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Tejay Van Garderen Discussion Thread

A place to discuss all things related to current professional road races. Here, you can also touch on the latest news relating to professional road racing. A doping discussion free forum.

Moderators: Irondan, Eshnar, Red Rick, Valv.Piti, Tonton, Pricey_sky, King Boonen

Re: Re:

18 May 2017 18:10

Jancouver wrote:
damian13ster wrote:Wow, looking at the above comment......good for him for deleting social media. People can be clueless and cruel.
Hope TJ gets out of the slump and figures out what's going on so that he is able to find his place in the peleton (wherver that might be).
Being in the situation he is in must suck


Just FYI, I'm not on twitter/fakebook and never harassed anybody with my opinion.

That being said, the head in the sand approach is a clear sign of his mental weakness as he is unwilling to face or hear any negative comments. So yes, he is a loser in my book.

Image

You are sooo wrong.
Kokoso
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Re: Re:

18 May 2017 18:12

Dr. Watson wrote:
Valv.Piti wrote:
Dr. Watson wrote:seems like he puts way too much pressure on himself, it must be in the head, I dont see any winning spirit in him

Do you think there is a psychical problem, Doc, or is it all mentally?


Im not his psychiatrist but sure as hell seems to me guy has some issues with the pressure and cannot cope with responsibility.

Are you close to him somehow, or is that just uninformed, worthless opinion?
Kokoso
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Re: Re:

18 May 2017 18:14

lenric wrote:He's mentally weak

How do you know? Do you know him?
Kokoso
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Re: Re:

18 May 2017 18:17

Jancouver wrote:
jaylew wrote:TJ's take:
(Interview, snipped)


... deleted social accounts ... clearly, he can't handle the pressure. Very mentally weak. Trying to hide like the loser he is. If he is not willing to face the reality like a real man, he should retire. Pathetic loser.


And retiring he gonna help him get stronger mentally... how?

You're calling him a loser who's not willing to face reality and is "hiding" because he's quitting social media, yet you're suggesting he should simply give up entirely, instead of facing the reality that sometimes you need to fight.
Isn't it better that he quits social media if that's what he needs in order to focus on the sport, than he quits the sport and then starts sitting at home spending all his time on social media? Luckily there's not rule saying that you must be on social media.
Seems like he's still got some passion for the sport, he just needs to (re-)find that, and rediscover his purpose as a rider. As we are some here who have suggested he probably needs to find another team, not because there's anything wrong with BMC, but simply because he might need a breath of fresh air, and because on BMC the label of GT contender might be attached too strongly to him. Then, if he after some years reach a time when even the thought of going training or racing fill him utter despair and he just can't bring himself to it, maybe he should quit. Now is too soon.
Aka The Ginger One.
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Re: Re:

18 May 2017 18:23

Kokoso wrote:
Dr. Watson wrote:
Valv.Piti wrote:
Dr. Watson wrote:seems like he puts way too much pressure on himself, it must be in the head, I dont see any winning spirit in him

Do you think there is a psychical problem, Doc, or is it all mentally?


Im not his psychiatrist but sure as hell seems to me guy has some issues with the pressure and cannot cope with responsibility.

Are you close to him somehow, or is that just uninformed, worthless opinion?


Well its either bad legs, bad mental state or both so you can choose what you want
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Re: Re:

18 May 2017 18:53

Dr. Watson wrote:
Kokoso wrote:
Dr. Watson wrote:
Valv.Piti wrote:
Dr. Watson wrote:seems like he puts way too much pressure on himself, it must be in the head, I dont see any winning spirit in him

Do you think there is a psychical problem, Doc, or is it all mentally?


Im not his psychiatrist but sure as hell seems to me guy has some issues with the pressure and cannot cope with responsibility.

Are you close to him somehow, or is that just uninformed, worthless opinion?


Well its either bad legs, bad mental state or both so you can choose what you want


A bit harsh? Tejay just hit his physiological peak at a young age. Neither he nor BMC were to know 2012 was his peak at just 23 years of age. Normal progression says you hit peak form a a GC rider between 28 and 32. Logic would support the belief he could get back to 2012 level if not better. He tried but it hasn't worked out for him. Not a hanging offense for either him nor even BMC but I can imagine it is difficult to deal with. The reality is he will need to reassess his future and maybe accept a pay cut but can still make a healthy living stage hunting or as a GC support rider in the mountains.
Cookster15
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Re: Re:

18 May 2017 18:59

Dr. Watson wrote:
Kokoso wrote:
Dr. Watson wrote:
Valv.Piti wrote:
Dr. Watson wrote:seems like he puts way too much pressure on himself, it must be in the head, I dont see any winning spirit in him

Do you think there is a psychical problem, Doc, or is it all mentally?


Im not his psychiatrist but sure as hell seems to me guy has some issues with the pressure and cannot cope with responsibility.

Are you close to him somehow, or is that just uninformed, worthless opinion?


Well its either bad legs, bad mental state or both so you can choose what you want



That's definitely a possibility. He was crushed at the 2015 Tour and really, he hasn't recovered from that, I don't think. He may be fine physically, but the prospect of losing massive time (has already happened), is lingering in his mind I am sure. He should try and focus on shorter stage races, pick up some wins and podiums, get some confidence back and then have a go at the GT's after he feels ready.
BullsFan22
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Re: Tejay Van Garderen Discussion Thread

18 May 2017 18:59

I have always been a huge Tg Fan. But you ve gotta be realistic. He is a s shot as it gets. It's just over for him. Has happended to endless GC riders before him. Hard to explain, but some rider simply all of a sudden hit the wall and never come back.
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Re: Tejay Van Garderen Discussion Thread

18 May 2017 19:01

could he skeep the Tour and go for Tour of Utah and Tour of Colorado?
needs results and needs to cheer up. the Tour will be too hard
pastronef
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18 May 2017 19:04

I thought skipping the Tour was already the plan. He got the Giro, Porte gets the Tour.
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18 May 2017 19:16

I would not put 1 penny on the theory that he already reached his peak at 28 and now is declining.

After the 90's I hear all kind of new theories for human evolution. Rather strange.
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18 May 2017 19:30

Wow, that interview was actually a pretty tough read. He seems very honest, and I feel bad for him. As someone said, it must be very hard to suddenly be a lot worse than you're used to and you can't figure out why.

Hopefully next year he'll drop the idea of him being a Grand Tour rider anymore. He should focus on week long races and especially the American races in which he's done well in the past.
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Re: Re:

18 May 2017 19:50

Kokoso wrote:
lenric wrote:He's mentally weak

How do you know? Do you know him?


It's fairly obvious. Unless to someone who's socially inept, doesn't leave his/her home or is closely related to him and doesn't want to admit it. Pick whatever you want.
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18 May 2017 20:02

He's not the strongest mentally and needs a change of pace in his career to get away from the pressure he puts on himself.

I would like to add that there's nothing wrong with being mentally "weak". It's a handicap in pro cycling, but that doesn't make him pathetic or anything of the sort.
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Re:

18 May 2017 20:08

Hugo Koblet wrote:Wow, that interview was actually a pretty tough read. He seems very honest, and I feel bad for him. As someone said, it must be very hard to suddenly be a lot worse than you're used to and you can't figure out why.

Hopefully next year he'll drop the idea of him being a Grand Tour rider anymore. He should focus on week long races and especially the American races in which he's done well in the past.

Yes, or just forget about riding gts for gc, ride the American races and maybe you can try do enter a few breeakaways at the Vuelta when you're feeling well, not everyone has to ride for gc in a gt, if you can't cope with thhe things that come along with it then just let it go and try something else.
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Re:

18 May 2017 20:36

Hugo Koblet wrote:Wow, that interview was actually a pretty tough read. He seems very honest, and I feel bad for him. As someone said, it must be very hard to suddenly be a lot worse than you're used to and you can't figure out why.

Hopefully next year he'll drop the idea of him being a Grand Tour rider anymore. He should focus on week long races and especially the American races in which he's done well in the past.



I am sorry, but every time I look at your avatar, I LOL.

Oh, and absolutely agree with you.
BullsFan22
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18 May 2017 20:52

I love the people here who just know that it's a mental thing with Tejay. Like with Quintana in the Tour last year. Froome had psycologically broken him. He had a mental hold over Quintana. Or with Sagan. He just didn't have it to ever win a monument. Too weak, mentally.

Just change your mindset, and everything is possible. Its not like cycling has anything to do with legs. I also love it when people un-ironically quote variations of Armstrong's "Winning is about heart, not just legs." Well, he also said that “motivation can't take you very far if you don't have the legs.” Because, duh.

Alberto Contador's won zero Grand Tours over the last two years. Not mentally strong enough or lacking in heart?
"Christmas is tomorrow... Let's get in the break." - Matt Hayman, 4/9/16
"What a strange illusion it is to suppose that beauty is goodness." - Tolstoy
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18 May 2017 21:09

He's definitely not strong enough - physically or mentally - to win a GT, especially not up against the current batch.
Maybe he's just one of those people who, when they start losing a bit of time, can't seem to "turn the ship around", and regain time, instead he just keeps losing more and more time...
Aka The Ginger One.
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18 May 2017 22:34

I believe the explanation is obvious.

He's half dutch. So he didn't disappoint for half a career. Now the dutch half has begun.
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Re: Tejay Van Garderen Discussion Thread

19 May 2017 00:43

These are the top-100% of the top-100% of all people competitively riding bikes. There isn't ONE pro cyclist who is weak. Even Betancur, laughing stock of pro-cycling, can put his body and mind through the torture of racing at this level. Who on this forum has climbed the Ventoux, Mortirolo, or Angliru? TJVG is tough. Only armchair cyclists would say otherwise.

The weakness that some of you mention has nothing to do with weakness as a rider. Social media has changed the game big time. Every time that a rider under-performs, there are hordes of blood-thirsty trolls out there. I want to say to them: get a life! A girlfriend, something...and ride a bike. You'll respect what these guys are capable of.

Being called a loser by thousands of people is something relatively new, and many riders are not prepared for it. Social media. Every day, a kid commits suicide due to cyber bullying. These riders are human beings and I imagine how much it hurts when total strangers judge you, beat you up.

I'm done being sarcastic about him. I wish TJVG the best. Rough times for him...
When I woke up and saw the yellow jersey that I had left by my bed the night before, I asked myself: "what are you doing in Merckx's bedroom?" I couldn't believe it - Bernard Thevenet
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