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Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

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Re:

16 May 2018 16:25

movingtarget wrote:If Froome continues to leak time does he climb off ? Or maybe he just treats it as training for the Tour and maybe aims for a stage win although that thinking for Froome would surprise me. In this sort of form he isn't winning the TT anyway.


What Tour? :lol: He will ride to the sunset after Zoncolan... :D
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Re: Re:

16 May 2018 17:44

Blanco wrote:
movingtarget wrote:If Froome continues to leak time does he climb off ? Or maybe he just treats it as training for the Tour and maybe aims for a stage win although that thinking for Froome would surprise me. In this sort of form he isn't winning the TT anyway.


What Tour? :lol: He will ride to the sunset after Zoncolan... :D

congrats, mate. time for haters' revenge. froome made lots of people to suffer for years. it definetely needs some moral rebound.
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16 May 2018 22:32

Seems like he was caught up behind a crash. May not have amounted to much time loss. It's been that kind of race for Froome so far.
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16 May 2018 22:52

His cadence was too high. It’s like he’s not able to put power into the pedals. Perhaps he wouldn’t have been that far back, but he definitely would have lost time....even without the “hold up.”
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16 May 2018 23:07

Froome has a history of struggling with crashes, his two crashes here have not helped his whatsoever. For what it’s worth, I think he will for sure finish the Giro if he doesn’t crash again, probably finish about 6th.
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Re:

16 May 2018 23:34

Jspear wrote:His cadence was too high. It’s like he’s not able to put power into the pedals. Perhaps he wouldn’t have been that far back, but he definitely would have lost time....even without the “hold up.”

Maybe he should train on your muro in Pittsburgh my friend :) .

Froome and Sky advertised the Giro-Tour double, not the Giro to train for the TdF. Or did he/they know ahead of time that Israel was going to pay to secure his participation? And then CF showed up preparing for the Tour, in training mode, getting two millions richer, and yes at the first opportunity, it's arrivederci. Poor PR, greed, not much to like frankly.

Or his decline is real as we saw at last year's Tour, which is the only serious explanation not discussed in the Clinic for the Dawg fans ...

Something ain't working. Right now, he's Maxime Monfort. It's embarrassing. Yates is the Brit atop the GC, scoring marginal time gains just about everyday and looking like he can win it.

I don't know about the "haters" as it was posted. Some would say "back to Earth". The Dutch sing "ground control to Major Tom", as I posted some days ago and took a little flak afterwards, Tom Dumoulin is the best GT rider right now. The Froome era now seems to be over. I don't believe that he's playing mind games and will pull a Pantani on a MTF or anything like this. Actually he may end up fighting for 15th place with Betancur.

Yikes.
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Re: Re:

17 May 2018 00:01

Tonton wrote:
Jspear wrote:His cadence was too high. It’s like he’s not able to put power into the pedals. Perhaps he wouldn’t have been that far back, but he definitely would have lost time....even without the “hold up.”

Maybe he should train on your muro in Pittsburgh my friend :) .

Froome and Sky advertised the Giro-Tour double, not the Giro to train for the TdF. Or did he/they know ahead of time that Israel was going to pay to secure his participation? And then CF showed up preparing for the Tour, in training mode, getting two millions richer, and yes at the first opportunity, it's arrivederci. Poor PR, greed, not much to like frankly.

Or his decline is real as we saw at last year's Tour, which is the only serious explanation not discussed in the Clinic for the Dawg fans ...

Something ain't working. Right now, he's Maxime Monfort. It's embarrassing. Yates is the Brit atop the GC, scoring marginal time gains just about everyday and looking like he can win it.

I don't know about the "haters" as it was posted. Some would say "back to Earth". The Dutch sing "ground control to Major Tom", as I posted some days ago and took a little flak afterwards, Tom Dumoulin is the best GT rider right now. The Froome era now seems to be over. I don't believe that he's playing mind games and will pull a Pantani on a MTF or anything like this. Actually he may end up fighting for 15th place with Betancur.

Yikes.



Personally I believe his decline is real. The only thing I'm wondering right now is are we seeing a faster decline than what we may have actually expected?
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Re: Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

17 May 2018 00:08

....maybe. And cycling his not only physical, it's mental. The scrutiny, the stress must be super high, and the team saying keep fighting is even worse when I bet that Froome wants out. This Giro is the death by a thousand cuts. Froome is getting kicked in the butt every way. legacy-wise, the greats never got humiliated like that.
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Re: Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

17 May 2018 00:08

Zoncolan is the last chance for Froome's Giro. Either, he can gain time for a shot at the podium in week 3 (probably won't win) or he will sink like a stone. Everything so far, points to epic sinking.
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Re: Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

17 May 2018 00:10

Tonton wrote:....maybe. And cycling his not only physical, it's mental. The scrutiny, the stress must be super high, and the team saying keep fighting is even worse when I bet that Froome wants out. This Giro is the death by a thousand cuts. Froome is getting kicked in the butt every way. legacy-wise, the greats never got humiliated like that.



Very true. It would seem Froome can't handle that type of pressure nearly as well other riders like Contador and Valverde who both actually won Grand Tours while dealing with doping cases of their own.
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Re: Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

17 May 2018 00:33

Tonton wrote:.... the greats never got humiliated like that.


huh?

merckx?

lemond?

indurain?

the opposite is actually rarer.
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Re: Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

17 May 2018 01:11

Big Doopie wrote:
Tonton wrote:.... the greats never got humiliated like that.


huh?

merckx?

lemond?

indurain?

the opposite is actually rarer.

You talk about events that we can't talk about here :) (doping) . Actually I was there the whole time, watched it live (even in '77 - road-side when Quilfen won). Merckx was 6th and a factor , LeMond was a factor, and so was BigMig. Right now, Froome is a punching bag. Lost to Betancur today...

I know how it feels to get my guy beat up. It may happen soon. Who knows. But you have to admit that the four-time Kentucky Derby winner, right now looks like a donkey. Eat your humble pie and move on. He may bounce back. But now, he's bad.

Cheers!
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Re: Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

17 May 2018 01:50

Tonton wrote:
Big Doopie wrote:
Tonton wrote:.... the greats never got humiliated like that.


huh?

merckx?

lemond?

indurain?

the opposite is actually rarer.

You talk about events that we can't talk about here :) (doping) . Actually I was there the whole time, watched it live (even in '77 - road-side when Quilfen won). Merckx was 6th and a factor , LeMond was a factor, and so was BigMig. Right now, Froome is a punching bag. Lost to Betancur today...

I know how it feels to get my guy beat up. It may happen soon. Who knows. But you have to admit that the four-time Kentucky Derby winner, right now looks like a donkey. Eat your humble pie and move on. He may bounce back. But now, he's bad.

Cheers!


just agree to disagree, I guess.

i was there too.

merckx after milan san remo win in 1976 was almost never really a factor. the giro in that year he finished without a stage victory in 8th (I believe). 1977 TDF, he was dropped by over two minutes on the first mountain stage on the tourmalet. Only got back on to the leaders because of a very long descent. as soon as the TDF hit the alpes he fell far back, first at the MTT (where I think he finished like 10th) and then irremediably at alpe d'huez. he only finished sixth finally because he got minutes back on a long escape with agostinho a few days later, but he was let go he was a quarter of an hour back. he also moved up a spot when zoetemelk was penalized 10 mins for doping. at the worlds later that year in south america he was already a shell, finishing virtually last waaaaay behind moser.

indurain was really not a factor in the 1996 TDF. He finished 11th after all. and was only a factor because everyone expected him to do better (kind of like froome). He later abandoned the vuelta when he couldn't compete at the top.

lemond - yes - arguable clinic-related issues brought him down, but that is a matter for debate.

However, dear Tonton, in all of professional sports, very few champions leave on top without being humiliated (Muhammed Ali?). Hinault, to me, comes closest. Because he set out years before that he would retire on his 32nd birthday (not old these days). He therefore was able to be a main player until the end.
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Re: Re:

17 May 2018 04:19

Koronin wrote:
Tonton wrote:
Jspear wrote:His cadence was too high. It’s like he’s not able to put power into the pedals. Perhaps he wouldn’t have been that far back, but he definitely would have lost time....even without the “hold up.”

Maybe he should train on your muro in Pittsburgh my friend :) .

Froome and Sky advertised the Giro-Tour double, not the Giro to train for the TdF. Or did he/they know ahead of time that Israel was going to pay to secure his participation? And then CF showed up preparing for the Tour, in training mode, getting two millions richer, and yes at the first opportunity, it's arrivederci. Poor PR, greed, not much to like frankly.

Or his decline is real as we saw at last year's Tour, which is the only serious explanation not discussed in the Clinic for the Dawg fans ...

Something ain't working. Right now, he's Maxime Monfort. It's embarrassing. Yates is the Brit atop the GC, scoring marginal time gains just about everyday and looking like he can win it.

I don't know about the "haters" as it was posted. Some would say "back to Earth". The Dutch sing "ground control to Major Tom", as I posted some days ago and took a little flak afterwards, Tom Dumoulin is the best GT rider right now. The Froome era now seems to be over. I don't believe that he's playing mind games and will pull a Pantani on a MTF or anything like this. Actually he may end up fighting for 15th place with Betancur.

Yikes.



Personally I believe his decline is real. The only thing I'm wondering right now is are we seeing a faster decline than what we may have actually expected?


Well it took Froome a week to say that he was suffering from his pre TT crash and he had quite a lot of pain on one side of his body. Obviously they were keeping it quiet. Last year's Tour showed some deterioration which sounds ridiculous after doing the double. But it was obvious in both of last year's GT wins how much he was relying on the team and using the TTs to make the difference. I was surprised that Uran got as close as he did in the Tour and I think it was more about Froome's drop off than Uran being so much better that he used to be. Uran had a few mediocre years after two Giro podiums so he always had some talent. There were signs there that Froome's climbing is not what it was. Also Froome had some luck in the Tour, some of his rivals crashed out, Quintana had done the Giro, Aru was out of sorts. I guess we will never know how Porte would have gone in the mountains but he was looking good before he crashed and Froome wasn't. Bardet needed some help and the few times that he had Froome under the pump Sky reeled him back in. Froome never won a stage.........unusual for him and for any GT winner.
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17 May 2018 05:24

We had the bad "nutrition" excuse at the TdF last year - Sky did seem to be munching all the way to the finish after that. But the climbing seems more and more like someone stuck in the wrong gear.
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17 May 2018 06:21

I guess the plan was to ride the Giro a bit undercooked, accept that there's no guarantee of him winning it, but that he might sneak it if the competition isn't strong. Then the two crashes have just made matters worse. It's too soon to say he's declining, I mean he is the holder of the Tour and the Vuelta, winning 4 GTs in a row was always a long shot.
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17 May 2018 07:28

Is it me or does Froome seem to have too high a cadence when he is dropping time, is this to do with his injuries.

Can't see it healing up in time for Zoncolan either
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Re: Re:

17 May 2018 07:41

Tonton wrote:
Jspear wrote:His cadence was too high. It’s like he’s not able to put power into the pedals. Perhaps he wouldn’t have been that far back, but he definitely would have lost time....even without the “hold up.”

Maybe he should train on your muro in Pittsburgh my friend :) .

Froome and Sky advertised the Giro-Tour double, not the Giro to train for the TdF. Or did he/they know ahead of time that Israel was going to pay to secure his participation? And then CF showed up preparing for the Tour, in training mode, getting two millions richer, and yes at the first opportunity, it's arrivederci. Poor PR, greed, not much to like frankly.

Or his decline is real as we saw at last year's Tour, which is the only serious explanation not discussed in the Clinic for the Dawg fans ...

Something ain't working. Right now, he's Maxime Monfort. It's embarrassing. Yates is the Brit atop the GC, scoring marginal time gains just about everyday and looking like he can win it.

I don't know about the "haters" as it was posted. Some would say "back to Earth". The Dutch sing "ground control to Major Tom", as I posted some days ago and took a little flak afterwards, Tom Dumoulin is the best GT rider right now. The Froome era now seems to be over. I don't believe that he's playing mind games and will pull a Pantani on a MTF or anything like this. Actually he may end up fighting for 15th place with Betancur.

Yikes.


Oh no, he's going to get murdered by Betancur already on Zonc ;)
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Re:

17 May 2018 07:50

movingtarget wrote:Seems like he was caught up behind a crash. May not have amounted to much time loss. It's been that kind of race for Froome so far.


He would've lost at least 20-30 anyway. Betancur gave him 10sec and they were together at the foot of the last climb.
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Re: Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

17 May 2018 08:29

Interesting to see if he can fight. In several Vuelta's which he didn't win eventually he showed he's not a quitter, but he just has his limits. CF is a very weak rider without a superstrong team keeping the chaos away.

Physically surely he should be able to do the double, but luckily cycling sometimes is not about physique only :).

And this is also proving my thesis since 2016: he's ready to be eaten by his opponents, if only they could smell his decline and not being so desperately happy with a podium or top 5 FFS. Now the time has finally arrived.
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