Log in:  

Register

Vincenzo Nibali discussion thread

A place to discuss all things related to current professional road races. Here, you can also touch on the latest news relating to professional road racing. A doping discussion free forum.

Moderators: Eshnar, Irondan, King Boonen, Red Rick, Pricey_sky

Re: Re:

09 Jul 2018 20:08

RedheadDane wrote:
TourOfSardinia wrote:
Dekker_Tifosi wrote:The shark is drowning

that's why he has a dolphin on the team to help him out
;)


That was a bit fishy.





I'll show myself out. And I know neither sharks nor dolphins are actually fish!
The fish is on another team.


Sharks are fish. Orcas aren't.
User avatar tobydawq
Member
 
Posts: 1,377
Joined: 16 Nov 2013 18:45
Location: Denmark

09 Jul 2018 20:27

Even with Haussler and Colbrelli at their best they would have lost 50+ seconds.

Their TTT was fine. He sits very close to most contenders and a healthy minute in front of Quintana. Any of his fan would have signed for this before the Tour started.
User avatar SafeBet
Veteran
 
Posts: 6,991
Joined: 02 Sep 2011 13:38
Location: Milano, Italy

Re:

09 Jul 2018 20:50

Rollthedice wrote:The shark was not quite happy at the end speaking in the heat of the moment. They didn't went strong enough but it could've been worse as in the end only four left had to try to salvage what was left to be saved. They lost earlier than expected Haussler and Koren and then Delphino and Sonny were dropped on the hill.

Anyway, it is what it is, he looks good, next stage.

What did he say?
Veni, Vidi, Kirby

I came, I saw, I was dead wrong as per usual
User avatar Red Rick
Administrator
 
Posts: 14,030
Joined: 20 Feb 2012 18:15

Re: Re:

09 Jul 2018 21:11

Red Rick wrote:
Rollthedice wrote:The shark was not quite happy at the end speaking in the heat of the moment. They didn't went strong enough but it could've been worse as in the end only four left had to try to salvage what was left to be saved. They lost earlier than expected Haussler and Koren and then Delphino and Sonny were dropped on the hill.

Anyway, it is what it is, he looks good, next stage.

What did he say?


“We didn’t go super strong, we were only four [riders] in the final kilometres,” Nibali said. “We tried to do the best we could. We are not great specialists in time trials,” he continued.

“Maybe it could have gone worse for us, but we tried to save the time that we could save.”

“For sure, Koren and Haussler could have done much more, and I don’t want to say anything bad about it, but we were in six early on… and then four…

“When you are in four, it can dangerous because you have a mechanical or a flat, it all becomes so much more complicated and you have to wait for the fourth man. These team time trials are hard to read, especially today, because in some points where we going 80kph, so it wasn’t easy to manage a rhythm that was so high.”

“We said early on that a one-minute lose would be the worst case,” sports director Paolo Slongo said. “We are there in the range that we thought we would be in. We are satisfied.

“It wasn’t an off day, but we just limited the losses and that was limited for those riders.”

Read more at https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/racing/tour-de-france/gone-worse-vincenzo-nibali-lives-fight-another-day-tour-team-time-trial-385960#YImRLiecPCzX8Lq5.99
User avatar Rollthedice
Veteran
 
Posts: 5,951
Joined: 11 May 2013 10:59

Re: Vincenzo Nibali discussion thread

09 Jul 2018 21:36

Probably thinking that Visconti and Mohoric would have been better than Koren, Haussler and Colbrelli. Both are in great shape.
skippo12
Member
 
Posts: 303
Joined: 14 May 2017 14:34

Re: Vincenzo Nibali discussion thread

09 Jul 2018 21:58

skippo12 wrote:Probably thinking that Visconti and Mohoric would have been better than Koren, Haussler and Colbrelli. Both are in great shape.


I think Haussler and Cobrelli were chosen for their talents on the cobbles
User avatar whittashau
Member
 
Posts: 1,484
Joined: 02 Sep 2010 09:28

Re:

09 Jul 2018 22:10

SafeBet wrote:Even with Haussler and Colbrelli at their best they would have lost 50+ seconds.

Their TTT was fine. He sits very close to most contenders and a healthy minute in front of Quintana. Any of his fan would have signed for this before the Tour started.

Exactly, and possibly even more importantly he seems to be in great shape. Ofc a TTT doesn't tell you that much but riding the climb at the front while dropping two of your teammates is, despite being bad in a TTT, an indicator for good shape.
Anyway, I really think the Roubaix stage is the possibly most important day for him. If he wants to be in yellow in Paris he should better be in front of Froome and Porte at the start of the 2nd week. Otherwise it's still possible but I think very difficult.
User avatar Gigs_98
Veteran
 
Posts: 6,198
Joined: 18 Feb 2015 18:36
Location: Austria

Re: Re:

09 Jul 2018 22:13

Gigs_98 wrote:
SafeBet wrote:Even with Haussler and Colbrelli at their best they would have lost 50+ seconds.

Their TTT was fine. He sits very close to most contenders and a healthy minute in front of Quintana. Any of his fan would have signed for this before the Tour started.

Exactly, and possibly even more importantly he seems to be in great shape. Ofc a TTT doesn't tell you that much but riding the climb at the front while dropping two of your teammates is, despite being bad in a TTT, an indicator for good shape.
Anyway, I really think the Roubaix stage is the possibly most important day for him. If he wants to be in yellow in Paris he should better be in front of Froome and Porte at the start of the 2nd week. Otherwise it's still possible but I think very difficult.


I don`t think Porte has any chance even if he is the best climber. 3 downhill finishes will be enough for Nibali (and others) to gain at least 1-2 minutes on him.
skippo12
Member
 
Posts: 303
Joined: 14 May 2017 14:34

09 Jul 2018 22:14

Nibs is saving the voodoo for Sunday :)
"Are you going to believe me or what you see with your own eyes?"

“It doesn’t matter what I do. People need to hear what I have to say. There’s no one else who can say what I can say. It doesn’t matter what I live.”
User avatar Robert5091
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2,268
Joined: 29 Mar 2016 08:56
Location: stockholm, sweden

09 Jul 2018 22:19

Froome and Dumoulin are 90% of the relevant competition here.
Veni, Vidi, Kirby

I came, I saw, I was dead wrong as per usual
User avatar Red Rick
Administrator
 
Posts: 14,030
Joined: 20 Feb 2012 18:15

Re: Re:

09 Jul 2018 23:13

Valv.Piti wrote:
Carols wrote:
Rollthedice wrote:The shark was not quite happy at the end speaking in the heat of the moment. They didn't went strong enough but it could've been worse as in the end only four left had to try to salvage what was left to be saved. They lost earlier than expected Haussler and Koren and then Delphino and Sonny were dropped on the hill.

Anyway, it is what it is, he looks good, next stage.


I hope he wasn't to tough on them, they are in service for a Long tour yet! He killed them off going to hard......

Lol, you cannot go slowly over that last hill. If they did, they would be in for a much bigger loss.


LOL they were long gone before the final hill!
Alberto Contador=Legend!

Nibali becomes only the 6th winner of all 3 GTS (2014)!
Nibali joins Gimondi, Merckx and Hinault as only the 4th man to win all 3 GTS and 2 different Monuments (2018). A throwback rider in this age of specialization. Bravo!
User avatar Carols
Veteran
 
Posts: 7,025
Joined: 20 Mar 2010 15:20
Location: PA, USA

Re: Re:

10 Jul 2018 00:02

tobydawq wrote:
RedheadDane wrote:
TourOfSardinia wrote:
Dekker_Tifosi wrote:The shark is drowning

that's why he has a dolphin on the team to help him out
;)

But Orcas eat Sharks - great White Sharks
tried to add link you'll have to google it
cantpedal
Member
 
Posts: 317
Joined: 10 Sep 2013 01:08

10 Jul 2018 02:01

I think that he expected a bit more from the "hard men", but he's in an OK position. As someone else pointed out, he could take advantage of the downhill finishes.
jmdirt
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2,996
Joined: 06 Dec 2013 17:33

10 Jul 2018 02:38

If Nibali is disappointed in the performance in the TTT, then I think he may have had unrealistic expectations. Given the team he had, I think losing less than 1:30 is quite acceptable. But this raises the question of how he had envisioned his strategy for the rest of the Tour playing out. Is the concern the time he lost over expectations, or the number of GC contenders who are in front of him now? If he genuinely expected not to be a minute behind Froome and Porte at this point, I am thinking he had a poorly planned vision for success in the Tour. Yes, he is not a minute behind Froome and Porte now, but are the riders he is a minute behind that much more significant threats to him moving up the classification?
Summoned
Junior Member
 
Posts: 72
Joined: 16 Apr 2017 00:14

Re:

10 Jul 2018 02:48

Summoned wrote:If Nibali is disappointed in the performance in the TTT, then I think he may have had unrealistic expectations. Given the team he had, I think losing less than 1:30 is quite acceptable. But this raises the question of how he had envisioned his strategy for the rest of the Tour playing out. Is the concern the time he lost over expectations, or the number of GC contenders who are in front of him now? If he genuinely expected not to be a minute behind Froome and Porte at this point, I am thinking he had a poorly planned vision for success in the Tour. Yes, he is not a minute behind Froome and Porte now, but are the riders he is a minute behind that much more significant threats to him moving up the classification?



I'm also surprised by his reaction. What exactly did he expect? I think most of us expected him to loose around a minute and half maybe a bit more and be in the same situation as Bardet and AG2R. So in truth he's not in that bad of shape. A very different reaction to that of 2 of Movistar's leaders who are more than happy with where they currently are.
User avatar Koronin
Member
 
Posts: 1,868
Joined: 14 Oct 2017 01:42
Location: North Carolina, USA

Re: Re:

10 Jul 2018 03:32

skippo12 wrote:
Gigs_98 wrote:
SafeBet wrote:Even with Haussler and Colbrelli at their best they would have lost 50+ seconds.

Their TTT was fine. He sits very close to most contenders and a healthy minute in front of Quintana. Any of his fan would have signed for this before the Tour started.

Exactly, and possibly even more importantly he seems to be in great shape. Ofc a TTT doesn't tell you that much but riding the climb at the front while dropping two of your teammates is, despite being bad in a TTT, an indicator for good shape.
Anyway, I really think the Roubaix stage is the possibly most important day for him. If he wants to be in yellow in Paris he should better be in front of Froome and Porte at the start of the 2nd week. Otherwise it's still possible but I think very difficult.


I don`t think Porte has any chance even if he is the best climber. 3 downhill finishes will be enough for Nibali (and others) to gain at least 1-2 minutes on him.

Yes, as downhills is a terrain which always entails significant gaps. I don't really remember any downhill finish where porte didn't bleed 1' at the very least... :)
dacooley
Member
 
Posts: 1,596
Joined: 30 May 2015 15:37

Re: Re:

10 Jul 2018 03:47

dacooley wrote:
skippo12 wrote:
Gigs_98 wrote:
SafeBet wrote:Even with Haussler and Colbrelli at their best they would have lost 50+ seconds.

Their TTT was fine. He sits very close to most contenders and a healthy minute in front of Quintana. Any of his fan would have signed for this before the Tour started.

Exactly, and possibly even more importantly he seems to be in great shape. Ofc a TTT doesn't tell you that much but riding the climb at the front while dropping two of your teammates is, despite being bad in a TTT, an indicator for good shape.
Anyway, I really think the Roubaix stage is the possibly most important day for him. If he wants to be in yellow in Paris he should better be in front of Froome and Porte at the start of the 2nd week. Otherwise it's still possible but I think very difficult.


I don`t think Porte has any chance even if he is the best climber. 3 downhill finishes will be enough for Nibali (and others) to gain at least 1-2 minutes on him.

Yes, as downhills is a terrain which always entails significant gaps. I don't really remember any downhill finish where porte didn't bleed 1' at the very least... :)


Well....most of the time he has a crash before he can lose any time but that would take him out of contention as well.
Last years Dauphine would be a good example for Porte losing a race downhill. I think Porte and Zakarin are on a similar level...Nibali gained 34s on Zakarin on a single descent in 2017s Giro. This year there will be more riders willing to take risk (Bardet, Valverde, Dumoulin)...not looking good for Porte.
skippo12
Member
 
Posts: 303
Joined: 14 May 2017 14:34

Re: Re:

10 Jul 2018 04:22

skippo12 wrote:
dacooley wrote:
skippo12 wrote:
Gigs_98 wrote:
SafeBet wrote:Even with Haussler and Colbrelli at their best they would have lost 50+ seconds.

Their TTT was fine. He sits very close to most contenders and a healthy minute in front of Quintana. Any of his fan would have signed for this before the Tour started.

Exactly, and possibly even more importantly he seems to be in great shape. Ofc a TTT doesn't tell you that much but riding the climb at the front while dropping two of your teammates is, despite being bad in a TTT, an indicator for good shape.
Anyway, I really think the Roubaix stage is the possibly most important day for him. If he wants to be in yellow in Paris he should better be in front of Froome and Porte at the start of the 2nd week. Otherwise it's still possible but I think very difficult.


I don`t think Porte has any chance even if he is the best climber. 3 downhill finishes will be enough for Nibali (and others) to gain at least 1-2 minutes on him.

Yes, as downhills is a terrain which always entails significant gaps. I don't really remember any downhill finish where porte didn't bleed 1' at the very least... :)


Well....most of the time he has a crash before he can lose any time but that would take him out of contention as well.
Last years Dauphine would be a good example for Porte losing a race downhill. I think Porte and Zakarin are on a similar level...Nibali gained 34s on Zakarin on a single descent in 2017s Giro. This year there will be more riders willing to take risk (Bardet, Valverde, Dumoulin)...not looking good for Porte.

Descent can easily finish off anyone's race. Yes, Porte made a fatal mistake last year but all in all I didn't notice him being an attrocious descender or something. He's a very mediocre, probably a bit worse than average descender, but there's nothing criminal like Zakarin or Pinot / Wiggins 2013. not to mention about the fact that gaining time on descents is far less guaranteed than doing the same uphill or TT's.

Cobbled stage is a day X for Nibs because most likely he will be lacking pure watts against 1-2-3 guys on mountain top finishes, IMO.
dacooley
Member
 
Posts: 1,596
Joined: 30 May 2015 15:37

Re: Re:

10 Jul 2018 04:41

Koronin wrote:
Summoned wrote:If Nibali is disappointed in the performance in the TTT, then I think he may have had unrealistic expectations. Given the team he had, I think losing less than 1:30 is quite acceptable. But this raises the question of how he had envisioned his strategy for the rest of the Tour playing out. Is the concern the time he lost over expectations, or the number of GC contenders who are in front of him now? If he genuinely expected not to be a minute behind Froome and Porte at this point, I am thinking he had a poorly planned vision for success in the Tour. Yes, he is not a minute behind Froome and Porte now, but are the riders he is a minute behind that much more significant threats to him moving up the classification?



I'm also surprised by his reaction. What exactly did he expect? I think most of us expected him to loose around a minute and half maybe a bit more and be in the same situation as Bardet and AG2R. So in truth he's not in that bad of shape. A very different reaction to that of 2 of Movistar's leaders who are more than happy with where they currently are.


I think he is OK with the overall situation. He was just disappointed because he felt they could've done 10-15 seconds better on the day if all would've gone as planned. It is normal to be dissapointed in that situation regardless what the expectations of the deficit for the day were.
bambino
Member
 
Posts: 727
Joined: 24 May 2013 10:37

10 Jul 2018 06:16

Long before the Tour I felt sure that yesterday Mohoric would have been more helpful than Koren, for example. Anyway, I think Nibbles' current situation is okay. Let's hope he won't lose much on Mur de Bretagne and use his cards well on Sunday,
User avatar Ivan_Basso_77
Junior Member
 
Posts: 79
Joined: 25 Nov 2012 18:19
Location: Karlovo, Bulgaria

PreviousNext

Return to Professional road racing

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Blanco, Broccolidwarf, Captain Serious, Dr. Watson, Flamin, gerundium, Google [Bot], GuyIncognito, krakenKE, LiquidCrystalDynamic, pastronef, Sestriere, SHAD0W93, shalgo, Smowz, Son of Amsterhammer, Suck_Out, tobydawq and 156 guests

Back to top