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Romain Bardet Discussion Thread

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Re:

11 Jul 2019 22:12

Simurgh wrote:I can't say I'm surprised about his performance today, but it is still kind of sad to see him in this state - a state that he has been in since last year really (with the WC as a positive outlier). I hope he considers the polka dots and stage hunting as a more attractive course of action than fighting for a low top-10 spot. :(


Yes, but why though? Sone insights?
ppanther92
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Re:

11 Jul 2019 22:28

yaco wrote:Has been a bit off all year - needs to change his program and ride the Giro in 2020.

I think that you hit it on the head. Romain needs to hit the refresh.
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12 Jul 2019 07:49

Predictable result. Normally he is a good climber with a bad TT who is incredible consistent, now just a mediocre climber. The only time he was somewhat close to the win was in 2017 which had a horrible field considering all the abandons. Simply doesn't have the top level and never has, unfortunately.
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Re: Re:

12 Jul 2019 08:08

ppanther92 wrote:
Simurgh wrote:I can't say I'm surprised about his performance today, but it is still kind of sad to see him in this state - a state that he has been in since last year really (with the WC as a positive outlier). I hope he considers the polka dots and stage hunting as a more attractive course of action than fighting for a low top-10 spot. :(


Yes, but why though? Sone insights?


I just saw on the website (cyclingnews), that he got himself an infection in the Dauphine, which affected his preparation. He says he has a "leg problem", which in this case means "I don't have the legs" rather than in injury. http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/bardet-slips-on-first-tour-de-france-mountain-test/

Either way, the infection doesn't help explain what happened before the Dauphine. I think, that it is partly that Bardet has been overrated. He is a solid top-5 contender (always thereabouts), and on his good days close to the very best, but I think that his podiums in 2016 and 2017 made some people consider him something he is not; a potential Grand Tour winner. He is too one-dimensional for that. I just looked up the 2016 Tour results, and in the time trial he lost a whopping 3 minutes to Froome! And I think we all remember the 2017 time trial in Marseille, where he was so horrible, that he almost threw was podium placing away. In hindsight, I think his best chance of winning a GT was that Tour in 2017, where the level was rather low - he couldn't beat a sub-par Froome, who was riding on 85-90% that Tour. He couldn't beat him in the mountains, and certainly not in the time trial, which he didn't bother to practice. I don't think that what we saw yesterday was his ceiling nor his true level. But I also don't think that he will podium the Tour, and perhaps not even a GT at all, because he is 2nd tier on the climbs, and has always been several levels below the best in the time trials.

Partly I also think it is because of the increasing depth of the GC field. A couple of years ago you had the big 4 (Froome, Contador, Nibali and Quintana) and then the best of the rest (a level or two below like Bardet, Pinot, Valverde, Aru, Purito and so on). Now Froome is/was still on top, but there are so many podium contenders now. Some of them young guns (Yates bros, Carapaz, Buchmann, Bernal soon enough), others that have kicked it up a notch (Kruijswijk, Landa, Fuglsang, Thomas!, even Pinot it seems). Bardet haven't taken a step up, but has been standing still. As yaco and Tonton have said, he needs to spice things up a bit and ride the Giro - sometimes change in itself can be reinvigorating!
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Re:

12 Jul 2019 08:59

Valv.Piti wrote:Predictable result. Normally he is a good climber with a bad TT who is incredible consistent, now just a mediocre climber. The only time he was somewhat close to the win was in 2017 which had a horrible field considering all the abandons. Simply doesn't have the top level and never has, unfortunately.

His 2018 was incredibly consistent at high-level.
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12 Jul 2019 09:27

Nah, he's not that bad. His 2015 - 2017 level was quite good, although he lost precious time due to his heat stroke in 2015 and couldn't compete for the top 5.

He's a handy climber. Great punch as well, since hestarted off as a hilly classics contender. Very stylish on the bike as well. Dancing on the pedals uphill! Good descender. It's only his time trial that's horrible.

Which indicates that Bardet just shouldn't be a general classification rider in first instance. He should ride for the polka dot jersey, solo mountain stage victories and then get a 2-5th spot with panache along the way! :geek: Just like Virenque used to do back in the 90s. Bardet should work on his climbing again and forget all about the TT. Now, he's got this two podium placements, but despite 2 stage victories as well none of these archivements come along with any kind of legacy. They're kinda lame successes compared to for example Virenque. That's where I strongly disagree with Tonton. Bardet has no legend status already.

I said it multiple times before, but again. Prudhomme & Gouvenou have not only ruined the whole Tour de France with their stupid routes, but also Bardet's career in some way. Yes, he's got two rather meaningless podiums and thus has been hyped up as a potential winner. But that's it. Include two real time trials. Make Bardet lose up to 7 minutes before the race has even entered the high mountains. Now, the petit Frenchman needs to go on longe range attacks like Rasmussen and snatch epic stage wins, because Sky / Ineos doesn't need to keep him under control. He won't ever win the Tour de France anyway. But that way he earns the polka dot jersey and a top 5 spot with legendary performances in the Alps & Pyrenees! Entertains us. Builds up a legacy. Instead of keeping this fake close to win yellow narrative by including less than 30 kilometers of time trialing.


This year his shape is atrocious so far, but that might chance right in time for the Pyrenees & Alps! A stage win either on the Tourmalet or the Galibier stage should save his season and set a successful new pattern. Most likely he would win a second stage elsewhere as well then. But Bardet really needs to ship additional time, up to 6-7 minutes in the TT and before now and forget about the GC in first instance. Because he's gonna get a top 5 nevertheless with 2 successful escapes. Better than the 6th spot from last years Tour.

But can he understand? Maybe Michael Rasmussen needs to have a little coffee chat with Romain and explain him how you ride a Tour de France if your TT is atrocious and you've already lost time in the first week. AG2R also have a good team to send additional 2-3 guys up the road with Bardet!

First Bardet needs to overcome his problems anyway. Don't hesitate. Keep calm and relax. The polka dot jersey is still up for grabs. Bardet only needs to chill and needs to be back at his peak level for the Pyrenees & Alps to outclimb Barguil! Otherwise it's a lost year indeed.
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12 Jul 2019 12:45

The TDF is actually a curse for the French GC riders. There were no wins in the first half of the season because u were training for the Grand Boucle and if u put in too much effort u will be tired for the TDF. If something goes wrong during the TDF, u cant quit becos this was the main goal of the season, ur french, ur sponsors are french. After the TDF u have no results becos u were too tired. As a result the whole season is kaput.
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Re: Romain Bardet Discussion Thread

12 Jul 2019 17:03

https://www.lequipe.fr/Cyclisme-sur-route/Actualites/Tour-de-france-romain-bardet-a-eu-un-sentiment-de-honte-vis-a-vis-de-ses-equipiers/1039280

In this article we learn something interesting.

L'encadrement d'AG2R, qui peaufine un plan B où Bardet sera encouragé à passer à l'attaque dans les massifs intermédiaires dès ce week-end


The management of AG2R, refines a plan B where Bardet will be encouraged to go on the attack in the medium mountains, starting this week-end


I don't believe much AG2R but Allez Romain !
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Re: Romain Bardet Discussion Thread

12 Jul 2019 17:17

Chrispol wrote:https://www.lequipe.fr/Cyclisme-sur-route/Actualites/Tour-de-france-romain-bardet-a-eu-un-sentiment-de-honte-vis-a-vis-de-ses-equipiers/1039280

In this article we learn something interesting.

L'encadrement d'AG2R, qui peaufine un plan B où Bardet sera encouragé à passer à l'attaque dans les massifs intermédiaires dès ce week-end


The management of AG2R, refines a plan B where Bardet will be encouraged to go on the attack in the medium mountains, starting this week-end


I don't believe much AG2R but Allez Romain !

That plan maybe should have included "accidentally" getting caught-out on todays crosswinds to lose more time.

Most likely it's mainly for some KOM points already.

Lavenu better has a chat with Portal whether they let go a group to Tourmalet the stage after the time trial!

AG2R isn't that inept actually. It only looks as if they make all the mistakes recently that Madiot finally learned from!
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Re: Romain Bardet Discussion Thread

12 Jul 2019 23:12

Some good points here: and I can be somewhat objective. Being a Pinot fan doesn't mean that I dislike him. Having said that, I have always claimed, I still do, and hopefully in two weeks time you will all see that Thibaut Pinot is a better rider, period.

I wish Romain Bardet the best, and compared to my chouchou, he has some big one-day race results that no one can dismiss, including me. He's a heck of a bike rider! Overrated? That's journo stuff stirring the pot for the most part. The guy goes about his business, trains hard, races hard, and yes '19 is a bad vintage. I tend to smell the rat when a rider is always delivering; excuse me but I have been burnt a few times already. I leave it at that per forum rules.

Yes, his ITT sucks. Yes, AG2R gathers talent but fails to build a team around him. Yes, I agree that the Virenque plan a few posts ago makes absolute sense. But please don't pile-up on him. Romain Bardet didn't climb the Eiffel Tower and scream through a megaphone that he was the best GT rider in the World. He does his best, and his best is not enough to be on or near the top right now. He will bounce back: feeling shame as he said will ignite the fire, he will want revenge, some good may come out of it.

To my last post and my original point, and yes it depends on the design, after years of pressure and Tours, a Giro or Giro/Vuelta year may give him that refresh. Romain needs it. I don't see him bounce back in this year's Tour. So far down with the ITT left, it would take way to many contenders having meltdowns or bad luck to top-5.
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19 Jul 2019 22:28

Chris Anker Soerensen on Bardet and TT: "Training on a TT bike matters. He should be ashamed of himself."

Just rewatched the stage. He did a bike change!? Oh, boy.
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Re:

20 Jul 2019 01:19

fantomas wrote:Chris Anker Soerensen on Bardet and TT: "Training on a TT bike matters. He should be ashamed of himself."
Just rewatched the stage. He did a bike change!? Oh, boy.
Yes, it's true, it's in some news articles, and makes things look worse for AG2R https://www.lequipe.fr/Cyclisme-sur-route/Actualites/Tour-de-france-romain-bardet-va-changer-de-velo-en-cours-de-chrono/1041622
«Le début du parcours de Pau est constitué d'une partie vallonnée et accidentée, alors que sa fin est plus roulante. En optant pour un vélo hybride dans la première portion, plus léger et maniable que le modèle « Eddy Merckx » utilisé ensuite, Bardet espère grappiller quelques secondes, alors qu'il devrait en perdre « une dizaine » au moment du changement, selon Julien Jurdie ».
"The beginning of the course at Pau consists of a rugged and hilly part, while the finish is more rolling. By opting for a hybrid bike in the first part, more lightweight and maneuverable than the Eddy Merckx model he will use next, Bardet hopes to pull back several seconds, despite likely losing about ten seconds during the bike swap, according to Julien Jurdie"
[But despite taking this unfair advantage, which may be legal but is not very classy, Bardet still lost 2:26]
« Je suis en quête de sensations sur ce Tour et ce chrono ne m'a pas apporté les réponses que j'attendais. Le changement de vélo consistait à rationaliser mon choix par rapport à mes capacités physiques et au profil du parcours, et c'était pour moi la meilleure solution. Je veux continuer ce Tour de France sans arrière-pensées, et être offensif »
"I have been looking to do something sensational this Tour, and this time-trial did not deliver the results I had expected. The change of bikes consisted of rationalizing my choice, with respect to my physical abilities and the course profile, and for me that was the best solution. I want to continue this Tour de France without looking back, and to go on the attack"
« C'est beaucoup : on avait plutôt fait une estimation autour de la minute (de retard). Il y a de la déception, de la frustration. On a vu qu'il manquait de punch et de puissance. C'est contradictoire parce qu'on le sentait plutôt pas trop mal dans les parties plates, mais il était en difficulté dans les parties montantes. C'est difficile à expliquer »
"We lost a lot, we had been expecting to lose perhaps around a minute. There is disappointment, there is frustration. One could see that he lacked punch and power. It's contradictory because he seemed not too bad on the flat parts, but he was struggling on the hills. This is hard to explain."
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20 Jul 2019 01:36

Bardet looks hapless in the TT these days like he doesn't want to be there at all. He loses time early and then it gets worse. Doesn't get any easier for him and like last year he doesn't have the condition he had when he podiumed twice. Maybe like Quintana he could do with a team change to shake things up.
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20 Jul 2019 10:15

LA on Vincent Lavenu:
"If I'm Vincent, I would stop complaining about Ketones and start making better decisions for my GC rider aka a bike change on a 27 Km rolling time trial. No, you are focussed on the wrong things Vincent!"
Hugo Koblet wrote: Crazy thing is that this isn't even over for Froome yet. If Dumoulin cracks ala Vuelta '15 and Yates is indeed fading in the third week as expected, then Froome can still win this.
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Re:

20 Jul 2019 10:23

silvergrenade wrote:LA on Vincent Lavenu:
"If I'm Vincent, I would stop complaining about Ketones and start making better decisions for my GC rider aka a bike change on a 27 Km rolling time trial. No, you are focussed on the wrong things Vincent!"




Sure If it was Armstrong he's take out the epo...christ that he should tell a rider like Bardet and clean team like Ag2r what to do :rolleyes:

Bardet can win classics as long stages
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20 Jul 2019 10:57

A 'clean' team where 3 riders tested positive in the space of 3 years not that long ago.
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Re: Re:

20 Jul 2019 11:19

HelloDolly wrote:
silvergrenade wrote:LA on Vincent Lavenu:
"If I'm Vincent, I would stop complaining about Ketones and start making better decisions for my GC rider aka a bike change on a 27 Km rolling time trial. No, you are focussed on the wrong things Vincent!"




Sure If it was Armstrong he's take out the epo...christ that he should tell a rider like Bardet and clean team like Ag2r what to do :rolleyes:

Bardet can win classics as long stages


You're joking here, right? Right?
Hugo Koblet wrote: Crazy thing is that this isn't even over for Froome yet. If Dumoulin cracks ala Vuelta '15 and Yates is indeed fading in the third week as expected, then Froome can still win this.
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20 Jul 2019 16:50

Very disappointing. I think he needs a completely different schedule next year. No Tour, target other races, get back to winning, break out of the one race a year rut.
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20 Jul 2019 16:55

He lost 20 minutes! Perhaps he has caught an illness or just felt very bad, so he gave up the GC and rolled to the finish. Indeed, he should ride the Giro and one-day races next year.
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Re:

20 Jul 2019 17:00

Zinoviev Letter wrote:Very disappointing. I think he needs a completely different schedule next year. No Tour, target other races, get back to winning, break out of the one race a year rut.


how would a schedule change help when his general form just seems off for some reason this year?

edit: last year with the same focus he podiumed Liege, Worlds and the Dauphine

and 'get back to winning' sounds needlessly sarcastic when referring to a rider with 7 wins in 7 pro seasons
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