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[Green Edge] Shayne Bannan, Gerry Ryan and an Aussie Pro Team for 2012?

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08 Sep 2011 07:24

LukeSchmid wrote:I thought Teklehaymanot was supposed to be the type of rider that could do well in hilly races. It would be a big step up to expect him to doing anything next year but in a year or two perhaps.
As far as climbing goes it appears to be Weening and ...... Weening and did I say Weening.


What about the Japanese rider GE may or may not have signed. Is he any good at hills?

I wonder if Teklehaymanot and the "maybe" Japanese guy have been signed more with a view to a commercial possibilities rather than on performance ability itself. GE have been pretty open about the GE brand, and I can see similarities to Manchester United when they signed thier first Asian player, and courting the Asian market for both sponsorship dollars and fan dollars.

Will we see a set of new "kits" being released each year to maximise commercial activities?

And yes, I'm one of those "football" fans, so I may on occoasion use the term we when refering to GE and/or Australia and the usuage may not be mutually exclusive either at times. :D :p
briztoon
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08 Sep 2011 07:33

briztoon wrote:What about the Japanese rider GE may or may not have signed. Is he any good at hills?

I wonder if Teklehaymanot and the "maybe" Japanese guy have been signed more with a view to a commercial possibilities rather than on performance ability itself. GE have been pretty open about the GE brand, and I can see similarities to Manchester United when they signed thier first Asian player, and courting the Asian market for both sponsorship dollars and fan dollars.

Will we see a set of new "kits" being released each year to maximise commercial activities?

And yes, I'm one of those "football" fans, so I may on occoasion use the term we when refering to GE and/or Australia and the usuage may not be mutually exclusive either at times. :D :p


I wouldn't expect much.

Dan. Teklehaymanot is pretty good i think, adaption to this level will be difficult I suppose. Hope he does well.

As for weening, well if that is the best you have on offer... :o
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08 Sep 2011 07:39

Timmy-loves-Rabo wrote:I wouldn't expect much.

Dan. Teklehaymanot is pretty good i think, adaption to this level will be difficult I suppose. Hope he does well.

As for weening, well if that is the best you have on offer... :o

Yeah, a team where Pieter Weening is the best climber... they'll be like Skil-Shimano in this Vuelta.
theyoungest
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08 Sep 2011 07:40

LukeSchmid wrote:I thought Teklehaymanot was supposed to be the type of rider that could do well in hilly races. It would be a big step up to expect him to doing anything next year but in a year or two perhaps.
As far as climbing goes it appears to be Weening and ...... Weening and did I say Weening.


Well, it's next year that is the problem right now. Teklehaimanot won't be a force in the hilly races right away in his first year in the WT and whether he can develop in a year or two is irrelevant since they would have the chance to recruit more riders for 2013 anyway unless they plan on sticking with the idea of only having sprinter and ITT rouler types in the future as well.
ingsve: Winner of the 2011 CQ Ranking Manager Game.

“A new scientific truth does not triumph by convincing its opponents and making them see the light, but rather because its opponents eventually die, and a new generation grows up that is familiar with it” - Max Planck
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08 Sep 2011 07:44

briztoon wrote:What are the real expectations for the team as it's currently constructed next year? What one day Classics, one week Tours, etc, does GE have a legit
shot at next season.

OK, can some one explain to me what a Neo-Pro is?


The team is based around sprinting and classics and perhaps flatter stage races where you don't have to be a climber to win them.
They must be targetting the Tour Down Under and with this years winner in the team Cameron Meyer and others should be a very good chance at winning that.
Goss will be looking at winning Milan-San Remo again.
Langeveld finished 5th in the Tour of Flanders so will surely be targetting that but might also be able to pick up a win in the other cobbled races. O'Grady and probably Cooke will be looking to do well in cobbled races especially Paris Roubaix but I think a win is beyond them.
Goss will be the chance of success in GT in sprint stages and will probably pick up some sprint wins throughout the season. Leigh Howard I think can get some descent results but will be focusing on the track for the Olympics I guess.
They have a number of TTers so will probably go near to winning a TT somewhere and perhaps a TTT somewhere.
Weening will probably try and go for GC in smaller stage races and stage hunting in GTs.
Gerrans won the Tour of Denmark so will probably target that again and he can do well in Ardennes and stage hunt in GTs.
Albasini has won a number of smaller stage races so will probably be leader in some of them as well as stage hunting in GTs.
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08 Sep 2011 07:48

[quote="briztoon"][/QUOTE]

Off the top of my head, Avanti sponsor PureBlackRacing which is a team out of New Zealand that has WorldTour hopes by 2015.

Neo Pro is the first Professional year of a riders career at the highest level. Teams are mandated to have 2 on their roster (I think?)
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08 Sep 2011 07:50

LukeSchmid wrote:The team is based around sprinting and classics and perhaps flatter stage races where you don't have to be a climber to win them.
They must be targetting the Tour Down Under and with this years winner in the team Cameron Meyer and others should be a very good chance at winning that.
Goss will be looking at winning Milan-San Remo again.
Langeveld finished 5th in the Tour of Flanders so will surely be targetting that but might also be able to pick up a win in the other cobbled races. O'Grady and probably Cooke will be looking to do well in cobbled races especially Paris Roubaix but I think a win is beyond them.
Goss will be the chance of success in GT in sprint stages and will probably pick up some sprint wins throughout the season. Leigh Howard I think can get some descent results but will be focusing on the track for the Olympics I guess.
They have a number of TTers so will probably go near to winning a TT somewhere and perhaps a TTT somewhere.
Weening will probably try and go for GC in smaller stage races and stage hunting in GTs.
Gerrans won the Tour of Denmark so will probably target that again and he can do well in Ardennes and stage hunt in GTs.
Albasini has won a number of smaller stage races so will probably be leader in some of them as well as stage hunting in GTs.


I would add Eneco Tour as a race they could do well in as well as Vattenfall and probably Plouay. Maybe even Tirreno-Adriatico which sometimes has an easy course with a longish ITT though in recent years it has been much harder than some other years.
ingsve: Winner of the 2011 CQ Ranking Manager Game.

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08 Sep 2011 07:50

ingsve wrote:Well, it's next year that is the problem right now. Teklehaimanot won't be a force in the hilly races right away in his first year in the WT and whether he can develop in a year or two is irrelevant since they would have the chance to recruit more riders for 2013 anyway unless they plan on sticking with the idea of only having sprinter and ITT rouler types in the future as well.


I don't expect Teklehaimanot to do well next year but would not rule him out as showing something very good.
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08 Sep 2011 07:53

ingsve wrote:Well, it's next year that is the problem right now. Teklehaimanot won't be a force in the hilly races right away in his first year in the WT and whether he can develop in a year or two is irrelevant since they would have the chance to recruit more riders for 2013 anyway unless they plan on sticking with the idea of only having sprinter and ITT rouler types in the future as well.


I think the plan will be as some of the older riders retire younger climbers will replace them , Australia have 4-5 decent ( not superstars but can climb or have the potential )young climbers plus an international here and there.

That what I think is the plan for year 2-5 of the team
Alexi Grewal to Hinault stage 14 into Superbagnéres 1986 ´You blew it, Bernie. You f*cked up.´
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08 Sep 2011 07:57

just some guy wrote:I think the plan will be as some of the older riders retire younger climbers will replace them , Australia have 4-5 decent ( not superstars but can climb or have the potential )young climbers plus an international here and there.

That what I think is the plan for year 2-5 of the team


Well, it can't happen soon enough. There is nothing worse than getting another Euskaltel that are forced to ride races they don't have the riders for while other teams with good riders are left on the side line.
ingsve: Winner of the 2011 CQ Ranking Manager Game.

“A new scientific truth does not triumph by convincing its opponents and making them see the light, but rather because its opponents eventually die, and a new generation grows up that is familiar with it” - Max Planck
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08 Sep 2011 08:00

briztoon wrote:This is going to be long and convoluted.

Ok, I'm new to "following" cycling though I've watched the Tour de France on SBS for at least 11 or 12 years. I usually finish work around the time covereage starts on TV so always watched it while winding down at home.

My learning curve about the sport is rather steep. Apart from the TDF and the Olympics I never new anything about the other Tours or Classics, or that they even existed. Heck, I only first heard about the Giro a couple of years ago, and that was while watching the TDF.

If GreenEdge hadn't been mentioned during this years TDF coverage I wouldn't be on here right now. And mutch of my sporting interest in cycling is also because I have taken up riding to get fit and lose some weight since I quit smoking. (side question, why doesn't Avanti sponsor any major teams? Yeah I bought a new 2010 model entry level Avanti road bike as it was damn cheap compared to even 2011 stock and I can't justify to myself spending 1.5k - 2k on a bike yet)

So what are GE's aim at the Australian level? Anyone who has expereince with Australian sporting culture will understand that the average person on the street will have little interest after the answer to thier first question is "No, Cadel is not on the team", and the sporting public will have even less interest if (and when) the team blows in next years TDF.

Apart from League and Aussie Rules fanatics, Aussies don't follow losing teams, and the (small) majorities opinion on this forum seems to be that GE will, well not struggle, but not set the (cycling) world on fire. Unless you're in the same camp as ingsve, in which case GE will most definately blow.

Will SBS expand thier cycling coverage next season? For the sport to grow in Australia, and the GE brand to gain exposure, it really does need extensive local coverage. Personally I'd love to watch any GE teams at any events next year.

How will the Olympics impact on the GE squad next year? Will losing riders to the Olympic program negatively effect the teams ability to secure enough WT/PT (still learning all this stuff) points for the 2013 season and licensing. Will GE's commitment to the Aussie Olympic riders possiby increase our chances at Gold Medals in London next year? If so, is there a conflict of interest here? It has been mentioned already that the Olympics are bigger here in Australia than the Pro Tour, atleast where the average man on the street is concerned.


What are the real expectations for the team as it's currently constructed next year? What one day Classics, one week Tours, etc, does GE have a legit
shot at next season.

OK, can some one explain to me what a Neo-Pro is?


Well as for Avanti not sponsoring any major teams i guess they do not feel the need to.

My understanding of GE's aims is to develop a strong team base and attempt to promote cycling in Australia. Yes they will not have the best team in the next few years but they are aiming to set out strong foundations for what will be in the future a strong team. Not all teams can suddenly burst onto the scene and be successful (such as Leopard although they have not done as well as one would have expected this year). So for now they are setting out to create something the can build to be successful in the long term.

As an Aussie myself i understand that we do not really follow losing teams. However i would hope that most people who take the time to find out a bit more such as yourself may see that a brand new team cannot win everything and will take time to grow. Im sure they will get enough support from Australia anyhow as Cycling is growing at a very fast rate in Australia.

SBS have been expanding their coverage of cycling each year for the last few years. This year they have had daily highlights of every grand tour stage and shown live coverage of 6 Giro stages (i think), the whole tour, 8 Vuelta stages as well as Paris-Roubaix live. Next year i would assume they will continue to expand their coverage. Cadel wining the tour gave SBS huge ratings at the tour (700 000 people for the last 2 stages) which is 4%ish of the country and as it finishes at 2am on a Sunday night in one case that is huge ratings for the tour and knowing the other shows they play most likely their best. This i would expect would mean more races will be shown. They also live stream a number of races online at Cycling central.

The Olympics would undoubtedly impact on GE however management would have known this when signing riders. It may have an affect on their results but i doubt a major one and it will most likely have been factored into the teams plans for next year already. The team may increase chances of medals but not significantly, they only advantage i would see is that the Aussies would be much more used to riding with each other.

I dont think GE will have a strong chance of winning any of the classics next year, just an outside shot. And a neo-pro is a rider who is in his first year as a professional (so generally quite young) an example for this year would be Michael Matthews who has just had his first season as a professional with Rabobank.

Hope this helps :)
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08 Sep 2011 08:31

Its all coming together beautifully. Jerry Jayco is building our dream with his cash, what a great bloke!

Matty Goss for 2 mil a year, a bargain!
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08 Sep 2011 08:36

ingsve wrote:Well, it can't happen soon enough. There is nothing worse than getting another Euskaltel that are forced to ride races they don't have the riders for while other teams with good riders are left on the side line.


I agree but it had to start somewhere Australian cycling strength - to get public onbaord in Australia they had to have name people knew - Evans is out so O´Grady, Robbie even Cooke of the older name plus the new track name who ride road- then move into the more balanced team as time goes.

Goss is the stand out of the team re Australian riders but still with a track background
Alexi Grewal to Hinault stage 14 into Superbagnéres 1986 ´You blew it, Bernie. You f*cked up.´
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08 Sep 2011 08:40

Thanks for the explanations guys.

Marcus135 after watching the TDF for so many years and wishing for an Aussie team, I'll be following GE. However I have a new interest in the sport outside of being an arm chair fan, and reading here at CN has enlightened me to the sport beyond the TDF. I don't think this will be the case with many sporting fans. It's unfortunate that Cadel is nearing the end of his career or atleast genuine chances of making the podium of a GT. Unless some one like Porte steps up straight away, we risk losing the momentum the sport has picked up in the last 2 or 3 years.

My concern for GE is that without a WT licence they won't have sponsorship dollars to keep going and will fold like HTC has. Hence the questions about Gerrys' wealth and backing, and questions about where the points are likely to come from next season.

I agree with ingsve that it will be bad watching GE compete in events where they will suck next season where they are forced to take part because they are a WT team. And it will be worse knowing that a better climbing team may not get an invite. Hopefully GE sign atleast a couple more Euros who can stage hunt in the bigger mountain races and GT's and podium in the smaller races.

I'm definately looking forward to watching Paris-Roubaix, Milan-San Remo, The Eneco Tour, and is it the Ardens? where everyone thinks Gerrans is a pretender? next year. To quote a great Geordie, "I'd love it, just love it..." if Gerrans managed to stick it up all his knockers next year. :eek:

:D
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08 Sep 2011 08:48

All new people to cycling should watch this video- Briz.

A Sunday in Hell
Alexi Grewal to Hinault stage 14 into Superbagnéres 1986 ´You blew it, Bernie. You f*cked up.´
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08 Sep 2011 08:59

just some guy wrote:I agree but it had to start somewhere Australian cycling strength - to get public onbaord in Australia they had to have name people knew - Evans is out so O´Grady, Robbie even Cooke of the older name plus the new track name who ride road- then move into the more balanced team as time goes.

Goss is the stand out of the team re Australian riders but still with a track background


Mmmm I don't know. Stuey and Robbie's time was 6 to 8 years ago in regards to the TDF and that's all that counts in the Aussie publics eye. Though I think O'Grady is an awesome domestic as his career winds down, I don't think the general public will understand such a role. My fear is that there will be some sort of backlash from the Aussie public towards GE when the team doesn't perform to the Aussie publics expectations.

This is where SBS could be so important leading up to the TDF. They could do a program of the development of GE, the involvement of Gerry Ryan and Shayne Bannan, what the team has done during the season to date, what events have they won (if any) and what the expectations are for the TDF. Who to follow, eg, Goss in the sprints at the end of a flat stage, Gerrans, Albasini and Weening getting in break aways and stage hunting in the Pyrenees and Alps. The role of O'Grady as team leader on the road, young riders coming through on the team, etc. It would also be great if the team could win the TTT, (is there a TTT in next years TDF?) if they could manage this, I would consider the TDF a success for GE.
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08 Sep 2011 09:02

theyoungest wrote:Yeah, a team where Pieter Weening is the best climber... they'll be like Skil-Shimano in this Vuelta.


what happened to geniez? Injured/sick?
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08 Sep 2011 09:08

Timmy-loves-Rabo wrote:what happened to geniez? Injured/sick?

Couldn't handle the heat, I think. And the level of racing in the WorldTour could have something to do with it.
theyoungest
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08 Sep 2011 09:11

theyoungest wrote:Couldn't handle the heat, I think. And the level of racing in the WorldTour could have something to do with it.


Still.. he went alright in some earlier races this year, with good competition present.

I found it odd when he lost 20 minutes by himself on the first challenging day.
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08 Sep 2011 09:11

just some guy wrote:All new people to cycling should watch this video- Briz.

A Sunday in Hell



I will, it should give you all some peace for an hour and a half.

After the first minute, LOL I remember toe clips on my Melvin Star* in the early 80's. And I wonder if anyone has explored the use of powdered graphite instead of grease on bike chains.

*I've only bought two bikes in my life, nearly 27 years apart and both from Mike McAuliffe.
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