around--but the reality is he could be finished literally any game now. In 2013, Manning had one of the best seasons a QB has ever had in NFL history; the next year he was very good for about half the season, then started to fade; the year after that he was finished, one of the worst QBs in the NFL. It can happen very fast, and after 40, all bets are off. If Brady goes into serious decline next year, what's NE going to do? They had a great potential solution in Jimmy G, and they let him go. Now as far as I can see, they have no future QB. It's nuts to be in that situation when your starter is 40 years old. If I were Beli, I'd be very upset if Brady prevailed on Kraft to get rid of Garoppolo.

If I were in position to decide, I would have traded Brady, not Garappolo. It may sound absurd, but I think it would be the perfect move at the perfect time. Brady's stock is as high right now as it has ever been; there are very few teams in the NFL that wouldn't sell the farm to acquire him. But he can't last much longer, so NE would probably be giving up very little for what they could potentially get back.

There have even been rumors that either Brady or Beli has to go. I doubt that, but if I had to choose, I'd definitely take Beli. When Brady missed essentially the entire season in 2008, the Patriots were still very good, finishing 11-5. When he was suspended for four games last year, they went 3-1. I think Beli can win with anyone, I'm not so sure Brady would be so great on some other team.
Merckx index
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Re: National Football League

05 Jan 2018 15:16

Merckx index wrote:Big story in Boston is that there's been a major feud between Brady and Belichick. Brady wanted Jimmy Garoppolo. traded, whereas Beli didn't. This makes perfect sense to me. I've been mystified why Beli would trade the best option the team has for a successor to Brady, when the latter has to be near the end of his career. I know Brady thinks he's going to play till he's 60--so of course he doesn't want someone thought of as his successor around--but the reality is he could be finished literally any game now. In 2013, Manning had one of the best seasons a QB has ever had in NFL history; the next year he was very good for about half the season, then started to fade; the year after that he was finished, one of the worst QBs in the NFL. It can happen very fast, and after 40, all bets are off. If Brady goes into serious decline next year, what's NE going to do? They had a great potential solution in Jimmy G, and they let him go. Now as far as I can see, they have no future QB. It's nuts to be in that situation when your starter is 40 years old. If I were Beli, I'd be very upset if Brady prevailed on Kraft to get rid of Garoppolo.

If I were in position to decide, I would have traded Brady, not Garappolo. It may sound absurd, but I think it would be the perfect move at the perfect time. Brady's stock is as high right now as it has ever been; there are very few teams in the NFL that wouldn't sell the farm to acquire him. But he can't last much longer, so NE would probably be giving up very little for what they could potentially get back.

There have even been rumors that either Brady or Beli has to go. I doubt that, but if I had to choose, I'd definitely take Beli. When Brady missed essentially the entire season in 2008, the Patriots were still very good, finishing 11-5. When he was suspended for four games last year, they went 3-1. I think Beli can win with anyone, I'm not so sure Brady would be so great on some other team.

I would have kept Garappolo also. Plus I think Brady still has enough value to get at least what they got for Jimmy G.

BUT, I'm really skeptical about the initial report about the situation, because who reported the situation? That ESPN drama mongering tool Seth Wickersham. The same Wickerscam who falsely reported on the Seattle locker room discord last Spring. In his report on Seattle, he used facts to bend the truth. Facts like Sherman telling Wilson he sucked, which when the dust finally settled it was really nothing more than competitive juices flowing. So, how much of this new report about the Pats do I believe? At this point not much, because it is Seth at his worst. As for ESPN, they suck too because they put this moron out there to drum up drama to sell. I would not be surprised if this Pats report resulted from a simple conversation someone had about whether or not they should trade Brady, as any GM/coach might consider just to be prudent by considering all the options. I could be all wrong on this one, but until proven otherwise that's what I think about it. That said, I would not put it past Brady though.
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Re: National Football League

05 Jan 2018 22:44

Merckx index wrote:Big story in Boston is that there's been a major feud between Brady and Belichick. Brady wanted Jimmy Garoppolo. traded, whereas Beli didn't. This makes perfect sense to me. I've been mystified why Beli would trade the best option the team has for a successor to Brady, when the latter has to be near the end of his career. I know Brady thinks he's going to play till he's 60--so of course he doesn't want someone thought of as his successor around--but the reality is he could be finished literally any game now. In 2013, Manning had one of the best seasons a QB has ever had in NFL history; the next year he was very good for about half the season, then started to fade; the year after that he was finished, one of the worst QBs in the NFL. It can happen very fast, and after 40, all bets are off. If Brady goes into serious decline next year, what's NE going to do? They had a great potential solution in Jimmy G, and they let him go. Now as far as I can see, they have no future QB. It's nuts to be in that situation when your starter is 40 years old. If I were Beli, I'd be very upset if Brady prevailed on Kraft to get rid of Garoppolo.

If I were in position to decide, I would have traded Brady, not Garappolo. It may sound absurd, but I think it would be the perfect move at the perfect time. Brady's stock is as high right now as it has ever been; there are very few teams in the NFL that wouldn't sell the farm to acquire him. But he can't last much longer, so NE would probably be giving up very little for what they could potentially get back.

There have even been rumors that either Brady or Beli has to go. I doubt that, but if I had to choose, I'd definitely take Beli. When Brady missed essentially the entire season in 2008, the Patriots were still very good, finishing 11-5. When he was suspended for four games last year, they went 3-1. I think Beli can win with anyone, I'm not so sure Brady would be so great on some other team.



As good and as cool/confident Brady is, Belichick's value to the team, I feel, is greater. I mean he helped the BROWNS to the playoffs. The last time they were there. And who were his best players then?? A very good defense at the time, one of the top in the league (if not the top), with Vinny Testaverde at QB. They beat the Patriots but lost to the Steelers in the AFC divisional the following week. They finished 11-5 and won a playoff game...Belichick was out shortly thereafter and the Browns relocated to Baltimore...

Point is, Belichick would be the more valuable asset at the moment. It's too early to say of course, but if Jimmy does end up being a start with the 49ers, can you imagine him being with the Pats with Belichick at the helm? We know that Belichick knows how to move the pieces and to make things work.

It might turn out to be a BIG mistake for NE to let Jimmy G go.
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Re: National Football League

05 Jan 2018 22:49

on3m@n@rmy wrote:
Merckx index wrote:Big story in Boston is that there's been a major feud between Brady and Belichick. Brady wanted Jimmy Garoppolo. traded, whereas Beli didn't. This makes perfect sense to me. I've been mystified why Beli would trade the best option the team has for a successor to Brady, when the latter has to be near the end of his career. I know Brady thinks he's going to play till he's 60--so of course he doesn't want someone thought of as his successor around--but the reality is he could be finished literally any game now. In 2013, Manning had one of the best seasons a QB has ever had in NFL history; the next year he was very good for about half the season, then started to fade; the year after that he was finished, one of the worst QBs in the NFL. It can happen very fast, and after 40, all bets are off. If Brady goes into serious decline next year, what's NE going to do? They had a great potential solution in Jimmy G, and they let him go. Now as far as I can see, they have no future QB. It's nuts to be in that situation when your starter is 40 years old. If I were Beli, I'd be very upset if Brady prevailed on Kraft to get rid of Garoppolo.

If I were in position to decide, I would have traded Brady, not Garappolo. It may sound absurd, but I think it would be the perfect move at the perfect time. Brady's stock is as high right now as it has ever been; there are very few teams in the NFL that wouldn't sell the farm to acquire him. But he can't last much longer, so NE would probably be giving up very little for what they could potentially get back.

There have even been rumors that either Brady or Beli has to go. I doubt that, but if I had to choose, I'd definitely take Beli. When Brady missed essentially the entire season in 2008, the Patriots were still very good, finishing 11-5. When he was suspended for four games last year, they went 3-1. I think Beli can win with anyone, I'm not so sure Brady would be so great on some other team.

I would have kept Garappolo also. Plus I think Brady still has enough value to get at least what they got for Jimmy G.

BUT, I'm really skeptical about the initial report about the situation, because who reported the situation? That ESPN drama mongering tool Seth Wickersham. The same Wickerscam who falsely reported on the Seattle locker room discord last Spring. In his report on Seattle, he used facts to bend the truth. Facts like Sherman telling Wilson he sucked, which when the dust finally settled it was really nothing more than competitive juices flowing. So, how much of this new report about the Pats do I believe? At this point not much, because it is Seth at his worst. As for ESPN, they suck too because they put this moron out there to drum up drama to sell. I would not be surprised if this Pats report resulted from a simple conversation someone had about whether or not they should trade Brady, as any GM/coach might consider just to be prudent by considering all the options. I could be all wrong on this one, but until proven otherwise that's what I think about it. That said, I would not put it past Brady though.


Initially it seemed that both Bill and Brady were happy for Jimmy to go to the 49ers and Bill turned down the Browns trade which would have given the Patriots higher draft picks because he didn't want to see Jimmy go to the Browns and because a few old buddies are connected to the 49ers. Jimmy is obviously happy to get off the bench and play for a young team in rebuild mode with a new coach who is highly regarded with his offense schemes. I think there could be some truth to it but if the Patriots win the SB again it will probably blow over. If they don't then the media might keep poking at it to see if there is any substance to the claims. And if Jimmy doesn't perform next year, after his first five games it will be all forgotten about it. Realistically I can't see Brady going longer than another year. Patriots will be looking for another diamond in the draft. Brady was a sixth round pick, the chances of that happening again are next to zero.
movingtarget
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06 Jan 2018 01:15

Who cares if they massage each others' feet, they win.
jmdirt
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Re: National Football League

06 Jan 2018 15:30

on3m@n@rmy wrote: I'm really skeptical about the initial report about the situation... As for ESPN, they suck too...

Agree, and agree. ESPN is losing viewership, losing their stature overall. They have taken "jockocracy" to the next level on air, and fewer people are interested anymore, and their reporting is often crap like this.

Stuff is said in locker rooms and sidelines all the time, how many times and stories have we heard about this? What's said in the locker room, stays there, and for good reason. Every player on every team knows this. Trying to take something from there and tell a whole story from it is pointless.

Does anyone in their right mind really think the trifecta of Kraft, Belicheck and Brady won't be together next year? Presuming none of them retire, say, after winning the SB? Who would be forced out? Kraft isn't selling the team, he's not going to fire Belicheck, and they're not going to trade Brady. Just for giggles though, imagine they did fire Belicheck, and the Browns hired him back...

I agree that Brady will at some point decline, but right now he's having an MVP season, and I think will win that award. While he does go through a world-class workout to keep fit and healthy, age changes everyone, and this sport isn't Golf. I thought last season Tom looked like his arm was fading a little about 12 games in, I was proven wrong, but at some point it's going to happen. He'll get banged up enough, worn out enough, and just not be able to make the throws he once did. Will that happen in 2018? If so, I'm sure they wished they had kept Garrapollo. But what if it doesn't? This is the kind of risk every team has when trading what appears to be quality back-ups.
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Re: National Football League

06 Jan 2018 16:48

Good points Alpe. My last comment on ESPN & Wickerscam, even if this report on the Pats trifecta is true, I don't really give a rip. It's almost like Wickerscam wants to turn NFL into "General Hospital", "Days of Our Lives", or the National Inquirer. I'm not buying his brand. We all love to speculate on football related things, and that's fine. But not fine is this style of reporting, which at the core involves lusting after disharmony and discord.
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Re: National Football League

07 Jan 2018 00:54

I didn't watch the whole game but from what I saw in the 4th quarter the commentators said about 50 times that the Titnas had a lot of luck.

Falls perfectly into New England's hands again who get a poor Tenesee side come to Boston after a favourable schedule and the fluke of the century got them the 1 seed again. Though KC would have lost they might have made a game of it. I hope to be alive when Brady has a season where every lucky bounce doesn't go his way.
Last edited by The Hitch on 07 Jan 2018 00:55, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: National Football League

07 Jan 2018 00:54

The chiefs seriously blew a 21:3 lead. People in Boston are partying hard right now :o

It's pretty cool though that mariota's pass to himself was actually meaningful
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07 Jan 2018 02:17

The Patriots do indeed have to be happy. Once Kelsey was lost, astounding how flat KC's offense went. But on that 4th and 9, Mitchell Schwarz was caught completely flat footed at the snap, just unreal that an OT could miss the count like that. He didn't even touch anyone coming after Smith.

While you could argue the Chiefs blew it, let's give the Titans some real credit here. They hung together, didn't let their mistakes get them down, adapted when they had to, and make the key plays when they needed to, especially Mariota. Great win for them.
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Re: National Football League

07 Jan 2018 05:34

Ha..Ha...The Chiefs blew it again! Lol. Smith had a chance with an eternity left on their last possession to get the go ahead score, and possibly the winning score and he failed to deliver. And how about the boo birds at Arrowhead; not happy with their team...imagine that. This is getting ridiculous with KC - if the Texas Gunslinger is not starting next season then he needs to leave and go somewhere else where he can play. Smith isn't leading this team anywhere except to the toilet. And Reid should maybe step down - losing a 1st round playoff game at home for the second straight year...please.
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07 Jan 2018 10:40

The story of the Chiefs season. The result of the other game surprised me more but not that much. Kansas tends to rely too much on Kelce. I doubt that the Titans win another game. The Falcons are more unpredictable.
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Re: National Football League

07 Jan 2018 13:07

Falcons back in the Super Bowl???
BullsFan22
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Re: National Football League

07 Jan 2018 13:13

BullsFan22 wrote:Falcons back in the Super Bowl???
Rematch with New England???
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07 Jan 2018 16:38

Pretty big buzz about how poor the officiating was in KC. I've said this before so sorry for the broken record, but when the officials can't keep up with the plays, they can't be effective. These guys are supposed to be professionals, they should have to meet a physical standard. Every guy on this crew was a step or two behind most of the time yesterday. I think that some of their long conferences were because they needed to recover.

RE: "Blowing a lead": Foxxy and I used to go-round with this one. The Superbowl last year, the Chiefs yesterday, aren't "blowing games" IMO. Some games go back and forth, other games come in chunks. ATL scored more in the first half (3Q), NE scored more in the second half. KC scored more in the first half, TEN scored more in the second. I guess technically anytime you lose, you 'blew' the game, but if TEN would have lost, did they blow the game because of their poor first half (scoring).

Smith should still be the starter in KC, but if they do go to the TX Gunslinger, CLE better grab Smith!

EDIT: I didn't read on3's link first...maybe AS will end up in CLE?
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Re: National Football League

07 Jan 2018 21:55



Probably both good places to go to top up the retirement fund but don't see much winning happening at either. How long will Kansas persevere with the same coach ? Similar situation at the Bengals where the coach is safe and also Green Bay.
movingtarget
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08 Jan 2018 03:14

CAR lost the game when (he doesn't deserve to have his name typed) dropped a pretty easy TD catch in Q1. Cam is mentally fragile and that missed catch changed his posture so you know it changed his mind set. He did come around again, but not until they were playing from behind.

The missed chip shot field goal...

I'm ready for the Nat champs tomorrow and then the playoff match ups next weekend!
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08 Jan 2018 19:31

Like you said about blowing games, I mostly saw the Saints converting when they needed to, more than the Panthers blowing it. Like Tennessee, and Atlanta and Jacksonville, I'd prefer to credit the winning team. Having said that, how Carolina didn't think the Saints might blitz on a 4th and 23, and be ready to protect it, is beyond me. I mean, they HAD to get 23 yards, and hurry or get out of bounds. They weren't going to run, they weren't going to screen, they weren't going for a quick slant, hook, rub, etc. They had to know there would be a wall of Saints DB's roughly 15-20 yards back in a cover 4 dime defense mostly protecting the outs, meaning any offensive play would take more than 3 seconds to develop, which is ripe for any defense to send 5+ guys after the QB. Weak protection almost guarantees a sack there, even against someone like Cam.

That Jacksonville Buffalo game was pretty messy. Loved the Bills grit though.

I have mostly been a supporter of Smith, but I won't be surprised at all if he's gone next season either. But those who seem to think Mahomes is going to lead them to more wins, let alone better stats than Smith, are in for a real surprise. In 3-5 years? Who knows though I guess. But KC may be thinking next season is time to rebuild before they absolutely have to and sit in the cellar. They have cap issues already, and it's likely Oakland and LAR are going to fight for that division next year anyway.

Thoughts on next weeks games soon.
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08 Jan 2018 20:54

First, the AFC.

I loved the game that Mariota and the Titans showed in beating the Chiefs, but Foxboro has to be the end of the line for them. Even if the Pats play a poor game, even if ESPN's "distractions" are true, I'll still take them to win. Tennessee's only real chance is to test the Pats front seven with a lot of runs, and hope for some bounced balls on defense.

As bad as Jacksonville played against Buffalo, they do have a remote chance against Pittsburgh. First, no one expects them to win, at all. So a lot of the nerves they showed, mostly Bortles, will be a lot lower. Also, for half their season Pittsburgh did a very good job of playing to the level of their competition, including down to many teams. If the do that here, Jacksonville has a chance. I just don't see it.

NFC

Here's where all the good games are.

I felt good in predicting a Falcon win over the Rams, but don't think because they ran through one tough defense, they can do the same against Philadelphia. The Eagles DL is better than any in the NFL, and they will get after Ryan. They also press and push more on short routes, believing they can get pressure up front. Also, the Eagle offense doesn't play the same short game the Rams do. Yes, Foles is not Wentz, and they don't have Gurley, but the Eagles run the ball well, with multiple backs, in different ways. The Falcon defense is built with strength in the middle, and speed everywhere else. The Eagles have the running tools to attack that, and some of the passing ones as well. Foles could lose this game for Philly, but with the extra week of prep, I doubt it. The Falcons would have to be on fire I think to win this. But the key is if they can get ahead by more than about 8, especially in the 2nd half. They do that, the Eagles may not be able to come back.

I said mid-season the Saints were a favorite of mine, but I also think the Vikings are maybe the most complete team in the NFL right now. I like them on offense, defense, special teams, against the run, and pass. Case Keenum may be the weakest element of the team, but he's actually pretty good. He doesn't need to win, the same way the Eagles don't need Foles to win games. But like the Eagles-Falcons matchup, if the Vikings fall behind against the Saints in the 2nd half, they may not be able to come back. The Saints can do so much, and against the Panthers they seemed to know Carolina would try to stop the run, and mostly did, but Brees was completely comfortable throwing one beautiful pass after another in pressure situations. Saints are very dangerous. 2nd best team in the NFC behind only Minnesota, who they may actually beat.
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