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A place to discuss all things related to current professional road races. Here, you can also touch on the latest news relating to professional road racing. A doping discussion free forum.

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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 18:00

Netserk wrote:
LaFlorecita wrote:
Netserk wrote:I don't really see why their opinion should matter more than any other. Nor why the gender of opponents should matter.

All jobs are fine to be 'taken away' if no one no longer wants to pay for it...

Well, the main argument is that having podium girls hand out flowers and kisses objectifies women and is disrespectful to them... surely women and especially the podium girls themselves can judge that better? That men are most vocal smells a lot like OTT political correctness.

If it's about how it objectifies the individuals, yes. If it's about women in general, no.


that you dont even know where you stand demonstrates Denmark is a lost cause
Lupi33x
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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 19:25

Lupi33x wrote:
Netserk wrote:
LaFlorecita wrote:
Netserk wrote:I don't really see why their opinion should matter more than any other. Nor why the gender of opponents should matter.

All jobs are fine to be 'taken away' if no one no longer wants to pay for it...

Well, the main argument is that having podium girls hand out flowers and kisses objectifies women and is disrespectful to them... surely women and especially the podium girls themselves can judge that better? That men are most vocal smells a lot like OTT political correctness.

If it's about how it objectifies the individuals, yes. If it's about women in general, no.


that you dont even know where you stand demonstrates Denmark is a lost cause


I know where I stand, and so do others, so we can't be completely lost. :p
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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 21:03

Lupi33x wrote:
Netserk wrote:
LaFlorecita wrote:
Netserk wrote:I don't really see why their opinion should matter more than any other. Nor why the gender of opponents should matter.

All jobs are fine to be 'taken away' if no one no longer wants to pay for it...

Well, the main argument is that having podium girls hand out flowers and kisses objectifies women and is disrespectful to them... surely women and especially the podium girls themselves can judge that better? That men are most vocal smells a lot like OTT political correctness.

If it's about how it objectifies the individuals, yes. If it's about women in general, no.


that you dont even know where you stand demonstrates Denmark is a lost cause

Why don't I know where I stand?
Goodbye, Tommeke; thank you for all you have given us!
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Re: Re:

23 Jul 2017 21:25

Image[/quote]

Thibaut Pinot is irresistible. And way underrated ;) .
When I woke up and saw the yellow jersey that I had left by my bed the night before, I asked myself: "what are you doing in Merckx's bedroom?" I couldn't believe it - Bernard Thevenet
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23 Jul 2017 21:58

I just see no need for them.
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Re: Re:

24 Jul 2017 11:09

RedheadDane wrote:This!
Though not because of the taking away their job bit, I'm sure they have other year-round jobs as well. What bugs me is the fact that a bunch of men acts as if they're "saving" the "girls", when in reality these women are doing this because they want to.
Yes, I'm differentiating between girls and women on purpose. Calling a grown woman a "girl" is basically saying she isn't able to make her own decisions, and needs someone to look after her. Yes, I know they're called Podium Girls, but maybe that's all that needs to change? Simply change the title to Podium Women (and do away with the look like a model bit) and things should be fine.

Also... if someone didn't enjoy it, I'm sure she'd just quit.

Why would you insist though that the ones on the podium have to be women?
It makes little sense.
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Re: Re:

24 Jul 2017 12:26

Valv.Piti wrote:
LaFlorecita wrote:Personally I think the debate is a bit odd because the most vocal opponents of podium girls are men :confused:
These women aren't forced to do it and it seems like they enjoy it, well at least the majority. No one seems to have asked their opinion?
Is it right to take away their job?

Its all political correctness and it sucks. Podium girls like, some love their job. If I was a girl I would die to be a podium girl during a Tour, seriously... it sounds like an amazing job. Even if you aren't a cycling fan I would imagine its pretty nice. Certainly one of the best summer jobs around.

Brian Holm is totally right


Well if you hold this opinion then what's the problem with having podium men? You both say the women are happy doing this wonderful job then what's the problem having men also doing it in the same races? Personally I think it's tacky to have either but as long as we have it then what's the issue have both sexes doing it.
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Re: Re:

24 Jul 2017 12:27

Jagartrott wrote:
RedheadDane wrote:This!
Though not because of the taking away their job bit, I'm sure they have other year-round jobs as well. What bugs me is the fact that a bunch of men acts as if they're "saving" the "girls", when in reality these women are doing this because they want to.
Yes, I'm differentiating between girls and women on purpose. Calling a grown woman a "girl" is basically saying she isn't able to make her own decisions, and needs someone to look after her. Yes, I know they're called Podium Girls, but maybe that's all that needs to change? Simply change the title to Podium Women (and do away with the look like a model bit) and things should be fine.

Also... if someone didn't enjoy it, I'm sure she'd just quit.

Why would you insist though that the ones on the podium have to be women?
It makes little sense.


You've got a point there; it does make little sense they're women. However, it's not something I'm insisting, it's just the way things are, and I just don't see any issue with that in terms of it being objectification of women. Suppose the issue here isn't prejudice towards women, but prejudice towards the idea of men kissing men, or women kissing women, since it seems more an more women's races have begun using "podium guys".
Maybe... maybe the focus shouldn't be so much on the kissing part, but more on the fact that the "Podium People" are models representing the brands sponsoring the various jerseys.
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26 Jul 2017 18:28

Claudia Cretti woke up from her coma, she seems to have no lasting brain damage from the crash in the 7th stage in the Giro Rosa
Every cyclists wants to look first-string, bar Bauke Mollema. He doesn't give a **** <-> Thijs Zonneveld
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Re:

26 Jul 2017 18:40

GenericBoonenFan wrote:Claudia Cretti woke up from her coma, she seems to have no lasting brain damage from the crash in the 7th stage in the Giro Rosa


Fantastic
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Re: General News Thread

27 Jul 2017 09:41

Max Rockatansky wrote:Good Lord, the Volta field will be extremely weak this year. 46 yr old Rebellin to challenge the 460 watt trains. It's ridiculous beyond imagination.

http://www.volta-portugal.pt/equipas.php

Don't think I can watch it this year.


Stage profiles from Lasterketa Burua:

Image
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Re: General News Thread

28 Jul 2017 05:50

From all the prologue possibilities in Lisbon, they choose to do Avenida India. :redface:

http://www.procyclingstats.com/race/Volta_a_Portugal_em_Bicicleta_Santander_Totta_2017_Startlist

Just look at this. That's so bad. Must be the worst ever 2.1 startlist in the history of this category.
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28 Jul 2017 05:55

spoke to some guys in sibiu. nobody wants to ride the volta a portugal, that's why the very poor startlist.
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Re:

28 Jul 2017 08:06

jens_attacks wrote:spoke to some guys in sibiu. nobody wants to ride the volta a portugal, that's why the very poor startlist.

Why don't they want to though? Because of the Portugese motorbikes?
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28 Jul 2017 11:45

RedheadDane wrote:Dunno if this counts.
Tosatto joins sky, as a DS.


(from the transfers thread)
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28 Jul 2017 22:00

Tour Cycliste International de la Guadeloupe (2.2) Prologue Pointe a Pitre › Pointe a Pitre
Race/stage cancelled.
Prologue cancelled due to insults against women UCI commissaire

Now, how is the podium miss situation out there?
Every cyclists wants to look first-string, bar Bauke Mollema. He doesn't give a **** <-> Thijs Zonneveld
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Re: Re:

28 Jul 2017 23:35

DNP-Old wrote:
jens_attacks wrote:spoke to some guys in sibiu. nobody wants to ride the volta a portugal, that's why the very poor startlist.

Why don't they want to though? Because of the Portugese motorbikes?

It's a .1 race, so not a massive amount of UCI points to be had, you can race a couple of short stage races and a one day race in that time, each worth the same, because the race is 11 days long. So the choice for many estrangeiros is, take on nearly two weeks of being battered mercilessly by the domestic motorbikes and picking up scraps in 30-40º heat, or take your chances with races like Burgos (.HC), Ain, Czech Republic, Limousin, many of which you might stand more chance of getting a win in, and are worth no fewer points. I understand it, but I think it's as much the fault of the UCI points system as it is the Volta, though the obvious trails of destruction wrought by the August machines don't exactly help it look like an inviting race to outsider teams.
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Re: Re:

29 Jul 2017 01:17

Libertine Seguros wrote:
DNP-Old wrote:
jens_attacks wrote:spoke to some guys in sibiu. nobody wants to ride the volta a portugal, that's why the very poor startlist.

Why don't they want to though? Because of the Portugese motorbikes?

It's a .1 race, so not a massive amount of UCI points to be had, you can race a couple of short stage races and a one day race in that time, each worth the same, because the race is 11 days long. So the choice for many estrangeiros is, take on nearly two weeks of being battered mercilessly by the domestic motorbikes and picking up scraps in 30-40º heat, or take your chances with races like Burgos (.HC), Ain, Czech Republic, Limousin, many of which you might stand more chance of getting a win in, and are worth no fewer points. I understand it, but I think it's as much the fault of the UCI points system as it is the Volta, though the obvious trails of destruction wrought by the August machines don't exactly help it look like an inviting race to outsider teams.


I hope next year Froome aims for the Giro-Tour-Volta treble. On a serious note, name some non-Portuguese(/based) cyclists you believe would genuinely win the Volta. Would it take someone as big as Kwiatkowski or realistically would it only require someone like Talansky?
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Re: Re:

29 Jul 2017 01:47

TMP402 wrote:
Libertine Seguros wrote:
DNP-Old wrote:
jens_attacks wrote:spoke to some guys in sibiu. nobody wants to ride the volta a portugal, that's why the very poor startlist.

Why don't they want to though? Because of the Portugese motorbikes?

It's a .1 race, so not a massive amount of UCI points to be had, you can race a couple of short stage races and a one day race in that time, each worth the same, because the race is 11 days long. So the choice for many estrangeiros is, take on nearly two weeks of being battered mercilessly by the domestic motorbikes and picking up scraps in 30-40º heat, or take your chances with races like Burgos (.HC), Ain, Czech Republic, Limousin, many of which you might stand more chance of getting a win in, and are worth no fewer points. I understand it, but I think it's as much the fault of the UCI points system as it is the Volta, though the obvious trails of destruction wrought by the August machines don't exactly help it look like an inviting race to outsider teams.


I hope next year Froome aims for the Giro-Tour-Volta treble. On a serious note, name some non-Portuguese(/based) cyclists you believe would genuinely win the Volta. Would it take someone as big as Kwiatkowski or realistically would it only require someone like Talansky?


Talansky would lose the Volta, no doubt about that.

Heck, even Lampre, who came in 2009 with all guns blazing (Cunego, 2xtime MTF winner a few weeks later at the Vuelta; Tiralongo, 8th in that Vuelta; Santambrogio, winner of Tre Valli Varesine a couple of days later), couldn't do more than 11th at the GC (with Tiralongo) and a couple of podium stage finishes.
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30 Jul 2017 10:42

To be fair though, 2009 was one of the last super power Voltas, a year after the LA-MSS scandal and with the final year of Liberty, plus Cândido still going strong. A couple of years later they were winning stages with Gavazzi with little trouble.

Caja Rural have taken three stagiares from their amateur team - Gonzalo Serrano (22), Óscar Pelegrí (23) and Manuel Sola (25). The former two have had strong seasons, Sola's been flitting between Continental Pro and amateur for a while. The team obviously think it's too soon for a couple of their standout espoirs, Xavier Cañellas being just 20 makes some sense, but surprised to see Serrano and Sola given the call ahead of Mauri Moreira and Álvaro Cuadros.

Interestingly, one of the most noteworthy Spanish prospects, Fernando Barceló, who came out of the Specialized Fundación Contador team and is presently riding with the Fundación Euskadi but is from Aragón, and who managed to show his potential riding for the national team in the Vuelta a Asturias where he was 3rd on the Alto del Acebo, beaten only by Nairo Quintana and a nuclear form Raúl Alarcón, is to also be a stagiare, but as both Movistar (who seldom take on stagiares anyway) and Caja Rural tend to be inward-looking for their own amateurs, he will be riding with Cofidis who of course have significant sponsor interest in Spain.
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