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Team Movistar-thread

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23 Jan 2017 14:30

Sutherland is a valuable domestique at Grand Tours and in the Classic races - You cant go wrong with a rider of this quality.
yaco
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Re: Team Movistar-thread

23 Jan 2017 19:22

Moviestar wrote:Sutherland will have the same schedule as last season, Giro + Vuelta. A good thing, always a solid equipier.

http://www.wielerflits.nl/nieuws/227540/wielerploegen-2017-movistar.html


Totally froze him out. Yes, he is one of the best and most respected domestiques out there. I'd bet he was the one who spent the most time in front of the peloton in GTs last year. Rory is a sure bet and Im actually surprised how well he climbs as well!
"This is the Tour that will determine If I can drink espresso at the Garda lake the rest of my life"
User avatar Valv.Piti
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23 Jan 2017 23:47

Nairo Quintana seems like a nice quy and he can realy realy climb but he must be one of the most boring riders in the peloton.....there he just riding along ...

But fair play to him for trying the double...He needs to win the Giro imo....as can't see him wining the Tour....not with those parcours

Gota say so far the Giro is full of prospects ....Landa , Quintana, SK, Mollema and Pinot on the long climbs ..Chaves , maybe a Yates twin ...and then there is Nibali and Aru ...if in form they could be one of the winners
TJ, G, and Rolland .....there are so many combinations
HelloDolly
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Re:

24 Jan 2017 12:57

HelloDolly wrote:Nairo Quintana seems like a nice quy and he can realy realy climb but he must be one of the most boring riders in the peloton.....there he just riding along ...

But fair play to him for trying the double...He needs to win the Giro imo....as can't see him wining the Tour....not with those parcours

Gota say so far the Giro is full of prospects ....Landa , Quintana, SK, Mollema and Pinot on the long climbs ..Chaves , maybe a Yates twin ...and then there is Nibali and Aru ...if in form they could be one of the winners
TJ, G, and Rolland .....there are so many combinations


are you joking, right?
User avatar Guybrush
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24 Jan 2017 15:04

Quintana ain't no new Pantani. He ain't no Levi Leipheimer either. Sometimes I wonder what overconfident expectations some fans carry around. Maybe better watch some vintage cycling tapes from the 90s instead then!?
User avatar staubsauger
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Re: Re:

24 Jan 2017 15:17

Guybrush wrote:
HelloDolly wrote:Nairo Quintana seems like a nice quy and he can realy realy climb but he must be one of the most boring riders in the peloton.....there he just riding along ...

But fair play to him for trying the double...He needs to win the Giro imo....as can't see him wining the Tour....not with those parcours

Gota say so far the Giro is full of prospects ....Landa , Quintana, SK, Mollema and Pinot on the long climbs ..Chaves , maybe a Yates twin ...and then there is Nibali and Aru ...if in form they could be one of the winners
TJ, G, and Rolland .....there are so many combinations


are you joking, right?

People are still livid with his Tour performances apparently, thus they aren't seeing things objectively. Just my two cents. However, that'd be weird to me, because in 2015 he did attack and in last years edition it was quite evident he wasn't himself and was racing at his limits in every single mountain stage. He ain't no man for all-or-nothing like Conador. Not yet, at least.

Is he a boring personality? Probably. I don't know him, but his interviews don't speak ''animado'' to me. Is he a boring rider? Far from. If you look at every single race he did last year, in which he caused havoc in a lot of them, I'd say he's one of the most active ones.
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24 Jan 2017 15:23

I'm not saying it wasn't smart or the right thing to do, but my impression last spring was a very conservative riding style.
Goodbye, Tommeke; thank you for all you have given us!
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24 Jan 2017 15:36

He basically did the only thing possible in Catalunya, there was only 1 stage for him to win the race and he did just that. It wasn't super aggressive or what have you, but it was superb tactically how he managed Contador.

In Pais Vasco he was relatively bad compared to AC and lost. Not much he could have done to alter the result when he wasn't ready to sacrifice himself and/or his season like he did into Morzine in 2012 or in Pais Vasco in 2013. Besides, he was on the limit every time it got serious, especially the stage to Arrate.

In Romandie he just was the best and didn't need to attack more than just one time which, to his defence, he started himself. Not much point in attacking when you are comfortably in the lead and wanna bring your teammate on the podium, no?
"This is the Tour that will determine If I can drink espresso at the Garda lake the rest of my life"
User avatar Valv.Piti
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24 Jan 2017 15:46

I love all these comments about Quintana. The unsaid thing is how people expect him to be somehow better. He has shown he is the 2nd best rider (Froome is #1, no question) but shown a more complete resume. Only a young Contador had something similar and that's a compliment. We all expect nothing but a win at the Tour as a good season for him. Why? because he has NEVER FINISHED LOWER THAN 3rd at the TOUR.

at 22: 1st overall Vuelta a Murcia, 1st overall Route de Sud, 1st at Giro Dell'Emilia
at 23: 1st overall at Pais Vasco (Basque Country), 1st overall at Burgos, 2nd overall at Tour
at 24: 1st overall at Giro, 1st overall at Burgos, 1st overall at San Luis.
at 25: 1st overall at Tirreno-Adriatico, 2nd overall at Tour de France, 4th overall at Vuelta
at 26: 1st overall at Vuelta, 1st overall at Catalunya, 1st overall Romandie, 1st overall at Route du Sud, 3rd overall at Tour.

He has attempted 3 Tour de France. Came in 2nd, 2nd, 3rd. Not counting his mountain or young rider jerseys in any race, mind you.
The comments that he was sick, or not his best, or didn't try, etc...still podiumed. He was weak. Still podiumed. Think about that.
He was sick at the Giro, still won it. He was sick at the Vuelta in 2014. Still was leading it until the crash. And then the 2nd crash took him out. Mountains hadn't even started then... Hate all you want, accept that he has a higher standard than you realize. Only 4 riders in that level. Froome (anything less than 1st is bad). Contador (he is at the tail end of career, no expectations). Nibali (Also needs to win to have a good season). Any other rider. ANY OTHER RIDER that finishes 3rd at the Tour is considered a career event. Think about that.
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24 Jan 2017 15:50

Yeah, its pretty incredible, but unfortunately we have a few ppl who very, very rarely has something positive to say about Quintana.
"This is the Tour that will determine If I can drink espresso at the Garda lake the rest of my life"
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24 Jan 2017 16:23

I think most people have recognize and respect Quintana's tremendous ability. That doesn't automatically have to mean they'll be fans. I think people want to see him more agressive, and in that sense the Vuelta last year was a very positive sign. I also think the Giro of 2014 and the Tour of 2015 rubbed people the wrong way. I know that it did for me.
Kwibus wrote:So much quesions they have. Answers they will never get.
So why questions? If no answers?
-Kwibus, one of the great philosophers of the 21st century
User avatar Red Rick
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Re:

24 Jan 2017 16:26

Red Rick wrote:I think most people have recognize and respect Quintana's tremendous ability. That doesn't automatically have to mean they'll be fans. I think people want to see him more agressive, and in that sense the Vuelta last year was a very positive sign. I also think the Giro of 2014 and the Tour of 2015 rubbed people the wrong way. I know that it did for me.

I can see how certain performances or events may shape your opinion (Like Nibali's car tug did for me).
I also don't expect everyone to be fans, heck, I expect some people will hate him because they are fans of others, like what happens with Froomie right now. I just don't understand how even fans of him expect more. He can retire today and still be considered one of the best of this era IMO.
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24 Jan 2017 16:58

The reason I'm not a fan of Froome is not that he is bad, nor that he doesn't race efficiently (to give an example). I think that is true for the large majority of his non-fans. So perhaps the reason many want more from Quintana has nothing to do with his level nor how efficiently he races. If that is the case, arguments about how good he is and how much sense his riding style makes doesn't matter. At least not if the point of the argument is to convince others.

One of the great appeals of Boonen, Contador and Nibali for me is that when they are on, they take matters in their own hands, they make the race, even dictates it. Their presence is not just noted on the result sheet, it forms the whole race.
Goodbye, Tommeke; thank you for all you have given us!
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Re:

24 Jan 2017 23:48

Netserk wrote:The reason I'm not a fan of Froome is not that he is bad, nor that he doesn't race efficiently (to give an example). I think that is true for the large majority of his non-fans. So perhaps the reason many want more from Quintana has nothing to do with his level nor how efficiently he races. If that is the case, arguments about how good he is and how much sense his riding style makes doesn't matter. At least not if the point of the argument is to convince others.

One of the great appeals of Boonen, Contador and Nibali for me is that when they are on, they take matters in their own hands, they make the race, even dictates it. Their presence is not just noted on the result sheet, it forms the whole race.



Yes exactly ...they make their presence felt

Not so Quintana for me...He is very good no doubt but I cannot rely on him to bring anything like passion to my viewing. Even in the Vuelta 2016 where he won my eyes were only on Contador ....with Froome & Chaves also part of my conscience viewing

But hey his fans will accuse me of hating etc because I saw what alot think
There is no point in being good if you do not bring out the best in the fans

What is that line from the film Gladiator...I was the best not because I won but becasue the crowd loved me ....or some such
HelloDolly
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Re:

25 Jan 2017 00:21

Netserk wrote:The reason I'm not a fan of Froome is not that he is bad, nor that he doesn't race efficiently (to give an example). I think that is true for the large majority of his non-fans. So perhaps the reason many want more from Quintana has nothing to do with his level nor how efficiently he races. If that is the case, arguments about how good he is and how much sense his riding style makes doesn't matter. At least not if the point of the argument is to convince others.

One of the great appeals of Boonen, Contador and Nibali for me is that when they are on, they take matters in their own hands, they make the race, even dictates it. Their presence is not just noted on the result sheet, it forms the whole race.


I'm not sure how much more froome could do to take matters into his own hands or dictate a race. in fact that's what most of his detractors dislike the most. he seizes control of the race and that lessens / ends their hopefuls chances which ruins it (especially the Tour) for them.
honestly if one of your favorites mentioned above could ride like either CF or NQ today (not several years ago) would your view of them change?
cantpedal
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25 Jan 2017 07:05

Froome's team dictates the race. Not so much Froome, certainly not near as much as the three mentioned.

I don't really see yo-yoing as forming a race. Attacking at the bottom of Madeleine in the middle of the stage last year in the Dauphiné was.
Goodbye, Tommeke; thank you for all you have given us!
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25 Jan 2017 11:35

The team presentation is currently live ...and yet again Betancur is absent :rolleyes:
Moviestar
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Re: Re:

25 Jan 2017 13:03

HelloDolly wrote:
Netserk wrote:The reason I'm not a fan of Froome is not that he is bad, nor that he doesn't race efficiently (to give an example). I think that is true for the large majority of his non-fans. So perhaps the reason many want more from Quintana has nothing to do with his level nor how efficiently he races. If that is the case, arguments about how good he is and how much sense his riding style makes doesn't matter. At least not if the point of the argument is to convince others.

One of the great appeals of Boonen, Contador and Nibali for me is that when they are on, they take matters in their own hands, they make the race, even dictates it. Their presence is not just noted on the result sheet, it forms the whole race.



Yes exactly ...they make their presence felt

Not so Quintana for me...He is very good no doubt but I cannot rely on him to bring anything like passion to my viewing. Even in the Vuelta 2016 where he won my eyes were only on Contador ....with Froome & Chaves also part of my conscience viewing

But hey his fans will accuse me of hating etc because I saw what alot think
There is no point in being good if you do not bring out the best in the fans

What is that line from the film Gladiator...I was the best not because I won but becasue the crowd loved me ....or some such


dislike is absolutely acceptable, but you said "one of the most boring riders in the peloton". i'm sorry, no disrespect intended, but that was a stupid and make no sense.
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25 Jan 2017 13:50

Will valverde race ruta del sol?
portugal11
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25 Jan 2017 15:48

It's planned Ruta del Sol in Valverde's calendar, yes.
GambadiLegno
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