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Peter Sagan discussion thread.

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18 Mar 2017 17:12

1st or 2nd in every classic since last years San Remo but Roubaix. Only GVA and Kwiatkowski that can beat him. Will not change over the coming weeks.
User avatar Billie
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Re:

18 Mar 2017 17:32

Billie wrote:1st or 2nd in every classic since last years San Remo but Roubaix. Only GVA and Kwiatkowski that can beat him. Will not change over the coming weeks.


???
He won the Flanders, but he was not on the podium at LBL or Il Lombardia last year, so which "Classics" are you referring to?
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18 Mar 2017 17:42

I'm going to assume we're talking classics he actually rode. After all, being on the podium he didn't ride would be asking a bit much, even for Sagan.
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User avatar RedheadDane
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Re:

18 Mar 2017 17:46

RedheadDane wrote:I'm going to assume we're talking classics he actually rode. After all, being on the podium he didn't ride would be asking a bit much, even for Sagan.


Then if Kwiato decides not to ride any other classics this year we can say he won all the classics in 2017. :lol:

I don't remember which classics he rode and which he didn't, but not seeing his name on the podium of last year M-S, LBL, Rubaix and IL Lombardia, saying that from last year M-S (but Rubaix) he has only achieved 1st or 2nd seems to me a bit of an overstatement
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18 Mar 2017 17:53

Just unreal, 2nd again. You'd expect him to learn from it, but he barely seems to do so. If for example Kwia was in his position, having so much strength, there's no doubt in my mind he would have won the race. But Sagan always manages to lose his cool and do something wrong.

Luckily for him, de Ronde has become a pretty untactical race so he should have it in the bag.
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18 Mar 2017 18:25

Peter is not a big fan of MSR, he was prepared to lose it. It won't be the case in Flanders and Roubaix.
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Re:

18 Mar 2017 18:33

Flamin wrote:Just unreal, 2nd again. You'd expect him to learn from it, but he barely seems to do so.


I think to assume he hasn't learned these lessons is to mistake his motivations for racing. It seems clear to me that he is willing to risk losing for the reward of winning audaciously.

He wins enough. He's interested in winning with panache.
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18 Mar 2017 18:56

Oh I agree with that and I can only applaud his attack on the Poggio. What I'm talking about is how he played that final kilometer. He just doesn't seem to have that cool-headedness. Would bluffing a bit more at the end and finishing things off be considered as a win without panache after what he'd done on the Poggio? Of course not.
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Re: Re:

18 Mar 2017 19:07

red_flanders wrote:
Flamin wrote:Just unreal, 2nd again. You'd expect him to learn from it, but he barely seems to do so.


I think to assume he hasn't learned these lessons is to mistake his motivations for racing. It seems clear to me that he is willing to risk losing for the reward of winning audaciously.

He wins enough. He's interested in winning with panache.

Did you see how strong he was? He's never tried by going on the Poggio before, if he waits for the sprint it's always a gamble and he's never the big favourite. In this case he was but he brainfarted it all away.
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Re: Peter Sagan discussion thread.

18 Mar 2017 19:09

To be honest a lot of Sagans mistakes in the past have been that he tries to semicommit/mark out the attacks then is weakened for the sprint. I like that he just chose one option this year and went full out.

I think he also did have enough left to win but probably started the sprint a bit too early but that's always hard to call in a race.

But really not much to complain about, and boy was he insanely strong. I hope he can win Roubaix this year.
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Re: Re:

18 Mar 2017 19:09

Red Rick wrote:
red_flanders wrote:
Flamin wrote:Just unreal, 2nd again. You'd expect him to learn from it, but he barely seems to do so.


I think to assume he hasn't learned these lessons is to mistake his motivations for racing. It seems clear to me that he is willing to risk losing for the reward of winning audaciously.

He wins enough. He's interested in winning with panache.

Did you see how strong he was? He's never tried by going on the Poggio before, if he waits for the sprint it's always a gamble and he's never the big favourite. In this case he was but he brainfarted it all away.


Yes, I watched. My take is the same, he's willing to take risks others aren't. Being World Champion 2 times in a row and as strong as he is makes it easier to take risks. And it appears to be his personality and world view. He's not calculating. He races to win.

That's why he has so many fans.
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Re:

18 Mar 2017 19:12

Flamin wrote:Oh I agree with that and I can only applaud his attack on the Poggio. What I'm talking about is how he played that final kilometer. He just doesn't seem to have that cool-headedness. Would bluffing a bit more at the end and finishing things off be considered as a win without panache after what he'd done on the Poggio? Of course not.


I think if he'd have fooled about they would have run a substantial risk of getting caught. He simply wasn't willing to take that risk and thought he had a fair chance of winning anyway. I just don't think he calculates risk the same way many others do or the way some viewers think he should.

One man's cool-headedness is another's calculation and caution. He knows what he's doing.
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Re: Re:

18 Mar 2017 19:45

red_flanders wrote:
Flamin wrote:Oh I agree with that and I can only applaud his attack on the Poggio. What I'm talking about is how he played that final kilometer. He just doesn't seem to have that cool-headedness. Would bluffing a bit more at the end and finishing things off be considered as a win without panache after what he'd done on the Poggio? Of course not.


I think if he'd have fooled about they would have run a substantial risk of getting caught. He simply wasn't willing to take that risk and thought he had a fair chance of winning anyway. I just don't think he calculates risk the same way many others do or the way some viewers think he should.

One man's cool-headedness is another's calculation and caution. He knows what he's doing.


The gap was a pretty safe one which those 3 in front also could see when they looked back. I'm not calling for trackstands but for example slowing down significantly in those last 400-500m. Make them nervous, wait for them to launch. He's incredibly explosive and powerful, so he doesn't have to make it a long sprint at all.

Imo it's not about calculation but about racing instincts and experience (the latter he should have plenty by now).
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18 Mar 2017 20:00

How easy is it to judge distance when you crank your head backwards to look at the peleton? I've no clue...besides 500 meters can be closed down very fast.
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19 Mar 2017 05:19

He needs a last man. Somebody like Jurgen Roelandts. Otherwise to do everything by himself with a weak team is going to be very difficult
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Re:

19 Mar 2017 07:14

Jspear wrote:How easy is it to judge distance when you crank your head backwards to look at the peleton? I've no clue...besides 500 meters can be closed down very fast.


Of course it is hard. But he is a professional doing this for years now. And most of the time he wins, because he is just above and beyond everyone else, not because of race-smarts. With Kwiatkowski the opposite is the case. He often does not seem to be the best and yet still comes out on top. Just being the best rider does not guarantee a victory everytime. Sure it is easy to judge someone from home, but it is also Sagans job and he still does (or at least seems to do) the same mistakes he did years ago ...
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19 Mar 2017 08:56

https://twitter.com/petosagan/status/843235343725989889

People spend lives trying to hit big targets (achieve great goals)
A good start would be hitting the simplest one! (pissing right into the hole!)

:lol: :lol: :lol:
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19 Mar 2017 09:35

Sagan is perfect the way he is, he doesnt need to change anything. You cant win always, but you can fight for your victories like a true champion. Chapeau to Sagan.
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19 Mar 2017 09:55

Sagan's race will be Ronde De Vlaandaren - The profile ideally suits his power profile - Never as confident in his ability to win Paris Roubiax - Feel he's consistency is under-rated.
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19 Mar 2017 11:02

"I'm satisfied. The result is important but so is putting on a show for the fans. " Peter Sagan. Thats why many love him as a rider. I think at Ronde there is situation this year like 2013. Two strong favourites. Peter is Cance this time and second is GVA. I dont think anybody can match Sagan at last Kwaremont - Paterberg combo. Only some attack like Kristoff- Terpstra can win. Would be grat if somebody from Bora can stay with Sagan to last Kwaremont.
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