Log in:  

Register

Tyres or Tires.

Whether you are wondering how to true a wheel, how to fix that clicking sound or simply maintain your bike for the long haul, the Workshop & Maintenance forum is your one-stop online mechanic shop.

Moderator: Pricey_sky

Tyres or Tires.

02 Sep 2015 17:22

Your bike's tyres are among its most important components, being the only parts in direct contact with the ground and playing a huge role in your riding comfort, control and performance.

However the type of tyre you need will depend not only on the type of bike you ride but also on a multitude of other variables – from the size of your wheels to the conditions you ride in, from the playoff of comfort vs performance to the budget at your disposal.

MTB Tyres: -

MTB tyres are designed with aggressive tread patterns to deliver grip in tough off-road conditions, while still providing a balance of speed and riding comfort.

There are a huge range of MTB tyres on the market designed for different riding disciplines, conditions, wheel sizes and other variables, so it is helpful to understand some of the basic concepts behind their construction and design in order to choose a set that will suit your riding.

The tyre you choose will depend on the conditions you ride in (hard-packed dry trails, thick winter gloop or a mixture of both?), your preferred riding discipline (fast cross-country or action-packed downhill?), the dimensions of your wheels and of course your budget.

You may be looking for a conditions-specific tyre, or a durable and reliable all-rounder that will handle anything you can throw at it.

Super-lightweight XC race tyres, for example, may benefit riders in competition but wear too quickly for everyday use, while seasonal tyres – big tyres with low-profile knobs for summer trails, narrow toothy tyres for cutting through winter mud – may also help you get the best out of year-round riding.

You may also wish to join the ranks of riders using tubeless systems to eliminate the need for an inner tube and save time on puncture repair.

Construction
MTB tyres are made of three constituent parts:
1. Beads: Two strong hoops of steel or Kevlar which hook the tyre into the rim of the wheel to keep it in place. Steel-beaded tyres (often referred to as wire beads) are the cheaper option – Kevlar beads are lighter weight and fold for easy storage (so Kevlar-beaded tyres are known as folding tyres).
2. Carcass: The body of the tyre, made from woven fabric.
3. Rubber: The exterior of the tyre which covers the carcass. The thick rubber on the part of the tyre that comes into contact with the ground is called the tread, while thinner rubber covers the sidewalls between the tread and the beads. Tread patterns and rubber compounds are important considerations when choosing tyres (see below).

The majority of MTB tyres using inflatable inner tubes to hold air, but tubeless tyre systems are growing in popularity as they dispense with the extra weight of the tube and can also be run with liquid latex sealant inside the tyre to automatically seal punctures when they occur.

Sizing
The issue of tyre sizing can be a complex one. Firstly, MTB wheels come in a range of diameters so you will need the right size tyre for your wheel. For many years the industry standard was 26”, until a growing cadre of riders adopted the larger 29” type claiming advantages in maintaining speed and rolling over obstacles. In recent years however the 27.5” (also known as 650b) “middle ground” size has become prevalent on many new bikes, as it offers a performance compromise – small enough to accelerate quickly and offer nippy handling, large enought to roll easily over trail obstacles and maintain speed.

For many riders wheel size is a matter of personal preference – it's just key to bear in mind when replacing tyres that you need to get the right size for your wheel.

When it comes to tyre width, MTB tyres range from 1.8” wide (narrow, lightweight tyres aimed at XC racers) to monster 2.5” tyres for Downhill (DH) racing and Freeride (FR).

However the majority of tyres for most riders and riding conditions range from 2.1” to 2.35” inches in width, with the larger tyres holding more air for increased cushioning and more surface area for grip, but also adding extra weight. The issue is confused by the fact that manufacturers measure the width of their tyres in different ways, with some quoting the width across the carcass of the tyre and others measuring from the tips of the knobs on either shoulder. This means that a 2.1” tyre from one manufacturer may in fact be chunkier than a 2.35” from another.

Tyre width is an important consideration as it affects the character of your ride – with larger volume tyres offering more comfort at the expense of light weight and rolling resistance – and also some wider or narrower tyres may not fit certain wheel rims.

Narrow, lightweight rims aimed at XC riders will not be suitable for a wide (more than 2.35”) tyre as it will roll off the rim, while wide DH rims do not match with narrow XC tyres. Often the rim manufacturer will print a recommended range of tyre sizes on the rim itself, which is useful as a rule of thumb.

A further consideration is tyre weight. Lightweight tyres reduce the rotational weight of your wheels making them easier to accelerate. However heavier tyres offer better protection against punctures and pinch flats ('snakebite' punctures caused by the tube being pinched between the rim and a hard, sharp object such as a rock) and they also run better at low pressures for more traction.

Tread types
Tread patterns used on tyres vary enormously. Some tyres may have directional tread patterns (often with a 'v'-shaped pattern) which are designed to roll in one direction for increased speed (or can be reversed to boost grip), while other tyres are uni-directional.

Tread knobs provide traction in rough terrain, digging into soft surfaces and grabbing wet rocks or roots. Bigger/taller knobs tend to dig deeper for better grip – tyres with these can be said to have 'aggressive' tread patterns. However those toothy tyres run slower on hard-packed surfaces with the knobs sapping speed and reducing rolling resistance, so low-profile knobs are often the choice for racers looking to eke out as much speed as possible, or for use on hard, dry summer trails.

Knob spacing is also a consideration. A tread pattern with tightly packed knobs will roll faster in dry conditions but is more prone to becoming clogged with mud, while widely-spaced treads grip better in the wet and are also better at shedding dirt.

NOTE: Some riders find that running different tyres front and rear gives them the best balance between speed and grip. Wide and grippy front tyres can prevent the front end sliding and 'washing out', with narrower, smoother tyres on the rear (where most of the rider's weight is) for better straight-line speed. Mix and match to find what suits you best.

Tread compounds
Tyres are also available with different rubber compounds, with the durometer being a measure of how soft the rubber is. Tyres with a durometer of 70 are cheap, hard, fast-rolling and long-lasting, while softer, stickier tyres (with a durometer of under 50) offer much improved grip at the expense of durability and speed. Many riders find a compound rating of around 60 gives the best all-round compromised for long tyre life and optimum performance across a variety of conditions. Some manufacturers now offer double- or even triple-compound tyres, with a harder centre section for fast rolling and softer shoulder for off-camber and cornering traction.

Tyre profiles
Tyres also come with different profiles - square-profile tyres with knobs on the shoulders have more grip on their edges (useful for riding off-camber trails and roots) while rounder tyres are easier to roll into corners and slide more predictably.

Tubeless tyres
Tubeless tyres dispense with the inner tube and can also feature a sealant liquid inside which will automatically fill and harden in the hole made by a puncture.

They have many performance advantages – lighter weight, better resistance to pinch flats, can be run at low pressure - but because an airtight seal is required to seat them on the rim, can be tricky to install.

There are a number of different types of tubeless systems:
1. UST: Most specially designed tubeless tyres and rims use the UST (Universal Systeme Tubeless) system which has a thick side-walled tyre locking into a specific sealed-bed UST rim. This provides a stable, high-performance tubeless tyre with or without sealant, but is expensive.
2. Tubeless kits: Tubeless kits such as Stan's No Tubes allow and tyre and rim to be converted to tubeless using a liquid latex sealant and a rubber rim strip to seal the inside of the rim
3. 'Tubeless ready': Some manufacturers now offer rims and tyres that are intended to be easily converted to tubeless using a sealant kit.


Road Tyres: -

Tyres for road bikes can appear broadly similar but there are varieties in sizing, construction and performance that are important to take into account before making any purchase.

You will need to consider the day-to-day conditions in which you ride in order to choose a tyre that will serve you well, as well as considering the correct balance between comfort and performance.

High-performance tyres designed for the rigours of competitive racing are built with different criteria than those designed for commuting duties or winter training (e.g. light weight at the expense of durability), so automatically buying the most expensive tyre may not be the answer.

There is always a trade-off between durability, weight, puncture protection and rolling resistance - many riders will therefore opt for an all-round tyre that provides the optimum performance balance for their needs.

Construction
Road bike tyres are made of three constituent parts:
Beads: Two strong hoops of steel or Kevlar which hook the tyre into the rim of the wheel to keep it in place. Steel-beaded tyres (often referred to as wire beads) are the cheaper option – Kevlar beads are lighter weight and fold for easy storage and transport (so Kevlar-beaded tyres are known as folding tyres).
Carcass: The body of the tyre, made from woven fabric. The number of threads per inch (TPI) used in the construction of the carcass is often an important indicator of the quality of the tyre. The higher the TPI number, the thinner and more flexible the tyre fabric is. Thin-wall (high TPI) tyres tend to be lighter and have lower rolling resistance, but they are more prone to damage.
Rubber: The exterior of the tyre which covers the carcass. The thick rubber on the part of the tyre that comes into contact with the ground is called the tread, while thinner rubber covers the sidewalls between the tread and the beads. Tread patterns and rubber compounds are important considerations when choosing tyres (see below).

Sizing
Road bike tyres come in a variety of sizes with the most common diameter being 700c (for most adult road race bikes) and 650c (smaller racing bikes for juniors and ladies, some high-performance time trial and triathlon bikes).

Tyre width depends on intended use. Many racers will opt for skinny 23mm tyres (or even 20mm) which can be inflated to a higher pressure for maximum speed. However increasing numbers of riders are choosing more comfortable 25mm tyres for everyday use, winter training or sportive events, as they find the extra cushioning worth any sacrifice in overall speed. Some events or surfaces may even call for 28mm tyres – the classic Pavé (cobblestoned) surfaces of European races such as the Paris-Roubaix being a case in point - but check that your rim is wide enough to accommodate these.

Tubular vs. clincher
Tyres designed for road racing bikes - as opposed to commuters or touring bikes – are divided into two main categories, clincher and tubular.

Clincher tyres are by far the most common type, consisting of a beaded tyre which hooks onto the rim of the wheel and is used with an inner tube.

Tubular tyres are sealed units with an inner tube sewn into the casing of the tyre. The are designed for rims which do not have the hook for the bead (and so are lighter), being glued in placed with tubular cement or secured using special tape. They can be inflated to a higher pressure than clincher tyres meaning they run faster.

Tubular tyres have long been the choice of the racing professional who values their performance advantages – lighter overall weight, better rolling resistance due to higher inflation limit, round profile aids in cornering – but for leisure riders clinchers are generally considered the better option due to their availability, affordability and ease of repair.

Developments in tyre technology including Kevlar beads have meanwhile narrowed the weight gap between clincher and tubular tyres, while the difficulties in carrying a spare 'tub' while riding mean that they are impractical for riders who are not supported by a team car.

NOTE: Sizing for tubular wheels is different to clincher wheels with manufacturers still using imperial sizes (26” equates to 650c and 28” to 700c). In order to be certain of sizing when choosing new tyres you can use the five-digit ISO number printed on the rim to pick a matching tyre. This number gives gives the tyre section (in millimetres), followed by a dash, followed by the tyre diameter at the bead where it sits on the rim.
A 700c rim, for example, measures 622mm in diameter. A tyre with an ISO number of 25-622 therefore is equivalent to 700x25c .

Tread
When it comes to tyre tread, a deep tread pattern is generally unnecessary for road racing bikes, as the surface of the road is rougher than any tread and provides plenty of traction. Some tyres for all-weather use may feature a shallow tread to aid in shedding water or to provide extra grip on the shoulders.

Riders who do wish to improve their grip can choose a tyre with a softer compound – meaning the rubber used in the tread construction is softer - or opt to run a tyre at lower pressure to increase the contact area with the surface of the road.

A softer-compound tyre will give better traction, but at the expense of more rapid wear. Dual-compound tyres feature a centre strip of fairly hard rubber for improved wear and softer 'shoulders' for better cornering.
User avatar JackRabbitSlims
Member
 
Posts: 1,474
Joined: 10 Jan 2010 01:06
Location: On The Road.

Re: Tyres or Tires.

09 Oct 2015 15:49

JackRabbitSlims wrote:Your bike's tyres are among its most important components, being the only parts in direct contact with the ground and playing a huge role in your riding comfort, control and performance.

However the type of tyre you need will depend not only on the type of bike you ride but also on a multitude of other variables – from the size of your wheels to the conditions you ride in, from the playoff of comfort vs performance to the budget at your disposal.

MTB Tyres: -

MTB tyres are designed with aggressive tread patterns to deliver grip in tough off-road conditions, while still providing a balance of speed and riding comfort.

There are a huge range of MTB tyres on the market designed for different riding disciplines, conditions, wheel sizes and other variables, so it is helpful to understand some of the basic concepts behind their construction and design in order to choose a set that will suit your riding.

The tyre you choose will depend on the conditions you ride in (hard-packed dry trails, thick winter gloop or a mixture of both?), your preferred riding discipline (fast cross-country or action-packed downhill?), the dimensions of your wheels and of course your budget.

You may be looking for a conditions-specific tyre, or a durable and reliable all-rounder that will handle anything you can throw at it.

Super-lightweight XC race tyres, for example, may benefit riders in competition but wear too quickly for everyday use, while seasonal tyres – big tyres with low-profile knobs for summer trails, narrow toothy tyres for cutting through winter mud – may also help you get the best out of year-round riding.

You may also wish to join the ranks of riders using tubeless systems to eliminate the need for an inner tube and save time on puncture repair.

Construction
MTB tyres are made of three constituent parts:
1. Beads: Two strong hoops of steel or Kevlar which hook the tyre into the rim of the wheel to keep it in place. Steel-beaded tyres (often referred to as wire beads) are the cheaper option – Kevlar beads are lighter weight and fold for easy storage (so Kevlar-beaded tyres are known as folding tyres).
2. Carcass: The body of the tyre, made from woven fabric.
3. Rubber: The exterior of the tyre which covers the carcass. The thick rubber on the part of the tyre that comes into contact with the ground is called the tread, while thinner rubber covers the sidewalls between the tread and the beads. Tread patterns and rubber compounds are important considerations when choosing tyres (see below).

The majority of MTB tyres using inflatable inner tubes to hold air, but tubeless tyre systems are growing in popularity as they dispense with the extra weight of the tube and can also be run with liquid latex sealant inside the tyre to automatically seal punctures when they occur.

Sizing
The issue of tyre sizing can be a complex one. Firstly, MTB wheels come in a range of diameters so you will need the right size tyre for your wheel. For many years the industry standard was 26”, until a growing cadre of riders adopted the larger 29” type claiming advantages in maintaining speed and rolling over obstacles. In recent years however the 27.5” (also known as 650b) “middle ground” size has become prevalent on many new bikes, as it offers a performance compromise – small enough to accelerate quickly and offer nippy handling, large enought to roll easily over trail obstacles and maintain speed.

For many riders wheel size is a matter of personal preference – it's just key to bear in mind when replacing tyres that you need to get the right size for your wheel.

When it comes to tyre width, MTB tyres range from 1.8” wide (narrow, lightweight tyres aimed at XC racers) to monster 2.5” tyres for Downhill (DH) racing and Freeride (FR).

However the majority of tyres for most riders and riding conditions range from 2.1” to 2.35” inches in width, with the larger tyres holding more air for increased cushioning and more surface area for grip, but also adding extra weight. The issue is confused by the fact that manufacturers measure the width of their tyres in different ways, with some quoting the width across the carcass of the tyre and others measuring from the tips of the knobs on either shoulder. This means that a 2.1” tyre from one manufacturer may in fact be chunkier than a 2.35” from another.

Tyre width is an important consideration as it affects the character of your ride – with larger volume tyres offering more comfort at the expense of light weight and rolling resistance – and also some wider or narrower tyres may not fit certain wheel rims.

Narrow, lightweight rims aimed at XC riders will not be suitable for a wide (more than 2.35”) tyre as it will roll off the rim, while wide DH rims do not match with narrow XC tyres. Often the rim manufacturer will print a recommended range of tyre sizes on the rim itself, which is useful as a rule of thumb.

A further consideration is tyre weight. Lightweight tyres reduce the rotational weight of your wheels making them easier to accelerate. However heavier tyres offer better protection against punctures and pinch flats ('snakebite' punctures caused by the tube being pinched between the rim and a hard, sharp object such as a rock) and they also run better at low pressures for more traction.

Tread types
Tread patterns used on tyres vary enormously. Some tyres may have directional tread patterns (often with a 'v'-shaped pattern) which are designed to roll in one direction for increased speed (or can be reversed to boost grip), while other tyres are uni-directional.

Tread knobs provide traction in rough terrain, digging into soft surfaces and grabbing wet rocks or roots. Bigger/taller knobs tend to dig deeper for better grip – tyres with these can be said to have 'aggressive' tread patterns. However those toothy tyres run slower on hard-packed surfaces with the knobs sapping speed and reducing rolling resistance, so low-profile knobs are often the choice for racers looking to eke out as much speed as possible, or for use on hard, dry summer trails.

Knob spacing is also a consideration. A tread pattern with tightly packed knobs will roll faster in dry conditions but is more prone to becoming clogged with mud, while widely-spaced treads grip better in the wet and are also better at shedding dirt.

NOTE: Some riders find that running different tyres front and rear gives them the best balance between speed and grip. Wide and grippy front tyres can prevent the front end sliding and 'washing out', with narrower, smoother tyres on the rear (where most of the rider's weight is) for better straight-line speed. Mix and match to find what suits you best.

Tread compounds
Tyres are also available with different rubber compounds, with the durometer being a measure of how soft the rubber is. Tyres with a durometer of 70 are cheap, hard, fast-rolling and long-lasting, while softer, stickier tyres (with a durometer of under 50) offer much improved grip at the expense of durability and speed. Many riders find a compound rating of around 60 gives the best all-round compromised for long tyre life and optimum performance across a variety of conditions. Some manufacturers now offer double- or even triple-compound tyres, with a harder centre section for fast rolling and softer shoulder for off-camber and cornering traction.

Tyre profiles
Tyres also come with different profiles - square-profile tyres with knobs on the shoulders have more grip on their edges (useful for riding off-camber trails and roots) while rounder tyres are easier to roll into corners and slide more predictably.

Tubeless tyres
Tubeless tyres dispense with the inner tube and can also feature a sealant liquid inside which will automatically fill and harden in the hole made by a puncture.

They have many performance advantages – lighter weight, better resistance to pinch flats, can be run at low pressure - but because an airtight seal is required to seat them on the rim, can be tricky to install.

There are a number of different types of tubeless systems:
1. UST: Most specially designed tubeless tyres and rims use the UST (Universal Systeme Tubeless) system which has a thick side-walled tyre locking into a specific sealed-bed UST rim. This provides a stable, high-performance tubeless tyre with or without sealant, but is expensive.
2. Tubeless kits: Tubeless kits such as Stan's No Tubes allow and tyre and rim to be converted to tubeless using a liquid latex sealant and a rubber rim strip to seal the inside of the rim
3. 'Tubeless ready': Some manufacturers now offer rims and tyres that are intended to be easily converted to tubeless using a sealant kit.


Road Tyres: -

Tyres for road bikes can appear broadly similar but there are varieties in sizing, construction and performance that are important to take into account before making any purchase.

You will need to consider the day-to-day conditions in which you ride in order to choose a tyre that will serve you well, as well as considering the correct balance between comfort and performance.

High-performance tyres designed for the rigours of competitive racing are built with different criteria than those designed for commuting duties or winter training (e.g. light weight at the expense of durability), so automatically buying the most expensive tyre may not be the answer.

There is always a trade-off between durability, weight, puncture protection and rolling resistance - many riders will therefore opt for an all-round tyre that provides the optimum performance balance for their needs.

Construction
Road bike tyres are made of three constituent parts:
Beads: Two strong hoops of steel or Kevlar which hook the tyre into the rim of the wheel to keep it in place. Steel-beaded tyres (often referred to as wire beads) are the cheaper option – Kevlar beads are lighter weight and fold for easy storage and transport (so Kevlar-beaded tyres are known as folding tyres).
Carcass: The body of the tyre, made from woven fabric. The number of threads per inch (TPI) used in the construction of the carcass is often an important indicator of the quality of the tyre. The higher the TPI number, the thinner and more flexible the tyre fabric is. Thin-wall (high TPI) tyres tend to be lighter and have lower rolling resistance, but they are more prone to damage.
Rubber: The exterior of the tyre which covers the carcass. The thick rubber on the part of the tyre that comes into contact with the ground is called the tread, while thinner rubber covers the sidewalls between the tread and the beads. Tread patterns and rubber compounds are important considerations when choosing tyres (see below).

Sizing
Road bike tyres come in a variety of sizes with the most common diameter being 700c (for most adult road race bikes) and 650c (smaller racing bikes for juniors and ladies, some high-performance time trial and triathlon bikes).

Tyre width depends on intended use. Many racers will opt for skinny 23mm tyres (or even 20mm) which can be inflated to a higher pressure for maximum speed. However increasing numbers of riders are choosing more comfortable 25mm tyres for everyday use, winter training or sportive events, as they find the extra cushioning worth any sacrifice in overall speed. Some events or surfaces may even call for 28mm tyres – the classic Pavé (cobblestoned) surfaces of European races such as the Paris-Roubaix being a case in point - but check that your rim is wide enough to accommodate these.

Tubular vs. clincher
Tyres designed for road racing bikes - as opposed to commuters or touring bikes – are divided into two main categories, clincher and tubular.

Clincher tyres are by far the most common type, consisting of a beaded tyre which hooks onto the rim of the wheel and is used with an inner tube.

Tubular tyres are sealed units with an inner tube sewn into the casing of the tyre. The are designed for rims which do not have the hook for the bead (and so are lighter), being glued in placed with tubular cement or secured using special tape. They can be inflated to a higher pressure than clincher tyres meaning they run faster.

Tubular tyres have long been the choice of the racing professional who values their performance advantages – lighter overall weight, better rolling resistance due to higher inflation limit, round profile aids in cornering – but for leisure riders clinchers are generally considered the better option due to their availability, affordability and ease of repair.

Developments in tyre technology including Kevlar beads have meanwhile narrowed the weight gap between clincher and tubular tyres, while the difficulties in carrying a spare 'tub' while riding mean that they are impractical for riders who are not supported by a team car.

NOTE: Sizing for tubular wheels is different to clincher wheels with manufacturers still using imperial sizes (26” equates to 650c and 28” to 700c). In order to be certain of sizing when choosing new tyres you can use the five-digit ISO number printed on the rim to pick a matching tyre. This number gives gives the tyre section (in millimetres), followed by a dash, followed by the tyre diameter at the bead where it sits on the rim.
A 700c rim, for example, measures 622mm in diameter. A tyre with an ISO number of 25-622 therefore is equivalent to 700x25c .

Tread
When it comes to tyre tread, a deep tread pattern is generally unnecessary for road racing bikes, as the surface of the road is rougher than any tread and provides plenty of traction. Some tyres for all-weather use may feature a shallow tread to aid in shedding water or to provide extra grip on the shoulders.

Riders who do wish to improve their grip can choose a tyre with a softer compound – meaning the rubber used in the tread construction is softer - or opt to run a tyre at lower pressure to increase the contact area with the surface of the road.

A softer-compound tyre will give better traction, but at the expense of more rapid wear. Dual-compound tyres feature a centre strip of fairly hard rubber for improved wear and softer 'shoulders' for better cornering.


Belting (a puncture-resistant material like Kevlar, for example, that is sandwiched into the tire) may also be considered for situations like commuting or touring where glass, thorns, or steel belting threads are encountered.

Puncture protection is one of the biggest performance hits, though, because weight added to the wheel slows you down more than weight added in other places.
User avatar MarkvW
Veteran
 
Posts: 5,148
Joined: 10 Aug 2010 20:13

10 Oct 2015 09:48

I think your info is incredibly helpful, JRS, and I especially would like to highlight this part:

You will need to consider the day-to-day conditions in which you ride in order to choose a tyre that will serve you well, as well as considering the correct balance between comfort and performance.
User avatar Tricycle Rider
Member
 
Posts: 1,749
Joined: 09 Feb 2013 11:12

23 Oct 2015 10:05

Tyre tread on road tyres is utterly pointless, they are too narrow to aquaplane and as such do not require tread to shed water like car tyres. It's included as psychologically people think treaded tyres grip better, but you are much better off focussing on the compound.
Vincenzo Nibali:
"I know how to ride a bike"

Reduce your carbon footprint, ride steel.
User avatar King Boonen
Moderator
 
Posts: 6,471
Joined: 25 Jul 2012 14:38

Re:

25 Oct 2015 16:37

King Boonen wrote:Tyre tread on road tyres is utterly pointless, they are too narrow to aquaplane and as such do not require tread to shed water like car tyres. It's included as psychologically people think treaded tyres grip better, but you are much better off focussing on the compound.
I just recently bought some "slick and bald" road tires, while they are fast compared to what I'm used to riding I wouldn't even think of riding them in the rain. (They're good for sunny summer weather, but for the rainy winter weather around here I'll go back to my more "knobby" tires as they feel much safer.)

Am I doing it all wrong? :o
User avatar Tricycle Rider
Member
 
Posts: 1,749
Joined: 09 Feb 2013 11:12

Re: Re:

25 Oct 2015 21:56

Tricycle Rider wrote:
King Boonen wrote:Tyre tread on road tyres is utterly pointless, they are too narrow to aquaplane and as such do not require tread to shed water like car tyres. It's included as psychologically people think treaded tyres grip better, but you are much better off focussing on the compound.
I just recently bought some "slick and bald" road tires, while they are fast compared to what I'm used to riding I wouldn't even think of riding them in the rain. (They're good for sunny summer weather, but for the rainy winter weather around here I'll go back to my more "knobby" tires as they feel much safer.)

Am I doing it all wrong? :o

Not necessarily. I've used Michelin Pro3 and Pro4's and Continental GP4000's in the wet and they've been fine, while Continental Gatorskins for example are downright dangerous. As KB said it depends on the compound used in the tyre.

Softer, slick race tyres are good in the wet but if I know I might get caught out in the rain when training I prefer to use harder compound training tyres with some tread. That's just my personal preference.
User avatar 42x16ss
Veteran
 
Posts: 5,467
Joined: 23 May 2009 04:43
Location: Brisbane, Aus

26 Oct 2015 01:46

if you can swing it.....it's a nice luxury to have a selection of tyres that you can run suited to the conditions you're going to be riding / racing / training in.

My go to tyre for my commute and training on the Road Bike is a "Conti GP 4000 Black Chili Compound" (i think thats what its called)

When i used to race (now i'm more of a ride to complete rather than compete type of guy) I used the Michelin Pro Race which was fine......b!tch to get on and off though!

Running a wider a tyre and dropping the pressure can have a significant effect on rider comfort and road grip......in all conditions.
User avatar JackRabbitSlims
Member
 
Posts: 1,474
Joined: 10 Jan 2010 01:06
Location: On The Road.

Re: Tyres or Tires.

27 Oct 2015 21:19

User avatar Tricycle Rider
Member
 
Posts: 1,749
Joined: 09 Feb 2013 11:12

27 Oct 2015 22:37

I'm always on a budget!

You have a mtb tyre for the winter and a road bike tyre for the summer - according to those links.

Unless you are riding off-road during the winter, I wouldn't run a "knobby" tyre for road riding to obtain more grip.

If you're on the road all the time and want more grip in winter conditions, I would select a more durable compound, a wider tyre and run it at a lower pressure to create more comfort and contact with the road surface.

If you're trying to keep costs down and you're not racing or going off road - one set of good quality tyres should be sufficient.
Once a week I take all my tyres off and go through the thread with a scribe and pick all the debris that has got embedded in the tyre out!
User avatar JackRabbitSlims
Member
 
Posts: 1,474
Joined: 10 Jan 2010 01:06
Location: On The Road.

28 Oct 2015 00:07

You know, my fave bike is still the 26" steel frame "comfort" bike. And whatever tires come with it.

Everything about that bike is so perfect, except for the weight. (Have bad knees, cannot haul this kind of weight all the time.)
User avatar Tricycle Rider
Member
 
Posts: 1,749
Joined: 09 Feb 2013 11:12

29 Oct 2015 02:07

I promised myself I wouldn't waste any more money on my "Little White Porsche" (the 26" steel comfort bike), but being it's my fave bike by far I just had to spend some more money on the tires. Hopefully they'll make my ride a little bit smoother, and with any luck, a little bit faster.

Image


Have a burning question for you guys, what is this pin that sometimes comes with air pumps? (For the life of me I can't figure it out. :o )

Image
User avatar Tricycle Rider
Member
 
Posts: 1,749
Joined: 09 Feb 2013 11:12

Re:

29 Oct 2015 03:07

Tricycle Rider wrote:I promised myself I wouldn't waste any more money on my "Little White Porsche" (the 26" steel comfort bike), but being it's my fave bike by far I just had to spend some more money on the tires. Hopefully they'll make my ride a little bit smoother, and with any luck, a little bit faster.

Image


Have a burning question for you guys, what is this pin that sometimes comes with air pumps? (For the life of me I can't figure it out. :o )

Image

can't see the pic, but i'm going to guess it's the attachment for pumping up footballs/basketballs/etc...
User avatar Archibald
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2,701
Joined: 15 Jun 2009 17:03

Re: Re:

29 Oct 2015 03:27

Archibald wrote:
can't see the pic, but i'm going to guess it's the attachment for pumping up footballs/basketballs/etc...


Ach soooooo...

Wow, didn't realize this is such a multi functional air pump. :o
User avatar Tricycle Rider
Member
 
Posts: 1,749
Joined: 09 Feb 2013 11:12

Re:

29 Oct 2015 03:28

King Boonen wrote:Tyre tread on road tyres is utterly pointless, they are too narrow to aquaplane and as such do not require tread to shed water like car tyres. It's included as psychologically people think treaded tyres grip better, but you are much better off focussing on the compound.

pretty sure road tyres will aquaplane at around 55kmh and above... yeah, I know, not likely to be riding that fast in the wet either ;)
That said, I've had far better success with the slicker rubino pro techs than conti gp4seasons here in sydney as a year-round commuting tyre through all conditions wet and dry. The conti's washed out in the wet despite having the tread...

Tricycle Rider wrote:I just recently bought some "slick and bald" road tires, while they are fast compared to what I'm used to riding I wouldn't even think of riding them in the rain. (They're good for sunny summer weather, but for the rainy winter weather around here I'll go back to my more "knobby" tires as they feel much safer.)


I'd step up from the zaffiros to rubinos and use them year round from what you've described as your usage (and JRS mentioned).
I use the rubino pro tech on the commuter to be more precise, and have had a great experience with them over several years.

I'd not be using knobblies either for on the tarmac - okay, I'll admit that I did use them when I was in the UK, but only when there was snow on the roads and at around 50psi as it meant I stayed upright compared to a pair of 25's!!
User avatar Archibald
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2,701
Joined: 15 Jun 2009 17:03

Re: Re:

29 Oct 2015 09:44

Archibald wrote:
King Boonen wrote:Tyre tread on road tyres is utterly pointless, they are too narrow to aquaplane and as such do not require tread to shed water like car tyres. It's included as psychologically people think treaded tyres grip better, but you are much better off focussing on the compound.

pretty sure road tyres will aquaplane at around 55kmh and above... yeah, I know, not likely to be riding that fast in the wet either ;)
That said, I've had far better success with the slicker rubino pro techs than conti gp4seasons here in sydney as a year-round commuting tyre through all conditions wet and dry. The conti's washed out in the wet despite having the tread...


From everything I've read and been told, no, they won't aquaplane at any speed. Sheldon Brown agrees with me too so I must be right! :) :

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tyres.html#tread


The table he gives shows how hard it would be for a road tyre to aquaplane, even at 60psi you'd need to hit 129kph to even have a chance of it happening.

For Contis I don't like anything other than the black chili compound (I've managed to try a few in my quest for the right tyres recently), but I do think that black chili tyres are about the best money can buy.
Vincenzo Nibali:
"I know how to ride a bike"

Reduce your carbon footprint, ride steel.
User avatar King Boonen
Moderator
 
Posts: 6,471
Joined: 25 Jul 2012 14:38

Re: Re:

20 Nov 2015 02:50

King Boonen wrote:
Archibald wrote:
King Boonen wrote:Tyre tread on road tyres is utterly pointless, they are too narrow to aquaplane and as such do not require tread to shed water like car tyres. It's included as psychologically people think treaded tyres grip better, but you are much better off focussing on the compound.

pretty sure road tyres will aquaplane at around 55kmh and above... yeah, I know, not likely to be riding that fast in the wet either ;)
That said, I've had far better success with the slicker rubino pro techs than conti gp4seasons here in sydney as a year-round commuting tyre through all conditions wet and dry. The conti's washed out in the wet despite having the tread...


From everything I've read and been told, no, they won't aquaplane at any speed. Sheldon Brown agrees with me too so I must be right! :) :

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tyres.html#tread


The table he gives shows how hard it would be for a road tyre to aquaplane, even at 60psi you'd need to hit 129kph to even have a chance of it happening.

For Contis I don't like anything other than the black chili compound (I've managed to try a few in my quest for the right tyres recently), but I do think that black chili tyres are about the best money can buy.

my recollection may well be off, but I'm sure someone here posted an article on the physics of it, which showed tyres aquaplaning at around 55-60kmh
User avatar Archibald
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2,701
Joined: 15 Jun 2009 17:03

Re: Re:

20 Nov 2015 13:10

Archibald wrote:
King Boonen wrote:
Archibald wrote:
King Boonen wrote:Tyre tread on road tyres is utterly pointless, they are too narrow to aquaplane and as such do not require tread to shed water like car tyres. It's included as psychologically people think treaded tyres grip better, but you are much better off focussing on the compound.

pretty sure road tyres will aquaplane at around 55kmh and above... yeah, I know, not likely to be riding that fast in the wet either ;)
That said, I've had far better success with the slicker rubino pro techs than conti gp4seasons here in sydney as a year-round commuting tyre through all conditions wet and dry. The conti's washed out in the wet despite having the tread...


From everything I've read and been told, no, they won't aquaplane at any speed. Sheldon Brown agrees with me too so I must be right! :) :

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tyres.html#tread


The table he gives shows how hard it would be for a road tyre to aquaplane, even at 60psi you'd need to hit 129kph to even have a chance of it happening.

For Contis I don't like anything other than the black chili compound (I've managed to try a few in my quest for the right tyres recently), but I do think that black chili tyres are about the best money can buy.

my recollection may well be off, but I'm sure someone here posted an article on the physics of it, which showed tyres aquaplaning at around 55-60kmh


I've done a fair bit of looking around and it seems that the formula to calculate at what speed you will aquaplane is:

speed (mph) = 9 * SQRT(tyre pressure (psi))

So, to aquaplane at 60kmh (~37mph) you would have to be running a tyre pressure of 17psi. That's about what I run in the front tyre of my MTB, maybe a bit less.

Basically, A road bike isn't going to aquaplane. Ever.

I know the formula is very simplistic, I've spoken to a couple of engineers and they have said it actually gets even less likely as the tyre get narrower. If you search around the internet you will find a lot of people who fly planes are interested in this, that's the kind of speeds you need to be doing.

Of course, wet tyres and roads reduce friction, but still the tread on road tyres won't help with that and in some cases can really hinder is as it will reduce the contact patch and cause squirm.
Vincenzo Nibali:
"I know how to ride a bike"

Reduce your carbon footprint, ride steel.
User avatar King Boonen
Moderator
 
Posts: 6,471
Joined: 25 Jul 2012 14:38

Re: Re:

27 Oct 2016 11:03

Tricycle Rider wrote:
King Boonen wrote:Tyre tread on road tyres is utterly pointless, they are too narrow to aquaplane and as such do not require tread to shed water like car tyres. It's included as psychologically people think treaded tyres grip better, but you are much better off focussing on the compound.
I just recently bought some "slick and bald" road tires, while they are fast compared to what I'm used to riding I wouldn't even think of riding them in the rain. (They're good for sunny summer weather, but for the rainy winter weather around here I'll go back to my more "knobby" tires as they feel much safer.)

Am I doing it all wrong? :o


I'm with King Boonen on this.
It's more about compound than tread.My Road bike with slicks feels much more stable(even in the wet) than my CX bike with treaded tyres.The Road slicks are a softer and grippier compound than the (much cheaper) CX tyres.I probably spend as much time riding in the wet as I do dry and have not(as yet) had any issues running slicks :cool:
User avatar Ibbo68
New Member
 
Posts: 24
Joined: 25 Oct 2016 01:21
Location: Sheffield UK

14 Nov 2017 03:27

All I know is that I like the British way of spelling tyre better than the American tire way, why do we Americans have to spell tire the same as tire as used in a sentence like this: It would not be wise to tire yourself. I know, the content of the sentence reveals with tire it is, but I just like a spelling that differentiates the two types of tires.

I have a list of oddly spelled words that I wish we could change, like knife...why not nife? or knee as nee, gnat as nat, like gnaw or naw, or Wednesday instead of Wensday, or February instead of Febuary, or island instead of iland, I go on and on, but you get the idea. Speaking of you why not just U?
froze
Junior Member
 
Posts: 70
Joined: 23 Feb 2017 15:52
Location: NE Indiana


Return to Workshop & Maintenance

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

Back to top