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Re: U.S. Politics

12 Jun 2018 12:27

scott about Canada and tariffs-
When you know you are getting ripped off... when do you stop? When do you change your purchasing behavior? There's the old saying... "if you can't F your friends then who can you F....?" Maybe it's long past time we change our behavior.

How about telling the truth, is that too much of a stretch? Goods and services with Canada 2017, the US had a trade SURPLUS..but donnie the dope ignores that.
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 12:28

Bustedknuckle wrote:
Beech Mtn wrote:@Busted,

I predict that somewhere along the way (maybe not even too far off), you're going to end up liking Trump on some level. It looks like there a lot of things going down (domestically and internationally) that aren't being reported in the same old corporate sources.

Not trolling you, either. Really think you're going to change your tune one day. Could be wrong, but that's my prediction.


As long as trump continues to demonstrate stupidity, boorishness, rudeness, ignorance, arrogance, sexism and racism, I will dislike him a LOT. Words matter, being polite and statesmanlike does NOT equal weakness. I've said many times before, we all want good economy, security, a rear fix to immigration, etc..things that we all agree on but trump should just STFU and stop being such a pri&k. His clown car act at the G6 is a perfect example. I am really tired of this 'trump being trump' BS. We are a laughing stock of most places in the world. The guy doesn't have to be an arsewhole surrounded by hingenecks and other arsewholes. guilianai comes to mind, pruitt, sessions, huckabee, the idiots at faux news, donnie's propaganda machine.


I guarantee you this isn’t true. People in many places in the world act like you do toward DJT, but, like you, they aren’t laughing.
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 12:34

All Americans will see a tax hike? How monumentally unfair to the millions paying nothing now.

My guess is the Bernie plan, or some version of it, happens. My guess, too, is it will become a monsterous entitlement that will be exceptionally clumsy and inefficient. Whatever the cost is thought to be, $1.4 Trillion, won’t be even close. What’s the famous excuse for every government plan not working the way it should? That’s right, not enough money.

There’s a better way. But we won’t go that direction because it makes too much sense and doesn’t provide even more social engineering power to DC bureaucrats.


I guess it was intentional to ignore the part about the $ savings overall for individual and business'. 'Pay nothing now'? So, the for profit health care system is working SO well, we ought to not change a thing and let big whomever get richer and richer while your premiums go up and up for less and less care..great idea.

Medicare is NOT 'exceptionally' clumsy or inefficient..and please, the VA is NOT an example of 'Government health care'.
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Re: U.S. Politics

12 Jun 2018 12:35

Bustedknuckle wrote:scott about Canada and tariffs-
When you know you are getting ripped off... when do you stop? When do you change your purchasing behavior? There's the old saying... "if you can't F your friends then who can you F....?" Maybe it's long past time we change our behavior.

How about telling the truth, is that too much of a stretch? Goods and services with Canada 2017, the US had a trade SURPLUS..but donnie the dope ignores that.



No.

https://ustr.gov/countries-regions/americas/canada

It’s not necessarily about a trade imbalance. It’s about access to markets.
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 12:40

Scott SoCal wrote:
I think even Xi was freaked when Kim was lobbing missiles over Japan. Xi realizes a tactical nuke exchange is bad for business and got on board with the enforcing sanctions.

Xi has China in a pretty good position. What’s going to F up their forward momentum? Yep, you guessed it. Xi realizes a big China gain with NK in the world community... my guess anyways.

And to those who thought this meeting was anything other than a jumping off point... be as critical as you like. Personally I like this posture a bit more than a couple of test ICBM’s a month. I’m not convinced anybody is expecting a miracle and this is a place to start. It could all crumble and that’s probably up to Xi.


But scott, you said-
China already has ‘let that happen.’ Somewhere along the line Kim has managed to alienate China. Bad move.


China is calling the shots, kim was briefed by Xi before the trump-kim photo-op dog and pony show
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 12:43

Bustedknuckle wrote:
All Americans will see a tax hike? How monumentally unfair to the millions paying nothing now.

My guess is the Bernie plan, or some version of it, happens. My guess, too, is it will become a monsterous entitlement that will be exceptionally clumsy and inefficient. Whatever the cost is thought to be, $1.4 Trillion, won’t be even close. What’s the famous excuse for every government plan not working the way it should? That’s right, not enough money.

There’s a better way. But we won’t go that direction because it makes too much sense and doesn’t provide even more social engineering power to DC bureaucrats.


I guess it was intentional to ignore the part about the $ savings overall for individual and business'. 'Pay nothing now'? So, the for profit health care system is working SO well, we ought to not change a thing and let big whomever get richer and richer while your premiums go up and up for less and less care..great idea.

Medicare is NOT 'exceptionally' clumsy or inefficient..and please, the VA is NOT an example of 'Government health care'.


You do know there are a ton of healthcare providers that won’t take Medicare, right? Then what? Yep, you get to pay 15% more or change your provider. That’s awesome.

Bernie’s money savings? BS. Total and complete BS. I’ll let you work out why it’s BS.
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Re: U.S. Politics

12 Jun 2018 12:43

Scott SoCal wrote:
Bustedknuckle wrote:scott about Canada and tariffs-
When you know you are getting ripped off... when do you stop? When do you change your purchasing behavior? There's the old saying... "if you can't F your friends then who can you F....?" Maybe it's long past time we change our behavior.

How about telling the truth, is that too much of a stretch? Goods and services with Canada 2017, the US had a trade SURPLUS..but donnie the dope ignores that.



No.

https://ustr.gov/countries-regions/americas/canada

It’s not necessarily about a trade imbalance. It’s about access to markets.


No with your boy it's all donnie crows about. His ignorance about trade balances is astonishing. He really thinks a trade surplus is a 'profit' and a trade deficit is a 'loss'..OBTW-what would be the equation be if donnie hadn't shite-canned the TPP?
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 12:45

Bustedknuckle wrote:
Scott SoCal wrote:
I think even Xi was freaked when Kim was lobbing missiles over Japan. Xi realizes a tactical nuke exchange is bad for business and got on board with the enforcing sanctions.

Xi has China in a pretty good position. What’s going to F up their forward momentum? Yep, you guessed it. Xi realizes a big China gain with NK in the world community... my guess anyways.

And to those who thought this meeting was anything other than a jumping off point... be as critical as you like. Personally I like this posture a bit more than a couple of test ICBM’s a month. I’m not convinced anybody is expecting a miracle and this is a place to start. It could all crumble and that’s probably up to Xi.


But scott, you said-
China already has ‘let that happen.’ Somewhere along the line Kim has managed to alienate China. Bad move.


China is calling the shots, kim was briefed by Xi before the trump-kim photo-op dog and pony show


I understand. I also understand Xi got onboard with sanction enforcement. Why? Probably missiles flying over Japan had something to do with it.
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 12:47

Scott SoCal wrote:
Bustedknuckle wrote:
All Americans will see a tax hike? How monumentally unfair to the millions paying nothing now.

My guess is the Bernie plan, or some version of it, happens. My guess, too, is it will become a monsterous entitlement that will be exceptionally clumsy and inefficient. Whatever the cost is thought to be, $1.4 Trillion, won’t be even close. What’s the famous excuse for every government plan not working the way it should? That’s right, not enough money.

There’s a better way. But we won’t go that direction because it makes too much sense and doesn’t provide even more social engineering power to DC bureaucrats.


I guess it was intentional to ignore the part about the $ savings overall for individual and business'. 'Pay nothing now'? So, the for profit health care system is working SO well, we ought to not change a thing and let big whomever get richer and richer while your premiums go up and up for less and less care..great idea.

Medicare is NOT 'exceptionally' clumsy or inefficient..and please, the VA is NOT an example of 'Government health care'.


You do know there are a ton of healthcare providers that won’t take Medicare, right? Then what? Yep, you get to pay 15% more or change your provider. That’s awesome.

Bernie’s money savings? BS. Total and complete BS. I’ll let you work out why it’s BS.


"healthcare providers', you mean those for profit, in the insurance companies pocket, 'health care providers?
The basic structure needs to change. This path, particularly after trump tried to backdoor the ACA to 'make it fail', on the backs of millions of people' is unsustainable. Bernie's plan is a start..to throw it out is GOP BS. But, no surprise there.
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Re: U.S. Politics

12 Jun 2018 12:49

Bustedknuckle wrote:
Scott SoCal wrote:
Bustedknuckle wrote:scott about Canada and tariffs-
When you know you are getting ripped off... when do you stop? When do you change your purchasing behavior? There's the old saying... "if you can't F your friends then who can you F....?" Maybe it's long past time we change our behavior.

How about telling the truth, is that too much of a stretch? Goods and services with Canada 2017, the US had a trade SURPLUS..but donnie the dope ignores that.



No.

https://ustr.gov/countries-regions/americas/canada

It’s not necessarily about a trade imbalance. It’s about access to markets.


No with your boy it's all donnie crows about. His ignorance about trade balances is astonishing. He really thinks a trade surplus is a 'profit' and a trade deficit is a 'loss'..OBTW-what would be the equation be if donnie hadn't shite-canned the TPP?


Imbalance is an indicator but not the be-all, end-all. Tell me, why would Don propose zero tariff, zero barriers, zero subsidies? What does he know?

He knows in a truly open market the US will compete fiercely. There will be imbalances in an open market and that will signal preferences of consumers, not unfair trade.
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 12:58

Bustedknuckle wrote:
Scott SoCal wrote:
Bustedknuckle wrote:
All Americans will see a tax hike? How monumentally unfair to the millions paying nothing now.

My guess is the Bernie plan, or some version of it, happens. My guess, too, is it will become a monsterous entitlement that will be exceptionally clumsy and inefficient. Whatever the cost is thought to be, $1.4 Trillion, won’t be even close. What’s the famous excuse for every government plan not working the way it should? That’s right, not enough money.

There’s a better way. But we won’t go that direction because it makes too much sense and doesn’t provide even more social engineering power to DC bureaucrats.


I guess it was intentional to ignore the part about the $ savings overall for individual and business'. 'Pay nothing now'? So, the for profit health care system is working SO well, we ought to not change a thing and let big whomever get richer and richer while your premiums go up and up for less and less care..great idea.

Medicare is NOT 'exceptionally' clumsy or inefficient..and please, the VA is NOT an example of 'Government health care'.


You do know there are a ton of healthcare providers that won’t take Medicare, right? Then what? Yep, you get to pay 15% more or change your provider. That’s awesome.

Bernie’s money savings? BS. Total and complete BS. I’ll let you work out why it’s BS.


"healthcare providers', you mean those for profit, in the insurance companies pocket, 'health care providers?
The basic structure needs to change. This path, particularly after trump tried to backdoor the ACA to 'make it fail', on the backs of millions of people' is unsustainable. Bernie's plan is a start..to throw it out is GOP BS. But, no surprise there.


Yep. Doctors that can’t make ends meet for a variety of reasons.

http://managemypractice.com/10-reasons-why-your-doctor-wont-see-medicare-patients/

Every working person on planet earth is a ‘for profit’ entity. Even those who barter... and even healthcare providers. And they will be in a government run system as well.
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12 Jun 2018 14:02

Funny compilation of events from the Kim/ Trump summit.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/patricksmith/trump-kim-summit-wtf-moments?utm_term=.yu2OwYAqv#.ea4R6kz1x

I think Trump was woefully out of his element on this front and I am continually amazed at how readily he spouts other countries' propaganda, but I am glad that the US is opting for diplomacy first. I think the concessions given to NK were excessive, but hopefully Trump will consider this his 'victory' and move on, allowing the regional players to settle the situation.
Donald Trump: “If you go back to the Civil War, it was the Republicans who did the thing.”
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Re: U.S. Politics

12 Jun 2018 14:08

Atlantic editor Jeffrey Goldberg reported this week that the Trump Doctrine he heard from multiple White House advisers was short and to the point: “We’re America, bitch.”

It’s the perfect encapsulation of the Trump administration’s false bravado. This is an America that uses a misogynist slur to cast the rest of the world as weak and acted-upon. It’s also an America that proudly sits down with the leader of a murderous regime; says nothing about the suffering of the North Korean people; and seems content to come away with no concrete road map to address the nuclear weapons that threaten our nation and our allies. Doesn’t seem that tough, does it?


Brilliant.
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Re: U.S. Politics

12 Jun 2018 14:13

Scott SoCal wrote:
Bustedknuckle wrote:
Scott SoCal wrote:
Bustedknuckle wrote:scott about Canada and tariffs-
When you know you are getting ripped off... when do you stop? When do you change your purchasing behavior? There's the old saying... "if you can't F your friends then who can you F....?" Maybe it's long past time we change our behavior.

How about telling the truth, is that too much of a stretch? Goods and services with Canada 2017, the US had a trade SURPLUS..but donnie the dope ignores that.



No.

https://ustr.gov/countries-regions/americas/canada

It’s not necessarily about a trade imbalance. It’s about access to markets.


No with your boy it's all donnie crows about. His ignorance about trade balances is astonishing. He really thinks a trade surplus is a 'profit' and a trade deficit is a 'loss'..OBTW-what would be the equation be if donnie hadn't shite-canned the TPP?


Imbalance is an indicator but not the be-all, end-all. Tell me, why would Don propose zero tariff, zero barriers, zero subsidies? What does he know?

He knows in a truly open market the US will compete fiercely. There will be imbalances in an open market and that will signal preferences of consumers, not unfair trade.


Ya mean like farm subsidies and energy subsidies and numerous other, US govt corporate give always? Nice sound bite tho. Donnie is good at that.

OBTW ‘denuke the Korean Peninsula’, that include US nukes? US nuke umbrella? Shows how nearly worthless the show was in Singapore.
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Re: U.S. Politics

12 Jun 2018 14:47

Bustedknuckle wrote:

Ya mean like farm subsidies and energy subsidies and numerous other, US govt corporate give always? Nice sound bite tho. Donnie is good at that.

OBTW ‘denuke the Korean Peninsula’, that include US nukes? US nuke umbrella? Shows how nearly worthless the show was in Singapore.


Ya mean like farm subsidies and energy subsidies and numerous other, US govt corporate give always?


Not only US Corporate welfare...

OBTW ‘denuke the Korean Peninsula’, that include US nukes? US nuke umbrella? Shows how nearly worthless the show was in Singapore.


Uh, lessee... you were freaked when Trump was talking tough with Little Rocket Man, freaked when Kim was lobbing missiles, freaked when Kim was testing nukes, freaked when Trump sends the carrier fleet, Freaked when Trump announces the meeting with Kim, freaked when Trump withdraws from the meeting and freaked when Trump attends the meeting with Kim.

You know what that makes you?
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 14:52

Scott SoCal wrote:
Bustedknuckle wrote:
Alpe73 wrote:
python wrote:
ChewbaccaDefense wrote:the world's reaction will be to Trump's North Korea "historic" document....

they ended the face-to-face talks an hour ago and trump will be giving a presser in an hour...

you are correct, the 'world' reaction is wow, particularly in the west since only outward and superficial signs are concerning the talking heads.

in reality, if i can summarize the chinese cgtn comments - the only outlet i found paying any attention to the substance as opposed to how many minutes they shook hands - trump achieved NOTHING. the document they signed did not contain the words pompeo boasted about. no denuclearization of north korea ONLY, but the korean peninsula. no unilateral declarations about 'complete and verifiable' etc

i am glad that you are one of not that many americans who are still paying attention to substance.

btw, virtually NO western source i read mentioned that kim flew to singapore from............china on a chinese plane with a security provided by china. [b]guess where kim was briefed before impressing trump ?[/b]


I live in the region. Interesting how the Chinese play their cards. Xi be weavin a long game plan. Will.


Of course. In spite of what scott said about China 'abandoning NK', China is calling NK's shots and China has trump the dummy right where they want him..'the troops will be coming home'..gee, ya think China likes the idea that US troops will be leaving China's doorstep? trump needs to see some cartoons about the $ and time savings of forward deployment.


I think even Xi was freaked when Kim was lobbing missiles over Japan. Xi realizes a tactical nuke exchange is bad for business and got on board with the enforcing sanctions.

Xi has China in a pretty good position. What’s going to F up their forward momentum? Yep, you guessed it. Xi realizes a big China gain with NK in the world community... my guess anyways.

And to those who thought this meeting was anything other than a jumping off point... be as critical as you like. Personally I like this posture a bit more than a couple of test ICBM’s a month. I’m not convinced anybody is expecting a miracle and this is a place to start. It could all crumble and that’s probably up to Xi.


What's amusing is to see, for the billionth time, the hypocrisy of the right...when Obama suggested meeting with Jong-il, you guys lit up the airwaves with fake outrage at the idea of our president meeting with a dictator with no preconditions...well, from what we're seeing, there weren't any preconditions here either, and as is being pointed out, Trump is being played by Xi. Expertly.

Empty promises with no mechanism to enforce anything...best agreement ever, you'll see, nobody knows more about making empty agreements than Trump...add it to the list: https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/nedxnm/24-things-nobody-does-better-than-trump-according-to-trump
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 14:56

Scott SoCal wrote:
Bustedknuckle wrote:
Beech Mtn wrote:@Busted,

I predict that somewhere along the way (maybe not even too far off), you're going to end up liking Trump on some level. It looks like there a lot of things going down (domestically and internationally) that aren't being reported in the same old corporate sources.

Not trolling you, either. Really think you're going to change your tune one day. Could be wrong, but that's my prediction.


As long as trump continues to demonstrate stupidity, boorishness, rudeness, ignorance, arrogance, sexism and racism, I will dislike him a LOT. Words matter, being polite and statesmanlike does NOT equal weakness. I've said many times before, we all want good economy, security, a rear fix to immigration, etc..things that we all agree on but trump should just STFU and stop being such a pri&k. His clown car act at the G6 is a perfect example. I am really tired of this 'trump being trump' BS. We are a laughing stock of most places in the world. The guy doesn't have to be an arsewhole surrounded by hingenecks and other arsewholes. guilianai comes to mind, pruitt, sessions, huckabee, the idiots at faux news, donnie's propaganda machine.


I guarantee you this isn’t true. People in many places in the world act like you do toward DJT, but, like you, they aren’t laughing.


If he didn't have access to the most advanced nuclear arsenal in the world, they'd be laughing...but an idiot with weapons is never something to laugh at...so, you're right...
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 14:58

ChewbaccaDefense wrote:

What's amusing is to see, for the billionth time, the hypocrisy of the right...when Obama suggested meeting with Jong-il, you guys lit up the airwaves with fake outrage at the idea of our president meeting with a dictator with no preconditions...well, from what we're seeing, there weren't any preconditions here either, and as is being pointed out, Trump is being played by Xi. Expertly.

Empty promises with no mechanism to enforce anything...best agreement ever, you'll see, nobody knows more about making empty agreements than Trump...add it to the list: https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/nedxnm/24-things-nobody-does-better-than-trump-according-to-trump


What's equally amusing to see is the abandonment of diplomacy principles in order to continue the all-out attack on all things Trump.

Plenty of hypocrisy to go 'round.

As for the agreement, what do you think was possible? You think Don was going to go in a roll Kim and Kim would be ok getting rolled? You think there might be a few complexities here?

This is how diplomacy works and that's something that, until very recently, the left understood.
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 15:02

ChewbaccaDefense wrote:
Scott SoCal wrote:
Bustedknuckle wrote:
Beech Mtn wrote:@Busted,

I predict that somewhere along the way (maybe not even too far off), you're going to end up liking Trump on some level. It looks like there a lot of things going down (domestically and internationally) that aren't being reported in the same old corporate sources.

Not trolling you, either. Really think you're going to change your tune one day. Could be wrong, but that's my prediction.


As long as trump continues to demonstrate stupidity, boorishness, rudeness, ignorance, arrogance, sexism and racism, I will dislike him a LOT. Words matter, being polite and statesmanlike does NOT equal weakness. I've said many times before, we all want good economy, security, a rear fix to immigration, etc..things that we all agree on but trump should just STFU and stop being such a pri&k. His clown car act at the G6 is a perfect example. I am really tired of this 'trump being trump' BS. We are a laughing stock of most places in the world. The guy doesn't have to be an arsewhole surrounded by hingenecks and other arsewholes. guilianai comes to mind, pruitt, sessions, huckabee, the idiots at faux news, donnie's propaganda machine.


I guarantee you this isn’t true. People in many places in the world act like you do toward DJT, but, like you, they aren’t laughing.


If he didn't have access to the most advanced nuclear arsenal in the world, they'd be laughing...but an idiot with weapons is never something to laugh at...so, you're right...


Yep. I remember the Reagan years. Almost the same except the invective is much harsher this time.
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Re: Re:

12 Jun 2018 15:07

Scott SoCal wrote:
ChewbaccaDefense wrote:

What's amusing is to see, for the billionth time, the hypocrisy of the right...when Obama suggested meeting with Jong-il, you guys lit up the airwaves with fake outrage at the idea of our president meeting with a dictator with no preconditions...well, from what we're seeing, there weren't any preconditions here either, and as is being pointed out, Trump is being played by Xi. Expertly.

Empty promises with no mechanism to enforce anything...best agreement ever, you'll see, nobody knows more about making empty agreements than Trump...add it to the list: https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/nedxnm/24-things-nobody-does-better-than-trump-according-to-trump


What's equally amusing to see is the abandonment of diplomacy principles in order to continue the all-out attack on all things Trump.

Plenty of hypocrisy to go 'round.

As for the agreement, what do you think was possible? You think Don was going to go in a roll Kim and Kim would be ok getting rolled? You think there might be a few complexities here?

This is how diplomacy works and that's something that, until very recently, the left understood.


Yeah, contrast this "deal" with the Iran nuclear deal...you're championing a toothless, worthless, empty set of promises, that do nothing, mean nothing, and will produce nothing of substance...but you railed on and on about another deal that actually did move the needle...your hypocrisy is astounding...that wasn't "diplomacy," that was a f**king idiot, not knowing he was being played.
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