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Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

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Re: Re:

21 Apr 2017 00:31

Publicus wrote:
movingtarget wrote:
Irondan wrote:Does anyone think that Tinkov could be using reverse psychology on Alberto?

Tinkov knows that he's going to get under Alberto's skin with what he's saying, maybe he's doing it as an extra motivator? The best way for Alberto to respond to Tinkov is to win the Tour, maybe Tinkov knows that what he's saying will light a fire with Alberto to give him that extra 1% he needs to go from 2nd place finishes to 1st place?

I don't really know if this theory holds water, it was just a thought.... :confused:


I was thinking myself that Contador will take the extra motivation but a rider like Contador never needs motivation from others. If he has another Tour off the podium expect Tinkov to be all over Twitter saying I told you so.


I don't know. He seems to perform when he has external motivators driving him:

2009 TdF---> Armstrong drama
2011 Giro---> Clembuterol positive
2014 --------> Complete embarrassment by Froome at 2013 Tour de France
2016---------> ???

I don't think Tinkov rates, but perhaps what he's saying echoes what others are whispering about Contador. That time has moved on from him. That he can't win. That would add the necessary motivation....


Well all of his fans better start attacking him on Twitter ! In 2014 he was already in great form same in 2009. I just don't think champions need extra motivation it's already inbuilt. Part of their character. I would hate to think that Contador was relying on criticism from the likes of Tinkov to bring out the best in himself.
movingtarget
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Re: Re:

21 Apr 2017 08:11

movingtarget wrote:
Publicus wrote:
movingtarget wrote:
Irondan wrote:Does anyone think that Tinkov could be using reverse psychology on Alberto?

Tinkov knows that he's going to get under Alberto's skin with what he's saying, maybe he's doing it as an extra motivator? The best way for Alberto to respond to Tinkov is to win the Tour, maybe Tinkov knows that what he's saying will light a fire with Alberto to give him that extra 1% he needs to go from 2nd place finishes to 1st place?

I don't really know if this theory holds water, it was just a thought.... :confused:


I was thinking myself that Contador will take the extra motivation but a rider like Contador never needs motivation from others. If he has another Tour off the podium expect Tinkov to be all over Twitter saying I told you so.


I don't know. He seems to perform when he has external motivators driving him:

2009 TdF---> Armstrong drama
2011 Giro---> Clembuterol positive
2014 --------> Complete embarrassment by Froome at 2013 Tour de France
2016---------> ???

I don't think Tinkov rates, but perhaps what he's saying echoes what others are whispering about Contador. That time has moved on from him. That he can't win. That would add the necessary motivation....


Well all of his fans better start attacking him on Twitter ! In 2014 he was already in great form same in 2009. I just don't think champions need extra motivation it's already inbuilt. Part of their character. I would hate to think that Contador was relying on criticism from the likes of Tinkov to bring out the best in himself.


Champions probably are the human beings who are the most driven by external motivation. Something extraordinary that has triggered them to become the champions who they are. But... you cannot win year after year after year simply doing the same thing all over again.

You 'haven't seen the Usain Bolt documentary I guess. He struggled all the way during his prep for the 2016 Olympics finding the right motivation, until he saw footage of Justin Gatlin who seemed already celebrating his almost certain gold medal. At that point Bolt said to himself: oh that's not going to happen...
Pennino
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21 Apr 2017 11:12

Maybe it all stems from that time Oleg suggested a wife swap to the riders and Bert got Mrs Tinkov and said he was too busy training ...just a thought ...only snub I can see that is plusabile :lol:
HelloDolly
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21 Apr 2017 11:24

The truth is Contador has no weider a personality than Quitana or Froome....
They are all driven, narrow focused ( on cycling) individuals and the niceties of hanging out with the boss and chewing the cud is not part of their program

It is obvious Contador did not worship at the alter that is Tinkov and Tinkov is pi**ed at this and is now going to keep slagging him off ....
Nothing to do with wining I think...this is personal .

Contador strikes me as a shy (in social situations) introvert who would prefer to hang out with his dog ...
He is also very controling ( which most top champions are) and I think ( no proof) maybe brings anxiety to races that are no going well and puts too much pressure on himself and thus the team
It is obvious that he maybe has self exteem issues as prefers to surround himself with lesser riders who are loyal and grateful than command the stronger riders to his bidding...I would also say there are communication issues

People who know him well seem to really like him while those who are kept at arms length are wary

For his sake he needs to communicate more with peer riders, spent time with them and not away by himelf and build a rapport ....

But does not seem his personality ....and everyone is different
HelloDolly
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Re:

21 Apr 2017 12:00

HelloDolly wrote:The truth is Contador has no weider a personality than Quitana or Froome....
They are all driven, narrow focused ( on cycling) individuals and the niceties of hanging out with the boss and chewing the cud is not part of their program

It is obvious Contador did not worship at the alter that is Tinkov and Tinkov is pi**ed at this and is now going to keep slagging him off ....
Nothing to do with wining I think...this is personal .

Contador strikes me as a shy (in social situations) introvert who would prefer to hang out with his dog ...
He is also very controling ( which most top champions are) and I think ( no proof) maybe brings anxiety to races that are no going well and puts too much pressure on himself and thus the team
It is obvious that he maybe has self exteem issues as prefers to surround himself with lesser riders who are loyal and grateful than command the stronger riders to his bidding...I would also say there are communication issues

People who know him well seem to really like him while those who are kept at arms length are wary

For his sake he needs to communicate more with peer riders, spent time with them and not away by himelf and build a rapport ....

But does not seem his personality ....and everyone is different


100% agree with what you say.
Still from what I've seen Froome is a much better leader than Contador or Quintana. Obviously, the team is always motivated when you're extremely strong and take yellow in the first week but he's really molded himself into a leader who the riders can look up to.
SeriousSam wrote: Peña Cabarga is like Froome's Mount Doom, the place where his great power was forged into fearsome weapon. He was never going to lose here
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Re: Re:

21 Apr 2017 12:06

Pennino wrote:
movingtarget wrote:
Publicus wrote:
movingtarget wrote:
Irondan wrote:Does anyone think that Tinkov could be using reverse psychology on Alberto?

Tinkov knows that he's going to get under Alberto's skin with what he's saying, maybe he's doing it as an extra motivator? The best way for Alberto to respond to Tinkov is to win the Tour, maybe Tinkov knows that what he's saying will light a fire with Alberto to give him that extra 1% he needs to go from 2nd place finishes to 1st place?

I don't really know if this theory holds water, it was just a thought.... :confused:


I was thinking myself that Contador will take the extra motivation but a rider like Contador never needs motivation from others. If he has another Tour off the podium expect Tinkov to be all over Twitter saying I told you so.


I don't know. He seems to perform when he has external motivators driving him:

2009 TdF---> Armstrong drama
2011 Giro---> Clembuterol positive
2014 --------> Complete embarrassment by Froome at 2013 Tour de France
2016---------> ???

I don't think Tinkov rates, but perhaps what he's saying echoes what others are whispering about Contador. That time has moved on from him. That he can't win. That would add the necessary motivation....


Well all of his fans better start attacking him on Twitter ! In 2014 he was already in great form same in 2009. I just don't think champions need extra motivation it's already inbuilt. Part of their character. I would hate to think that Contador was relying on criticism from the likes of Tinkov to bring out the best in himself.


Champions probably are the human beings who are the most driven by external motivation. Something extraordinary that has triggered them to become the champions who they are. But... you cannot win year after year after year simply doing the same thing all over again.

You 'haven't seen the Usain Bolt documentary I guess. He struggled all the way during his prep for the 2016 Olympics finding the right motivation, until he saw footage of Justin Gatlin who seemed already celebrating his almost certain gold medal. At that point Bolt said to himself: oh that's not going to happen...



Contador was doing fine before Armstrong reappeared and Tinkov turned up. I disagree that champions need external motivation. I think it's part of their personality and drive and what made them champions in the first place. They can train harder, put up with pain longer and often just hate being beaten, they have the will to win more than most. And sometimes it's physiology playing a part as well.
movingtarget
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Re: Re:

21 Apr 2017 14:22

movingtarget wrote:
Pennino wrote:
Champions probably are the human beings who are the most driven by external motivation. Something extraordinary that has triggered them to become the champions who they are. But... you cannot win year after year after year simply doing the same thing all over again.

You 'haven't seen the Usain Bolt documentary I guess. He struggled all the way during his prep for the 2016 Olympics finding the right motivation, until he saw footage of Justin Gatlin who seemed already celebrating his almost certain gold medal. At that point Bolt said to himself: oh that's not going to happen...



Contador was doing fine before Armstrong reappeared and Tinkov turned up. I disagree that champions need external motivation. I think it's part of their personality and drive and what made them champions in the first place. They can train harder, put up with pain longer and often just hate being beaten, they have the will to win more than most. And sometimes it's physiology playing a part as well.


That is certainly part of it, but the way you're putting it is way too simple. The preparation they need to do is extraordinary. Not only to be able to compete at top level, but on top of that also being able to beat all the other top level champions, escpecially on those days in which they don't really feel well. Winning is by a large margin decided by psychological factors. Your body is giving you all the signals possible that it's exhausted and nevertheless you're able to find an extra putch. Sometimes you absolutely need external motivation for that.
Pennino
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21 Apr 2017 15:46

Tinkov began his public trashing of Contador after he didn't ride Lombardia last year due to illness. He's still pissed he lost any chance at winning the No1 team spot on the world tour (to achieve that, apparently he wanted or needed Contador to get some kind of top-ish placement in that race). You would have thought he'd have moved on from that by now, but it appears not. Possibly doesn't believe him...
Whatever the case I imagine he was probably pretty exhausted after having just finished racing one-and-a-bit grand tours with continual injury to ride a race he normally doesn't ride.
dusty red roads
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Re:

21 Apr 2017 17:40

HelloDolly wrote:The truth is Contador has no weider a personality than Quitana or Froome....
They are all driven, narrow focused ( on cycling) individuals and the niceties of hanging out with the boss and chewing the cud is not part of their program

It is obvious Contador did not worship at the alter that is Tinkov and Tinkov is pi**ed at this and is now going to keep slagging him off ....
Nothing to do with wining I think...this is personal .

Contador strikes me as a shy (in social situations) introvert who would prefer to hang out with his dog ...
He is also very controling ( which most top champions are) and I think ( no proof) maybe brings anxiety to races that are no going well and puts too much pressure on himself and thus the team
It is obvious that he maybe has self exteem issues as prefers to surround himself with lesser riders who are loyal and grateful than command the stronger riders to his bidding...I would also say there are communication issues

People who know him well seem to really like him while those who are kept at arms length are wary

For his sake he needs to communicate more with peer riders, spent time with them and not away by himelf and build a rapport ....

But does not seem his personality ....and everyone is different

Good post - I think you're spot on... okay, not entirely sure about the wife swap ;)
User avatar LaFlorecita
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Re:

21 Apr 2017 18:42

HelloDolly wrote:The truth is Contador has no weider a personality than Quitana or Froome....
They are all driven, narrow focused ( on cycling) individuals and the niceties of hanging out with the boss and chewing the cud is not part of their program

It is obvious Contador did not worship at the alter that is Tinkov and Tinkov is pi**ed at this and is now going to keep slagging him off ....
Nothing to do with wining I think...this is personal .

Contador strikes me as a shy (in social situations) introvert who would prefer to hang out with his dog ...
He is also very controling ( which most top champions are) and I think ( no proof) maybe brings anxiety to races that are no going well and puts too much pressure on himself and thus the team
It is obvious that he maybe has self exteem issues as prefers to surround himself with lesser riders who are loyal and grateful than command the stronger riders to his bidding...I would also say there are communication issues

People who know him well seem to really like him while those who are kept at arms length are wary

For his sake he needs to communicate more with peer riders, spent time with them and not away by himelf and build a rapport ....

But does not seem his personality ....and everyone is different


I do think likewise, but like you also mention all the time....it's what we think. From analysing what we get to see and hear from Alberto it certainly seems very likely.
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21 Apr 2017 19:01

We usually like to simplify the way we look at public persons, and classify them in ways that we can to put them into boxes. We all like to focus on the stuff we love and ignore the stuff we don't like about athletes we adore and do vice versa on athletes we don't like.
Kwibus wrote:So much quesions they have. Answers they will never get.
So why questions? If no answers?
-Kwibus, one of the great philosophers of the 21st century
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Re: Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

21 Apr 2017 20:10

From an inside source (ex-pro Baden Cooke) from his cyclingnews Cycling Dream Team:

"Alberto was someone who really impressed me immensely. In team meetings for example, he would really take charge and go around the room, pointing out to each rider what he was expecting of him, what they did or didn't do right the day before. He really put a lot of pressure on his teammates, but in a good way. He was probably the best leader I've ridden for in the way he conducted himself. He was just a ferocious competitor, never say die and just hard. Despite all his talent, he's just hard. I think he can go to the next level, he's extremely impressive. It certainly makes you go deeper when he's sitting on your wheel and you're drilling it for him. It makes you go that little bit further, that little bit deeper because it's probably going to blow everyone's doors off and put him in a better spot. It's really motivating."

He also mentioned Contador when evaluating his choice of Fabian Cancellara in his Dream Team:
"As leader, Contador rallies the troops more with people buying into it..."
"Contador knows he's ready and his priority is getting everybody else up to his level..."

Edit: Added in the Contador reference from Cooke's evaluation of his choice of Cancellara in his dream team.
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22 Apr 2017 07:53

I take it Aussies count as Southerners for Alberto :p
Goodbye, Tommeke; thank you for all you have given us!
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Re:

22 Apr 2017 14:57

Netserk wrote:I take it Aussies count as Southerners for Alberto :p

It's in the south... :p and many of them live in southern Europe during the season
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24 Apr 2017 19:53

OK, what's going on with Alberto? I cannot even recognize him on this pic !!?

Image

I hope he is not losing too much moivation :eek:
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Re:

24 Apr 2017 20:00

dusty red roads wrote:Tinkov began his public trashing of Contador after he didn't ride Lombardia last year due to illness. He's still pissed he lost any chance at winning the No1 team spot on the world tour (to achieve that, apparently he wanted or needed Contador to get some kind of top-ish placement in that race). You would have thought he'd have moved on from that by now, but it appears not. Possibly doesn't believe him...
Whatever the case I imagine he was probably pretty exhausted after having just finished racing one-and-a-bit grand tours with continual injury to ride a race he normally doesn't ride.

Can't be true, some are saying it was wife swapping gone bad.
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Re: Re:

24 Apr 2017 20:06

rick james wrote:
dusty red roads wrote:Tinkov began his public trashing of Contador after he didn't ride Lombardia last year due to illness. He's still pissed he lost any chance at winning the No1 team spot on the world tour (to achieve that, apparently he wanted or needed Contador to get some kind of top-ish placement in that race). You would have thought he'd have moved on from that by now, but it appears not. Possibly doesn't believe him...
Whatever the case I imagine he was probably pretty exhausted after having just finished racing one-and-a-bit grand tours with continual injury to ride a race he normally doesn't ride.

Can't be true, some are saying it was wife swapping gone bad.


"Some" being the voices in your head? :confused:

Edit: changed "meaning" to "being".
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Re:

24 Apr 2017 20:08

TommyGun wrote:OK, what's going on with Alberto? I cannot even recognize him on this pic !!?

Image

I hope he is not losing too much moivation :eek:

Love that photo :p
I don't think he's getting fat, he's a little more chubby after his break though but this is according to plan. He doesn't want to go into the Tour overtrained. He'll ramp it up later.
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24 Apr 2017 20:08

Big **** Yes for Albeardo
Kwibus wrote:So much quesions they have. Answers they will never get.
So why questions? If no answers?
-Kwibus, one of the great philosophers of the 21st century
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Re: Re:

24 Apr 2017 20:09

rick james wrote:
dusty red roads wrote:Tinkov began his public trashing of Contador after he didn't ride Lombardia last year due to illness. He's still pissed he lost any chance at winning the No1 team spot on the world tour (to achieve that, apparently he wanted or needed Contador to get some kind of top-ish placement in that race). You would have thought he'd have moved on from that by now, but it appears not. Possibly doesn't believe him...
Whatever the case I imagine he was probably pretty exhausted after having just finished racing one-and-a-bit grand tours with continual injury to ride a race he normally doesn't ride.

Can't be true, some are saying it was wife swapping gone bad.

That was a joke I think.
P.S. Tinkov trashed Contador back in 2013 as well
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