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Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

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06 Jan 2018 17:24

Yeah, the inconsistency of riders like Porte and Landa almost makes it necessary to have two lists. If I had to rank the riders based on their chances of winning a GT I would rank them something like this:

1. Froome
2. Dumoulin
3. Quintana
4. Nibali
5. Porte
6. Landa
7. Bardet
8. Aru
9. Zakarin
10. Pinot
11. Chaves
12. Uran
13. Valverde

But if I had to choose one rider head to head over another I would rank them something like this:

1. Froome
2. Quintana
3. Nibali
4. Dumoulin
5. Bardet
6. Valverde
7. Aru
8. Chaves
9. Pinot
10. Uran
11. Zakarin
12. Landa
13. Porte
User avatar Hugo Koblet
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Re: Re:

06 Jan 2018 17:35

Bot. Sky_Bot wrote:
Netserk wrote:Something like this? Not easy to place Landa and Porte...

Froome
Dumoulin
Quintana
Nibali
Bardet
Valverde
Porte
Landa
Aru
Uran
Pinot
Zakarin

Whoops, after I originally forgot Aru ( :o ) Pinot has been dumped out of the top-10! :eek:

edit: And Chaves as well, lol. I'd have him ahead of Pinot as well.


Interesting, but I would divide the contenders in 3 groups:
______________
Froome (As Pure Sky_Bot I unfortunately must hope he is out):
______________
Quintana
Dumoulin
Porte
Landa
Nibali
______________
Aru
Bardet
Uran
Poels
Keldermann
Zakarin
Kruijswijk
GT
Valverde
Pinot
The BraveHeart Hero R. Majka
Michał K.
Chaves
MA Lopez
A. Yates


Your list is laughable
Skyline Drive
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPjM6rZ4pN0
_____________________________________________________________________________
Canton Ave Climb
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C90ZPlbEfmU
User avatar Jspear
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Re: Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

06 Jan 2018 18:08

portugal11 wrote:when he gets sick, he suffers, [b]doesn't get 20 puffs to keep going, he may not be the greatest, but the kid is an all-around good human being. A fantastic rider. Just entering his prime. You wait...

you should act like a mod, I was banned more than once due to clinic reasons. Give the example tonton.[/quote]

I didn't mean it that way, but I can see how my sentence can be interpreted. My bad. My point was that he's human, like the rest of us has his setbacks, and he fights through them.

For the lists, putting Froome and Dumoulin above the rest makes sense...Nibali OK, Quintana had a disappointing '17 campaign, so I wonder.

In no particular order, they are all so close, the second tier for me consists of the two Frenchies, Uran, Aru, Chaves, Landa, I would never discount Valverde, Zakarin...I would not have Wilco (yet), Majka, or Porte (better be lucky than good).

In the end, tactics and yes, luck, often determine who gets the edge, gets in a break that no one chases and goes from 6th to 3rd in the GC...et caetera.

We'll see in '18 how things shake up.
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User avatar Tonton
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Re: Re:

06 Jan 2018 18:52

Jspear wrote:
Bot. Sky_Bot wrote:
Netserk wrote:Something like this? Not easy to place Landa and Porte...

Froome
Dumoulin
Quintana
Nibali
Bardet
Valverde
Porte
Landa
Aru
Uran
Pinot
Zakarin

Whoops, after I originally forgot Aru ( :o ) Pinot has been dumped out of the top-10! :eek:

edit: And Chaves as well, lol. I'd have him ahead of Pinot as well.


Interesting, but I would divide the contenders in 3 groups:
______________
Froome (As Pure Sky_Bot I unfortunately must hope he is out):
______________
Quintana
Dumoulin
Porte
Landa
Nibali
______________
Aru
Bardet
Uran
Poels
Keldermann
Zakarin
Kruijswijk
GT
Valverde
Pinot
The BraveHeart Hero R. Majka
Michał K.
Chaves
MA Lopez
A. Yates


Your list is laughable


Well, I'm so interested in your own..
User avatar Bot. Sky_Bot
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Re: Re:

06 Jan 2018 19:46

Bot. Sky_Bot wrote:
Jspear wrote:
Bot. Sky_Bot wrote:
Netserk wrote:Something like this? Not easy to place Landa and Porte...

Froome
Dumoulin
Quintana
Nibali
Bardet
Valverde
Porte
Landa
Aru
Uran
Pinot
Zakarin

Whoops, after I originally forgot Aru ( :o ) Pinot has been dumped out of the top-10! :eek:

edit: And Chaves as well, lol. I'd have him ahead of Pinot as well.


Interesting, but I would divide the contenders in 3 groups:
______________
Froome (As Pure Sky_Bot I unfortunately must hope he is out):
______________
Quintana
Dumoulin
Porte
Landa
Nibali
______________
Aru
Bardet
Uran
Poels
Keldermann
Zakarin
Kruijswijk
GT
Valverde
Pinot
The BraveHeart Hero R. Majka
Michał K.
Chaves
MA Lopez
A. Yates


Your list is laughable


Well, I'm so interested in your own..


Poels, Keldermann, Kruijswijk, GT shouldn’t be anywhere near that high. You have Chaves WAY to low. Kwiatkowski shouldn’t even be in this list. If he is, he has to be at the bottom.
Skyline Drive
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPjM6rZ4pN0
_____________________________________________________________________________
Canton Ave Climb
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C90ZPlbEfmU
User avatar Jspear
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Re: Re:

06 Jan 2018 19:49

tobydawq wrote:
Jspear wrote:Valverde wouldn’t do as well as Pinot in any GT now.


How do you conclude that? The guy was smashing the entire peloton over and over and over last spring like never before. Why assume that his abilities in a Grand Tour would have gone in the other direction?


Regarding the ranking of the GT riders:
I would rank Porte higher up that list. He is a potential Tour winner - you can't say many others on that list are. And you can't discount him just because his best GT result is fifth. You have to take into consideration how strong he is and if he one day manages to not have any misfortune, I think he can take a Tour win. But he turns 33 this year and it's unlikely that he will make it through unscathed this July, so the time is ticking and he may very well never win. But if we were to have a normal Tour right now, he'd be my favourite (with the current situation sidelining Froome).


I expect Valverde to be excellent, but perhaps a lil worse in the GT’s than he was previously. I expect Pinot to be better this year.
Skyline Drive
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPjM6rZ4pN0
_____________________________________________________________________________
Canton Ave Climb
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C90ZPlbEfmU
User avatar Jspear
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Location: N. VA, USA

06 Jan 2018 23:14

Valverde could keep killing the classics and short stage races but his podium days in GTs are probably over. Nibali seems to be past his best and Quintana is not the climber he was two or three years ago.which brings others into contention. The Giro only seems to have a few possible winners unlike the Tour. Of course if Froome is taken out of both races it changes the scenarios completely and with Thomas as team leader at the Tour. Based on last year I think Pinot and others could do well even though I don't see Pinot winning either race. Porte gets another chance this year on a route that should suit him but the usual doubts remain. The 2014 Tour had early casualties and this will probably be the same with some of the CG contenders. But then then the first week always has casualties no matter which stages are raced.
movingtarget
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Re: Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

30 Jan 2018 03:18

Well, well, well...Groupama-FDJ's team presentation is coming up, we'll know what TP's season will look like. Tomorrow.

I know...business, sponsors, blahblahblah. Le Tour. Madiot. France. Pressure.

What I want: Pinot-Reichenbach Giro, Reichenbach-Demare+train TdF, Pinot-Gaudu Vuelta.

What will likely happen: all in for Tibopino in the TdF with Reichenbach, big TTT team, Demare for week-1, good on cobbles and maybe yellow on the first rest day, Gaudu (Reichenbach?) at the Vuelta. Maybe Demare to do Il Giro too and leave after two weeks.

What is scary, could be great, likely bad: Pinot Giro-Tour. I would see Gaudu at Il Giro, Reichenbach at the TdF and leader at the Vuelta, the Demare situation is unclear...not enough room for his train + GT aspirations. I can imagine it tho'. Possible. But rest time isn't enough...

Until the announcement, I'm holding my breath... :redface:

...anyone has an inhaler? I can't breathe! :D

Puff, puff, puff, puff, puff...portugal11 will like that one :D .

Soon we'll know...
SOLO LA VITTORIA È BELLA
User avatar Tonton
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Re: Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

30 Jan 2018 17:48

Tonton wrote:Well, well, well...Groupama-FDJ's team presentation is coming up, we'll know what TP's season will look like. Tomorrow.

I know...business, sponsors, blahblahblah. Le Tour. Madiot. France. Pressure.

What I want: Pinot-Reichenbach Giro, Reichenbach-Demare+train TdF, Pinot-Gaudu Vuelta.

What will likely happen: all in for Tibopino in the TdF with Reichenbach, big TTT team, Demare for week-1, good on cobbles and maybe yellow on the first rest day, Gaudu (Reichenbach?) at the Vuelta. Maybe Demare to do Il Giro too and leave after two weeks.

What is scary, could be great, likely bad: Pinot Giro-Tour. I would see Gaudu at Il Giro, Reichenbach at the TdF and leader at the Vuelta, the Demare situation is unclear...not enough room for his train + GT aspirations. I can imagine it tho'. Possible. But rest time isn't enough...

Until the announcement, I'm holding my breath... :redface:

...anyone has an inhaler? I can't breathe! :D

Puff, puff, puff, puff, puff...portugal11 will like that one :D .

Soon we'll know...


Actually Reichenbach already said that he'll do only one GT this year and that will be the Giro and as a domestique : https://www.lenouvelliste.ch/articles/sports/cyclisme/je-suis-surpris-d-avoir-aussi-bien-tourne-la-page-729814

I can't imagine Pinot without Reichenbach on his main objective for the season. He'll do the double like last year but with half the number of race days prior to the Tour.

I'm actually more interested in the new jersey. :D
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31 Jan 2018 08:41

Tour du Haut-Var
Volta a Catalunya
Tour of the Alps
Giro d'Italia
Championnat de France
Tour de France

:)
User avatar Alexandre B.
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Re:

31 Jan 2018 09:32

Alexandre B. wrote:Tour du Haut-Var
Volta a Catalunya
Tour of the Alps
Giro d'Italia
Championnat de France
Tour de France

:)


Nice program, but I'm skeptical about the French Championship. Last year he said that target the ITT made him resume the training too soon and he failed to wipe out the fatigue of the Giro.

Hope he'll ride just as a domestique to have a race day in the legs.
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31 Jan 2018 11:56

So I take it that Pinot is riding for GC at the Giro and for stages at the TDF.
yaco
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31 Jan 2018 12:07

Thats a shame, hoped he would ride LeTour.
Breh
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31 Jan 2018 12:32

Glad Pinot is back to the Giro! Podium is mandatory this year. I believe :)
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Re: Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

31 Jan 2018 12:52

Tonton wrote:Well, well, well...Groupama-FDJ's team presentation is coming up, we'll know what TP's season will look like. Tomorrow.

I know...business, sponsors, blahblahblah. Le Tour. Madiot. France. Pressure.

What I want: Pinot-Reichenbach Giro, Reichenbach-Demare+train TdF, Pinot-Gaudu Vuelta.

What will likely happen: all in for Tibopino in the TdF with Reichenbach, big TTT team, Demare for week-1, good on cobbles and maybe yellow on the first rest day, Gaudu (Reichenbach?) at the Vuelta. Maybe Demare to do Il Giro too and leave after two weeks.

What is scary, could be great, likely bad: Pinot Giro-Tour. I would see Gaudu at Il Giro, Reichenbach at the TdF and leader at the Vuelta, the Demare situation is unclear...not enough room for his train + GT aspirations. I can imagine it tho'. Possible. But rest time isn't enough...

Until the announcement, I'm holding my breath... :redface:

...anyone has an inhaler? I can't breathe! :D

Puff, puff, puff, puff, puff...portugal11 will like that one :D .

Soon we'll know...

puff puff is what pinot will have to do against aru in the giro :D
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31 Jan 2018 13:24

Looks like a rather light Schedule before the Giro, a bit like the typical Aru approach.
The reason is probably the fact that he feels that less racing days will allow him to recover better/go stagehunting in the Tour.
User avatar Mayomaniac
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Re: Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

31 Jan 2018 13:24

Giro is the safer bet for him. In the Tour he most likely is down 2min+ after the team timetrial and the cobbled stage.
With his 3rd week form from last year he can beat anyone not named TomD, Nibali, Froome and Quintana. With Nibali and Quintana focussing on the Tour and Froome questionable the podium is in reach. Add the fact that Zakarin and Porte will focuss on the Tour as well and the number of contenders is lower than it was in the previous years.
TomD is the favorite with Aru, Chavez and Pinot as his best opponents.
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Re:

31 Jan 2018 13:25

Alexandre B. wrote:Tour du Haut-Var
Volta a Catalunya
Tour of the Alps
Giro d'Italia
Championnat de France
Tour de France

:)

The Nationals is a question mark in l'Equipe. I hope that Thibaut doesn't go: Giro-Tour will be extremely tough of a challenge. Rest in June Tibopino, enjoy the pink pajamas :) ...
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Re: Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

31 Jan 2018 14:09

Interview in La Croix: objective at Il Giro: better GC than last year. Worlds, GDL.
Le Parisien: no French Championships...but twitter contradicts this.
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Re: Thibaut Pinot discussion thread

03 Feb 2018 11:59

Tonton wrote:Interview in La Croix: objective at Il Giro: better GC than last year. Worlds, GDL.
Le Parisien: no French Championships...but twitter contradicts this.


Perhaps he'll take part, but not really training and targeting them?
They are inbetween the Giro and the Tour, when he actually needs to rest, not go full gas, if he wants to perform well in July.

Anyway, his participation in the Giro makes the Corsa Rosa more and more interesting. The field of top riders looks quite strong, barring any Froome's ban.

Froome
Dumoulin
Pinot
Aru
Chaves
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