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U23 races and talents

A place to discuss all things related to current professional road races. Here, you can also touch on the latest news relating to professional road racing. A doping discussion free forum.

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12 Jun 2018 19:50

A couple of points (sorry in advance for the long post ;) ):

1. Williams has been good in the GC races so far, but honestly I fear he may not even be picked by the British National Team for l'Avenir, what with him riding abroad and not being anything to do with British Cycling. It would be a shame, but with Isard wins and any sort of top 5 GC here (which for now it looks like it will be the least he can get here), he should be fine for a pro deal of some sort, even if he isn't picked for the remaining races by GB. With regards to him being the only name here to be close in l'Avenir, I think Barta and Almeida can be there, although it depends how much HBA uses them in the upcoming US stage races. Barta will work for McNulty, but I think both can maybe top ten in France. All depends on freshness/form/team orders.

2. I think Zinoniev was referring more the current class of Colombians being considered mediocre, rather than the Giro field, although DNP is correct that the field is not exactly amazing in terms of GC contenders (filled with a lot of 1998/1999 guys or the 1996 riders looking for one last show to secure a pro deal).

3. Imo (and I have previously admitted to knowing little about the racing scene in South America, so this is really just an opinion, no facts) this 6 man Colombian team is probably considered mediocre by their standards. 3 riders are in their final year as U23, so should be stronger. Rubio and Osorio are young (1998) and will hopefully stay one more season U23 to develop. They could be nice pros. But I feel reading a lot of posts on this thread that this class contains no superstars. Would Pantano/Darwin be a comp for someone like Rubio or Osorio?

4. The Colombian tactics confused me a little today. Cristian Munoz, who a lot of people in the know on this forum said would be the team's best GC bet pre-race, infiltrated the day's break. Rubio and two others caught him on final climb, and then Williams. He finished still finished 4th. Despite moving up to 4th overall from 7th, he actually is one second further back on Pink than he was at the start of the day. He clearly had good legs, so why not have left him in the bunch to try and track Williams, and send Rubio or Dani Munoz in the break? Both were high on GC (not as high as Cristian was, admittedly) but were probably not as strong as Cris was. Now, the team has lost Osorio's jersey, and Dani Munoz has lost almost 1min to Williams. Osorio looked to struggle today and is 13 secs down, Cristian is 24 down and despite winning, Rubio is 36secs down. None of these guys are by any means out of the race, but why did they try and almost attempt a coup from Cristian on their own Pink Jersey, when they could maybe have stayed calm in the bunch and tried to follow Williams, or maybe even repeat the 1-2 of the previous day's climb? plus, despite gaining time on some GC contenders (and for sure they spent less energy than Cristian did today), the only names they really shook overall were Covi and Wildauer, who were not really major GC threats anyway. I don't think they are worse off overall than they were at the start of this stage, but for all that effort, I do not think they are better off either. Would love to hear some opinions on this.
JoeD1997
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Re:

12 Jun 2018 22:31

JoeD1997 wrote:A couple of points (sorry in advance for the long post ;) ):

1. Williams has been good in the GC races so far, but honestly I fear he may not even be picked by the British National Team for l'Avenir, what with him riding abroad and not being anything to do with British Cycling.

I don't think that will be a problem. A lot of riders who have done TdlA with GB recently haven't formally been with British Cycling. They don't have the Academy that they did back in Cavendish/Thomas's day.
Parker
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13 Jun 2018 12:48

Wtf is happening
User avatar DNP-Old
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13 Jun 2018 13:35

Just tell us.
User avatar SafeBet
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13 Jun 2018 13:38

Seems like there is no control whatsoever. Different guys disappear up the road every day and win by minutes.
Zinoviev Letter
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13 Jun 2018 17:17

Love this anarchy.
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13 Jun 2018 18:07

STAGE:
1. Sean Bennet (Axeon) 2:32:52
2. Rob Stannard (Mitchelton) +s.t
3. Mark Donovan (Wiggins) +1
4. Alejandro Osorio (Colombia) +4
5 The Bunch +2:25

NEW GC:
1. Osorio
2. Donovan +39
3. Stevie Williams (SEG) +2:14
4. Yuriy Natarov (Astana) +2:37
5. Crisitan Munoz (Colombia) +2:38
JoeD1997
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13 Jun 2018 18:12

Doubt that GC is right - Stannard who was down by 3m and 50s took 2m and 25s on the bunch today.
yaco
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Re:

13 Jun 2018 18:22

yaco wrote:Doubt that GC is right - Stannard who was down by 3m and 50s took 2m and 25s on the bunch today.


I had the same thought, was just reposting what the organisers put on their Twitter page :)
JoeD1997
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13 Jun 2018 19:35

JoeD1997 wrote:
4. The Colombian tactics confused me a little today. Cristian Munoz, who a lot of people in the know on this forum said would be the team's best GC bet pre-race, infiltrated the day's break. Rubio and two others caught him on final climb, and then Williams.
The DS is Jaramillo and he knows jack $hit about tactics.
Osorio is in pink now.... Don't be surprised if Millo sends some guys on the BOD tomorrow
User avatar slosada
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13 Jun 2018 19:39

SafeBet wrote:Just tell us.

Wish I could, but I wasn't home and had no computer within reach unfortunately. :D No idea how SEG allowed this, but they raced like madmen today. 48 km/h average, insane. What Alej Osorio is doing here is great, it's his first race in Europe. Good to see him back on top after somewhat going off the radar in 2017, although it must be said he was a first year U23 that year.
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13 Jun 2018 21:01

I don’t think there’s much any team can do to control the race if there are significant obstacles on the stage. With a vast number of teams and small squads there’s always people trying to get away and not enough horsepower to keep them all in line. Particularly as the teams at age group level tend to have a big gap between their best and worst riders. It takes a coalition of teams to control the race and coalitions don’t seem to be forming.
Zinoviev Letter
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14 Jun 2018 13:24

Wow, new maglia rosa yet again. Crazy race.
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14 Jun 2018 15:46

Monte Grappa tomorrow?! Should be fun!

BTW My CQ game unique pick Will Barta is slowly climbing the latter and is sitting 6th on the GC and is not too far from the podium.
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14 Jun 2018 16:37

Barta and Stannard are creeping up the top ten, and if they hold onto tomorrow, then they'll both get a good position in GC because they are decent TT'ers.
yaco
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14 Jun 2018 19:34

I feel sorry for Cristian Munoz. I think his team messed up sending him in the break to Folgarida, I think he'd have had a better shot trying to follow Williams that day and would have been closer to the GC lead heading into today's stage for sure. Now, more understandably, he had to drop back to pace Osorio (Munoz's body language suggested he was struggling also, but I think he was on a better day than Osorio). Given he is 22 and a final year U23, he probably wanted better than 9th overall, behind a rider like Ries who has been quietly consistent, but not as good this race as Munoz has been. Even if he couldn't stay today with Almeida and co and finished with Ries, he would still be 5th overall. I do feel for him, although I understand he had to pace Osorio.
JoeD1997
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14 Jun 2018 23:21

yaco wrote:Barta and Stannard are creeping up the top ten, and if they hold onto tomorrow, then they'll both get a good position in GC because they are decent TT'ers.


You are correct about their TT skills, however, I think the TT is too short to make a real impact.

Well, there is still the big Monte Grapppa stage that can completely change the GC before the TT.
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Re:

15 Jun 2018 08:59

JoeD1997 wrote:I feel sorry for Cristian Munoz. I think his team messed up sending him in the break to Folgarida, I think he'd have had a better shot trying to follow Williams that day and would have been closer to the GC lead heading into today's stage for sure. Now, more understandably, he had to drop back to pace Osorio (Munoz's body language suggested he was struggling also, but I think he was on a better day than Osorio). Given he is 22 and a final year U23, he probably wanted better than 9th overall, behind a rider like Ries who has been quietly consistent, but not as good this race as Munoz has been. Even if he couldn't stay today with Almeida and co and finished with Ries, he would still be 5th overall. I do feel for him, although I understand he had to pace Osorio.

According to Lizarte's account, the Colombian team chased the BoD like madmen and burned themselves.
http://www.equipolizarte.com/es/actualidad/moreno-se-luce-en-pian-delle-fugazze/id/1339
Ocurre que hoy jueves, meta en Pian delle Fugazze previo paso por un recorrido accidentado, probablemente se sobreestimó queriendo controlar de cabo a rabo. Situó con sus cinco corredores en cabeza del pelotón y acabó carbonizándolos. Así, Alejandro Osorio cedió tiempo y con ello la ‘maglia rosa’ que había recuperado en la víspera con una exhibición rodadora.
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15 Jun 2018 12:36

If this race isn't televised next year ima be real mad. Another insane stage and another Colombia domination. :D 1. Muñoz, 2. Rubio. It looks like Osorio is reclaiming his jersey as well.
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15 Jun 2018 14:50

And we'll have a crazy ITT with the rabbit chasing the hare - Expect more shuffling of the top 10.
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