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Vuelta a España 2017 Rumours

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Re:

11 Jan 2017 16:11

ice&fire wrote:You're welcome, Valv.Piti

From the twitter account of AS cycling editor
https://twitter.com/Juan_Guti/status/818888748503093249

9 summit finishes: 2 in Alicante, 3 in Andalucia and 3 in the North. There's one missing but it won't be in Andorra. All bets are on stage 5.


Only nine summit finishes. What has happened to this race?! I will rate it a 2.
Max Rockatansky
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Re: Vuelta a España 2017 Rumours

11 Jan 2017 16:26

Image

Stage 3 from what I can guess. I love it for such an early stage of the race. The Giro could have done this in Stage 3.
barmaher
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Re: Re:

11 Jan 2017 16:40

Max Rockatansky wrote:
ice&fire wrote:You're welcome, Valv.Piti

From the twitter account of AS cycling editor
https://twitter.com/Juan_Guti/status/818888748503093249

9 summit finishes: 2 in Alicante, 3 in Andalucia and 3 in the North. There's one missing but it won't be in Andorra. All bets are on stage 5.


Only nine summit finishes. What has happened to this race?! I will rate it a 2.

Xorret de Catí is in the list of summit finishes but it actually is 4kms of climbing followed by 3kms of descending. You should downgrade your rating.
ice&fire
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11 Jan 2017 16:47

Cuenca confirms (again) the same finish as in 2006: cobbled climb to the castle and down to the finish.
http://eldeporteconquense.com/noticias/noticias-ciclismo/2017/01/11/alcalde-concejal-deportes-asistiran-la-presentacion-la-vuelta-espana/
Andorra, Cuenca and (probably) Sagunto will make for three downhill finishes in the first week; or four if you count Xorret de Catí as well. This is getting ridiculous. :p
ice&fire
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11 Jan 2017 18:57

This sounds like a better and better race to me.

Can we end up with the best route for 2017 here?
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User avatar Valv.Piti
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Re:

11 Jan 2017 19:59

Valv.Piti wrote:This sounds like a better and better race to me.

Can we end up with the best route for 2017 here?

May just be. I can't remember the bar ever being so low just before the Vuelta route announcement. Maybe 2009?
Kwibus wrote:So much quesions they have. Answers they will never get.
So why questions? If no answers?
-Kwibus, one of the great philosophers of the 21st century
User avatar Red Rick
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Re:

11 Jan 2017 20:09

Valv.Piti wrote:This sounds like a better and better race to me.

Can we end up with the best route for 2017 here?

To be honest I've forgotten what the Giro and Tour routes will be, but I doubt the Vuelta will be better than those. It can be less unbalanced than recent Vueltas, but that's about it.
No multi-mountain stages in the mold of Andorra '15 or Aubisque '16 are expected; not even with three cat 1 climbs like Farrapona '14.
Calar Alto will only be preceded by Velefique; La Pandera will have nothing serious before; Sierra Nevada will only have Monachil; Los Machucos will only have two or maybe three cat 2 climbs; and Angliru is only expected after Cordal.
Regarding the climbs in Alicante, Xorret de Catí might be preceded by some climbs but none of them harder the final one; and Cumbre del Sol will be a repeat of the 2015 stage.
ice&fire
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11 Jan 2017 20:13

ice&fire
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12 Jan 2017 02:51

It's out:

http://ciclismo.as.com/ciclismo/2017/01/12/vuelta_espana/1484176527_112971.html?id_externo_rsoc=comp_tw

Image

Stage 1 (Sat 19/8) Nimes TTT
Stage 2 (Sun 20/8) Nimes - Gruissan
Stage 3 (Mon 21/8) Prades - Andorra
Stage 4 (Tue 22/8) Escaldes - Tarragona
Stage 5 (Wed 23/8) Benicassim - Ermita Sta Lucia (Alcossebre)
Stage 6 (Thu 24/8) Vila-real - Sagunt
Stage 7 (Fri 25/8) Lliria - Cuenca
Stage 8 (Sat 26/8) Hellín - Xorret de Catí (MTF)
Stage 9 (Sun 27/8) Orihuela - Cumbre del Sol (MTF)
Rest day (Mon 28/8)
Stage 10 (Tue 29/8) Caravaca de la Cruz - Alhama de Murcia
Stage 11 (Wed 30/8) Lorca - Calar Alto (MTF)
Stage 12 (Thu 31/8) Motril - Antequera
Stage 13 (Fri 1/9) Coín - Tomares
Stage 14 (Sat 2/9) Écija - La Pandera (MTF)
Stage 15 (Sun 3/9) Alcalá la Real - Sierra Nevada (MTF)
Rest day (Mon 4/9)
Stage 16 (Tue 5/9) Los Arcos - Logroño (ITT)
Stage 17 (Wed 6/9) Villadiego - Los Machucos (MTF)
Stage 18 (Thu 7/9) Suances - Sto Toribio (HTF)
Stage 19 (Fri 8/9) Parque de Redes (Campo de Caso) - Gijón
Stage 20 (Sat 9/9) Corvera - Angliru (MTF)
Stage 21 (Sun 10/9) Arroyomolinos - Madrid

If we trust the coarse depiction of the route overlay on the map... it looks like there might be two downhill finishes in the second week: stage 10 after Collado Bermejo (although I'm suspicius about what side they climb and how far will the summit be from the finish) and stage 12 after Torcal de Antequera; and stage 20 will have Cobertoria W, Cordal and Angliru. I can't recall if this has ever been done since the Angliru first appearance back in 1999.
I'll try to make a more detailed guess after I get some sleep time.
ice&fire
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12 Jan 2017 10:12

That looks like a LOT of transfers.
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12 Jan 2017 10:38

They patched up four different stage races.
User avatar Alexandre B.
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12 Jan 2017 10:48

Some really long transfers alright. I hate to see that.

I wonder what stage 17 is going to be like. Very interesting possibilites there, but there must be every chance of flat stage followed by a ramp.
barmaher
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Re:

12 Jan 2017 13:07

What to expect

Stage 1 (Sat 19/8) Nimes TTT. Distance is not yet known, but rumours are between 20 and 30 km, closer to 30 km.
Stage 2 (Sun 20/8) Nimes - Gruissan. Flat and windy for the sprinters. Just checked the dominant winds around Narbonne here and it looks like the stage final section has been designed for a headwind / tailwind.
Stage 3 (Mon 21/8) Prades - Andorra. The map does not show the rumoured Rabassa loop. A stage without Rabassa would be just 150 km and would barely have 15 km of the race in Andorra. Let's wait and see.
Stage 4 (Tue 22/8) Escaldes - Tarragona. Another one for the sprinters.
Stage 5 (Wed 23/8) Benicassim - Ermita Sta Lucia (Alcossebre) (MTF). First uphill finish. They'll ride the roads in the interior of Castellón. Expect a couple of cat 2 climbs and the kind narrow twisty roads perfect for a breakaway we saw last year on the way to Mas de la Costa.
Stage 6 (Thu 24/8) Vila-real - Sagunt. The map shows incursions in the Sierra de l'Espadà and Sierra Calderona, so this will be another one on rolling and twisty roads perfect for those training for the Worlds. This includes the possibility to have the selective Alto del Garbí somewhere beteen 15 and 20 km from the finish. But with four main different roads to the summit (I found three profiles here, here and here) and this being Unipublic I fear for the worst way up and a loop to show the arrival town on TV and get the climb as far from the finish line as possible.
Stage 7 (Fri 25/8) Lliria - Cuenca. A long one on rolling terrain with the spicy finish already seen in 2006: a climb on cobbled streets and a fast descent.
Stage 8 (Sat 26/8) Hellín - Xorret de Catí. (MTF) Nothing serious before the final climb. 200 riders going full speed against a 4km wall.
Stage 9 (Sun 27/8) Orihuela - Cumbre del Sol. (MTF) We've already seen this before. The double climb with a shorter loop than in 2015 would be the icing on the cake, but we know Guillén doesn't like icing on his cake.
Rest day (Mon 28/8)
Stage 10 (Tue 29/8) Caravaca de la Cruz - Alhama de Murcia. The map shows a couple of loops around the finish town, one of them including Collado Bermejo. Let's wait to see if they choose the most direct (and technical) descent from the summit to the finish line.
Stage 11 (Wed 30/8) Lorca - Calar Alto. (MTF) Based on the map they'll climb Velefique South and I guess they do a short descent to Bácares and up to Calar Alto with no flat in between. Profile here
Stage 12 (Thu 31/8) Motril - Antequera. Looks like they will climb el León and Torcal de Antequera before a 15km descent to the finish. Not bad if it is true, but I wouldn't be surprised if they skip Torcal.
Stage 13 (Fri 1/9) Coín - Tomares. This one has a trick. Tomares is next to Sevilla at the side of River Guadalquivir... but on a plateau 40m above the river. You know what I mean.
Stage 14 (Sat 2/9) Écija - La Pandera. (MTF) This one is intriguing. The map shows a loop before la Pandera, so I guess they won't go straigth up from Valdepeñas. I have no idea if they have found a hidden nasty ramp in that loop or we will see the same as in previous visits just preceded by the 4km @ 7% climb from Valdepeñas to the beginning of that loop.
Stage 15 (Sun 3/9) Alcalá la Real - Sierra Nevada. (MTF) An extension of the 2013 stage that Horner won with the finish around 900m higher at Hoya de la Mora (2500m). It's not clear if the extension will go through the main road or through the more difficult slopes of Collado de las Sabinas they used in 2009. There's a direct road from Sabinas to Hoya de la Mora skipping the sky station but I doubt they do it if the ski station pays the stage finish. If they go through Sabinas they can do a short descent from Sabinas to the station before the last 400m of climbing.
Rest day (Mon 4/9)
Stage 16 (Tue 5/9) Los Arcos - Logroño (ITT). The only ITT. Around 40kms, no significant ups and downs but some twisty roads between straight sections.
Stage 17 (Wed 6/9) Villadiego - Los Machucos (MTF). The stage departure location has conditioned the route of this one. More than 100kms of flat, easy climb followed by the long descend of Lunada, 30kms of flat and then Alisas (cat 2) and los Machucos with barely 3 kms of flat in between.
Stage 18 (Thu 7/9) Suances - Sto Toribio (HTF). A shortened version of Fuente Dé with a murito instead of a long gradual climb. Do expect epic long range attacks here.
Stage 19 (Fri 8/9) Parque de Redes (Campo de Caso) - Gijón. Another one for those preparing the Worlds. It looks they do Colladona N followed by Colladiella from Figaredo. Then they may add some less significant cat 2 and 3 climbs on the way to the finish. There are nasty climbs near Gijón, but I doubt they'll use them.
Stage 20 (Sat 9/9) Corvera - Angliru (MTF). From the looks of the map it will have Cobertoria W and Cordal, but the finish does not call for long range attacks.
Stage 21 (Sun 10/9) Arroyomolinos - Madrid. Sprint preceded by lots of complaints about the evacuation of Angliru.

The reduction of MTFs with respect to previous years is a plus. With the possible exception of Calar Alto, all MTFs are clearly on the hardest climb of the day. And the only stage likely to include three cat 1 climbs ends in the steepest climb of the race. So there is no improvement in that department. At least we've been spared of the three-MTFs-in-a-row where one or two of them are ridden in gruppetto up to the red flag. I'll cross my fingers to see how many of those stages with a potential downhill finish depart from the best possible route and by how much.

On average it may be slightly better than recent Vueltas, but I doubt this is enough to be better than the Giro or the Tour.
ice&fire
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12 Jan 2017 13:57

So may takeaway would be that
The MTF/muritos ridiculousness is a wee bit lesser
Individual stage design isn't better, though it would seem to me that ther'es no such thing as the La Camperona stage last year. Doesn't seem to be a huge queen stage, there's barely big climbs before MTFs and there's little in good medium mountain stages, except for a few finishes.

Route needs more TTs. A top climber can negate the losses of the TT on the Sierra Nevada and the Angliru alone.
Kwibus wrote:So much quesions they have. Answers they will never get.
So why questions? If no answers?
-Kwibus, one of the great philosophers of the 21st century
User avatar Red Rick
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12 Jan 2017 14:19

Well if the profiles are correct hats off to the organisers - First thing is to have interesting stages on the second and third weekends for TV viewers - No TT's on these weekends is a big tick - Stage 20 could be an epic stage, while stage 14 and 15 should be a tasty entree to the ITT on stage 16 - Much prefer having the ITT around stage 16 as it could lead to more attacking riding in stages 17-20.
yaco
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12 Jan 2017 15:13

Maps and profiles have been posted on la flamme rouge forum. They are best guesses based on the low resolution route from AS, although the Asturian stages are a bit off IMHO.

http://www.la-flamme-rouge.eu/maps/tours/view/4391
ice&fire
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12 Jan 2017 15:32

Great work, but someone actually took the time to make these... a few hours before the actual presentation?
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12 Jan 2017 15:37

I don't think so. I found it yesterday and there have been some changes since then after the route map was leaked by AS. I guess it was a work in the making for several days.
ice&fire
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12 Jan 2017 16:26

I will withdraw judgment on those descent finishes. I'd be very surprised if Guillen doesn't go out of his way to bypass them.
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12 Jan 2017 18:07

Will the live presentation be streamed?
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