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Rigoberto Uran discussion thread.

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23 Jul 2017 08:16

I think Uran is a world class rider who doesn't have one niche where he's actually the best. That hurts him. That hurts a lot of riders.
Veni, Vidi, Kirby

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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 08:30

DFA123 wrote:
PremierAndrew wrote:Uran is very good at making the most of his abilities.

Can't see him winning a GT but he is definitely capable of winning a big classic (Lombardia is definitely a race he should target)

I think the opposite of this. To me, he is an incredible talent who has failed to convert his ability into wins. At various points in his career he has been one of the best climbers in the world, one of the best time triallists, one of the best hilly classics riders and one of the best sprinters among climbers. He has very good endurance and has ridden on some of the strongest teams in the peloton throughout most of his career.

Yet, at 30 years old, he's never won a stage race, and his only prestigious one day win is Quebec.


The problem is he's one of the best at many things, but not the best at anything, and that's reflected on his palmares.

Runner up in three grand tours, olympic road race, a couple of grand tour stage wins, couple of podiums at week long stage races, 3 podiums in lombardy

It's not a bad palmares at all, just lacks the wins, but reflects his abilities
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Re: Rigoberto Uran discussion thread.

23 Jul 2017 08:42

Alexandre B. wrote:
roundabout wrote:My memory is not the best, but I do not remember him usually being able to make a difference uphill. Someone who has followed him closer can correct me, but the only time he was the best of the favorites uphill was on that Giro stage where everyone else was initially focused on Wiggins and he was already a couple (?) of minutes back on GC.

He was strong on Zoncolan in Giro 2014.


Yes, but even then I seem to recall he was quite content to ride behind Poels and gained practically nothing on the rest considering the difficulty of the climb.
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Re: Rigoberto Uran discussion thread.

23 Jul 2017 09:04

roundabout wrote:
Alexandre B. wrote:
roundabout wrote:My memory is not the best, but I do not remember him usually being able to make a difference uphill. Someone who has followed him closer can correct me, but the only time he was the best of the favorites uphill was on that Giro stage where everyone else was initially focused on Wiggins and he was already a couple (?) of minutes back on GC.

He was strong on Zoncolan in Giro 2014.


Yes, but even then I seem to recall he was quite content to ride behind Poels and gained practically nothing on the rest considering the difficulty of the climb.


Can't really blame there. Had minutes to win or lose to change GC position, breakaway was 15 minutes up the road. Attacking in the last 2km for shits and giggles and dropping everyone but Quitnana was the best he could've done.
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23 Jul 2017 09:23

I think he thought he thought win condition was to follow, follow and follow being as anonymous as possible and hope for an out of the world ITT or bad luck for Froome. If that happens, he wins. If that doesnt happen he still gets 2nd, his greatest result of his career.

I can't blame him.
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23 Jul 2017 09:26

He was relatively close with Aru at that point (under a minute I think), but you are right, there was no real incentive to be aggressive at that point.
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23 Jul 2017 09:32

Yeah well I don't think he and his team had the resources to put up a fight and I think the current results exceeded their expectations to the point that they quite frankly was very surprised he was going that well. Urán and Cannondale have had a lot of bad luck, I understand 'settling' for 2nd. But still, just being to close to Froome in the end, you never knows what can happen.
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23 Jul 2017 12:16

I was just thinking that had the opening TT been dry, and had he not almost crashed coming into the stadium yesterday, and had he actually attacked once or twice, then Uran would have very likely won this Tour.
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Re:

23 Jul 2017 13:04

Brullnux wrote:I was just thinking that had the opening TT been dry, and had he not almost crashed coming into the stadium yesterday, and had he actually attacked once or twice, then Uran would have very likely won this Tour.

Doubtful!
Too many ifs. Froome could have raced a bit different.

I am not sure if he had any incentive to go on the attack. He and his team had a lot more to lose than to gain.
Last edited by Escarabajo on 23 Jul 2017 13:43, edited 1 time in total.
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23 Jul 2017 13:07

It was unlikely to work, but it can only be super sad that the 2nd in the GC never tried to win the race.
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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 13:49

Escarabajo wrote:
Brullnux wrote:I was just thinking that had the opening TT been dry, and had he not almost crashed coming into the stadium yesterday, and had he actually attacked once or twice, then Uran would have very likely won this Tour.

Doubtful!
Too many ifs. Froome could have raced a bit different.

I am not sure if he had any incentive to go on the attack. He and his team had a lot more to lose than to gain.

Let's assume 25-30 seconds back from a non wet TT (which would put him around half a minute behind Froome, which is possible looking at the final time trial), and another 10-15 from not going into a barrier, that puts him between 19 and 9 seconds behind Froome depending on which end of the bracket he falls. Then actually attacking at some point could well have taken back 10 seconds, perhaps on the way to Foix (which is where his only mini-dig ever came), or at Galibier, or Izoard, or when Froome had a mechanical. Froome might've raced differently, but he never had the legs to drop any of the contenders on the climbs, as we saw on Planche des Belles Filles, Mont du Chat, Peguere and Izoard.

But, no matter what Vaughters says or claims, he wasn't interested in the yellow jersey.
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Re: Rigoberto Uran discussion thread.

23 Jul 2017 13:53

I agree with all the above posts. Bravo Rigoberto. You had a great Tour, won the queen stage, enjoy the podium and the Champagne. Great job :) .
SOLO LA VITTORIA È BELLA
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Re:

23 Jul 2017 14:29

Brullnux wrote:I was just thinking that had the opening TT been dry, and had he not almost crashed coming into the stadium yesterday, and had he actually attacked once or twice, then Uran would have very likely won this Tour.

Two more ifs and I could have won la TdF. :rolleyes:

The reason the if game doesn't work is that it goes both ways. If RU crashes (or crashes out), if he blows up, if his frame brakes...if...if... and for every if there is opposing if.
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Re: Rigoberto Uran discussion thread.

23 Jul 2017 14:49

Gigs_98 wrote:It's actually quite strange. You would normally call guys who have 3 2nd places in gt's unlucky, and would normally say that they deserve to finally win a gt, but in his case I've never had the feeling that he was anywhere close to a gt win and except for the few stages in pink after the ITT in the giro 2014 I never had the feeling he could ever win one.

2nd is the ceiling for him
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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 14:53

PremierAndrew wrote:
DFA123 wrote:
PremierAndrew wrote:Uran is very good at making the most of his abilities.

Can't see him winning a GT but he is definitely capable of winning a big classic (Lombardia is definitely a race he should target)

I think the opposite of this. To me, he is an incredible talent who has failed to convert his ability into wins. At various points in his career he has been one of the best climbers in the world, one of the best time triallists, one of the best hilly classics riders and one of the best sprinters among climbers. He has very good endurance and has ridden on some of the strongest teams in the peloton throughout most of his career.

Yet, at 30 years old, he's never won a stage race, and his only prestigious one day win is Quebec.


The problem is he's one of the best at many things, but not the best at anything, and that's reflected on his palmares.

Runner up in three grand tours, olympic road race, a couple of grand tour stage wins, couple of podiums at week long stage races, 3 podiums in lombardy

It's not a bad palmares at all, just lacks the wins, but reflects his abilities

I guess it reflects his abilities to an extent, but I think a better tactical rider or even someone who was a bit braver with their riding would have won a lot more. He reminds me a bit of Valverde before his ban (though not quite as good), in that he has it all but races just a bit too passively at times.

Hopefully Uran can change that later in his career, the way Valverde has done and start racking up some impressive wins.
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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 14:55

DFA123 wrote:I think a better tactical rider or even someone who was a bit braver with their riding would have won a lot more.

Or even simply someone who didn't look back and lose sight of his rival with 200 m to go. :D
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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 15:05

hrotha wrote:
DFA123 wrote:I think a better tactical rider or even someone who was a bit braver with their riding would have won a lot more.

Or even simply someone who didn't look back and lose sight of his rival with 200 m to go. :D

Lol, indeed!

I think the talk about not having a niche or not quite being the best at anything is a bit generous too him. He was the stronger sprinter in a two-up finish at the Olympics, he was in a winning position at the end of Lombardia last year, you could even say he was in a winning position at the 2014 Giro before the Gavia/Stelvio stage, and he lost them all due to tactical errors.

Imagine how different his record would look if he had converted those three into victories, as he should have done (let alone all the other races he's let slip). We'd be talking about one of the great palmares of his generation.
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Re: Rigoberto Uran discussion thread.

23 Jul 2017 15:13

Tonton wrote:I agree with all the above posts. Bravo Rigoberto. You had a great Tour, won the queen stage, enjoy the podium and the Champagne. Great job :) .


And he did it without any sort of effective team. They were pretty much MIA for the whole tour. Bravo Rigoberto.
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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 15:39

hrotha wrote:
DFA123 wrote:I think a better tactical rider or even someone who was a bit braver with their riding would have won a lot more.

Or even simply someone who didn't look back and lose sight of his rival with 200 m to go. :D


He looked the other way.
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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 16:07

jmdirt wrote:
Brullnux wrote:I was just thinking that had the opening TT been dry, and had he not almost crashed coming into the stadium yesterday, and had he actually attacked once or twice, then Uran would have very likely won this Tour.

Two more ifs and I could have won la TdF. :rolleyes:

The reason the if game doesn't work is that it goes both ways. If RU crashes (or crashes out), if he blows up, if his frame brakes...if...if... and for every if there is opposing if.

Yeah but the three conditionals I used weren't exactly implausible, or particularly impressive. A dry prologue, not riding into a barrier in the final 500m of the ITT, and attacking once.
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