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2017 Giro d'Italia: Stage-by-stage Analysis

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11 May 2017 20:30

I'm all for honouring Scarponi, but what's the sense of doubling up the points?

Usually the Cima Coppi have double points because it's the hardest climb of the Giro (usually), that Mortirolo isn't even the harder side of that mountain. Afaik, the Tour have that special honors (like Souvenir Henri Degrange) where the points are normal and there is a financial bonus. That was the right thing to do IMO.
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Re:

11 May 2017 20:46

Ricco' wrote:I'm all for honouring Scarponi, but what's the sense of doubling up the points?

Usually the Cima Coppi have double points because it's the hardest climb of the Giro (usually), that Mortirolo isn't even the harder side of that mountain. Afaik, the Tour have that special honors (like Souvenir Henri Degrange) where the points are normal and there is a financial bonus. That was the right thing to do IMO.

Yes, that would have been a better option.
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12 May 2017 02:56

Tour de Boredom.
offbyone
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Re:

12 May 2017 06:52

Ricco' wrote:I'm all for honouring Scarponi, but what's the sense of doubling up the points?

Usually the Cima Coppi have double points because it's the hardest climb of the Giro (usually)


Cima Coppi is not the hardest climb of the Giro, but the climb that reaches the maximum altitude of all Giro.

The hardest climb is usually called "montagna Pantani" but I don't think it gives double points.
I also don't know if this year there is a montagna Pantani or not....
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Re: Re:

12 May 2017 09:22

Tour de Berghem wrote:
Ricco' wrote:I'm all for honouring Scarponi, but what's the sense of doubling up the points?

Usually the Cima Coppi have double points because it's the hardest climb of the Giro (usually)


Cima Coppi is not the hardest climb of the Giro, but the climb that reaches the maximum altitude of all Giro.

The hardest climb is usually called "montagna Pantani" but I don't think it gives double points.
I also don't know if this year there is a montagna Pantani or not....


This year it's Oropa, so it's not the most difficult too.
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12 May 2017 09:25

Is Oropa even a climb?
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Re:

12 May 2017 09:29

Valv.Piti wrote:Is Oropa even a climb?


Was your statement a joke? :lol:

Image
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12 May 2017 09:30

Yes it was. All I meant was it was a pretty underwhelming one (that they use too much....).
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Re: 2017 Giro d'Italia: Stage-by-stage Analysis

12 May 2017 09:45

Can anyone explain how many points riders get on different climbs? I've found different sides all writing about a different point awarding systems and most also say that the points on the Cima Coppi aren't twice as much points as on usual 1st category climbs but only a few points more. I'm completely confused
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Re: 2017 Giro d'Italia: Stage-by-stage Analysis

12 May 2017 09:57

Gigs_98 wrote:Can anyone explain how many points riders get on different climbs? I've found different sides all writing about a different point awarding systems and most also say that the points on the Cima Coppi aren't twice as much points as on usual 1st category climbs but only a few points more. I'm completely confused



If you scroll the page of the link below you can find the table with points
http://cyclingpro.net/spaziociclismo/giro-2017/regolamento-giro-ditalia-2017/
Last edited by Tour de Berghem on 12 May 2017 09:58, edited 1 time in total.
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12 May 2017 09:58

All point rules of the Giro are described very thorougly here:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/100th-giro-ditalia-classifications-demystified/

However, I think that feature was made before the announcement of the Mortirolo/Scarponi linkage, so it states Mortirolo as a regular category 1 climb.
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12 May 2017 15:03

This first week has been brutally dull. How do they manage to avoid all the hills in these areas?
blackcat wrote:you must respect the Cobra, a man who can give himself his own nickname. he trancends hubris.
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Re:

12 May 2017 15:43

luckyboy wrote:This first week has been brutally dull. How do they manage to avoid all the hills in these areas?

In fairness, they didn't, but it's still been ridiculously dull. Stage 2 and 6 should've been for puncheurs and something should've happened. Tomorrow likely to be the same unfortunately.
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13 May 2017 06:20

Tour de Boredom continues.
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15 May 2017 12:33

Stelvio from Prato is often described as the hardest climb in cycling, at least by some, but where does the Stelvio from Santa Maria I'm Müstair rank, the final climb on stage 16 cut short of the remaining 3 kilometres? Same altitude at 16,4 km @ 8,4% is really no joke either. Obviously the Rettenbachferner is tougher than that, but really not by that much and Stelvio from Prato early slopes aren't that demanding.
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Re:

15 May 2017 12:42

Valv.Piti wrote:Stelvio from Prato is often described as the hardest climb in cycling, at least by some, but where does the Stelvio from Santa Maria I'm Müstair rank, the final climb on stage 16 cut short of the remaining 3 kilometres? Same altitude at 16,4 km @ 8,4% is really no joke either. Obviously the Rettenbachferner is tougher than that, but really not by that much and Stelvio from Prato early slopes aren't that demanding.

Aside that I don't think anybody describes the Stelvio as the hardest climb in cycling anymore (maybe it was until the '80s), the side from Prato ends with 14 km at 8.5% (from Trafoi), basically the same gradient as the Swiss side, with 2.5 km less, but to which you have to add the 10 km at 6% (from Prato to Trafoi) at the bottom.
In my opinion 10 km at 6% >> 2.5 km at 8.5%, so the Prato side is definitely harder. Obviously that doesn't mean the Swiss side is easy by any means...
A race that doesn't give an attacker the chance to finish it off alone is not a race anymore.


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15 May 2017 12:50

I vaguely remember some conversations in here with respected posters, maybe it was Netserk, ranking Stelvio from Prato harder than Zoncolan, Mortirolo, Rettenbachferne and Angliru..
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15 May 2017 13:07

Anyways, I think Stelvio from Mústair is a fair amount harder than the Stelvio they are climbing in full length this year, I think there is a world of difference between a 7% average and 8,5%.
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15 May 2017 13:14

Well I did write the Umbrail is the hardest climb of that stage, didn't I :p
A race that doesn't give an attacker the chance to finish it off alone is not a race anymore.


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15 May 2017 13:36

Valv.Piti, you have a problem differentiating hardness of climbs. You are putting too much emphasis on the gradient. Length is crucial even if not that steep. That's why Stelvio, Madeleine, PSM, Ventoux are very defying and IHO and sometimes considered harder than the counterparts depending on where you put them.

I forgot another one, Agnello.
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