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[Green Edge] Shayne Bannan, Gerry Ryan and an Aussie Pro Team for 2012?

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Re: Re:

29 Oct 2017 03:36

dirkprovin wrote:
yaco wrote:Think the Meyer option for GC is off the table because of the Commonwealth games. Doubt Ewan will get 4 stages in the 2018 TAU, as Sagan will come better prepared.


Will be interesting as to whether Meyer will ride solely track at CG or whether he will get co-opted for road as well. Will just have to wait and see how GE approach both TDU & Cuddle's Race.

Sagan .... oh, he'll be in reasonable shape but I don't think he's going to be going to any ridiculous lengths just for cheap early season wins. Whilst a strong dose of humility served cold would be most educational for Ewan, he's going to get that anyway when he's benched for almost all the spring classics :twisted:

Sagan will probably be coming to support McCarthy and get his early season training in.
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29 Oct 2017 04:43

Never underestimate Sagan. An 80% Sagan can still win a stage. The key is whether Bora bring Bennett. No Bennett and Sagan is gunning for a stage
yaco
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07 Nov 2017 15:59

No Winery ride for Orica which was supposed to happen on the 19th of November - Something has gone wrong - Anyway Gerry Ryan had a share in the Melbourne Cup winner Rekindling - Porte interviewed on Cycling Central has says some interesting things !
yaco
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Re:

08 Nov 2017 08:23

yaco wrote:No Winery ride for Orica which was supposed to happen on the 19th of November - Something has gone wrong - Anyway Gerry Ryan had a share in the Melbourne Cup winner Rekindling - Porte interviewed on Cycling Central has says some interesting things !


I've seen very little publicity about the winery ride this year. I was wondering if it was going ahead.
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Re: Re:

08 Nov 2017 11:24

claude cat wrote:
yaco wrote:No Winery ride for Orica which was supposed to happen on the 19th of November - Something has gone wrong - Anyway Gerry Ryan had a share in the Melbourne Cup winner Rekindling - Porte interviewed on Cycling Central has says some interesting things !


I've seen very little publicity about the winery ride this year. I was wondering if it was going ahead.


Orica should have the whole team at the Winery Ride together with a training camp - Reckon they are losing their Australian focus.

Porte seemed quite indecisive in an interview on SBS Cycling Central - He reckoned Gerrans would be a great addition to his TDF team - There is a reason why Orica wouldn't give Gerrans a GC ride in 2018 - And Porte managed to have a pot shot at Orica - Porte should focus on the Giro as it usually has a more straight-forward course which suit his limitations - Anyway Porte stated he would ride the TDF and the Vuelta.
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Re: Re:

08 Nov 2017 12:02

yaco wrote:
claude cat wrote:
yaco wrote:No Winery ride for Orica which was supposed to happen on the 19th of November - Something has gone wrong - Anyway Gerry Ryan had a share in the Melbourne Cup winner Rekindling - Porte interviewed on Cycling Central has says some interesting things !


I've seen very little publicity about the winery ride this year. I was wondering if it was going ahead.


Orica should have the whole team at the Winery Ride together with a training camp - Reckon they are losing their Australian focus.

Porte seemed quite indecisive in an interview on SBS Cycling Central - He reckoned Gerrans would be a great addition to his TDF team - There is a reason why Orica wouldn't give Gerrans a GC ride in 2018 - And Porte managed to have a pot shot at Orica - Porte should focus on the Giro as it usually has a more straight-forward course which suit his limitations - Anyway Porte stated he would ride the TDF and the Vuelta.


Thinking you are making overmuch of the Winery Ride; nor do I agree that they should drag ALL their riders out to AUS at this time of year. There is potentially a case to be made for bringing out some riders, especially new signings, to perhaps do some testing at AIS so they can have some "baselines" to work off but for many others, I do not see the cost/benefits equation coming down in favour of such a move if they already have some plans in place for camps elsewhere.

As for Richie; he merely provided more Grade 1 evidence for the case that he lacks the necessary intelligence; racing and otherwise; to be any more than what he has already shown himself to be.
dirkprovin
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Re: Re:

08 Nov 2017 13:59

yaco wrote:
claude cat wrote:
yaco wrote:No Winery ride for Orica which was supposed to happen on the 19th of November - Something has gone wrong - Anyway Gerry Ryan had a share in the Melbourne Cup winner Rekindling - Porte interviewed on Cycling Central has says some interesting things !


I've seen very little publicity about the winery ride this year. I was wondering if it was going ahead.


Orica should have the whole team at the Winery Ride together with a training camp - Reckon they are losing their Australian focus.

Porte seemed quite indecisive in an interview on SBS Cycling Central - He reckoned Gerrans would be a great addition to his TDF team - There is a reason why Orica wouldn't give Gerrans a GC ride in 2018 - And Porte managed to have a pot shot at Orica - Porte should focus on the Giro as it usually has a more straight-forward course which suit his limitations - Anyway Porte stated he would ride the TDF and the Vuelta.


Why should Orica bring anyone out for the Winery Ride? I really can't see the appeal of this thing for anyone, paying to ride with pro riders feels ridiculous to me, ride around enough and you'll come across a pro or ex-pro at some stage and it's free!

If Porte is ever to podium at a GT it will be the Tour with a slim chance to do that at the Vuelta, he should stay far far far away from the Giro.
This is Cocaine...This is Chloroform...In short we ride on Dynamite!
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Re: Re:

08 Nov 2017 17:20

dirkprovin wrote:
yaco wrote:
claude cat wrote:
yaco wrote:No Winery ride for Orica which was supposed to happen on the 19th of November - Something has gone wrong - Anyway Gerry Ryan had a share in the Melbourne Cup winner Rekindling - Porte interviewed on Cycling Central has says some interesting things !


I've seen very little publicity about the winery ride this year. I was wondering if it was going ahead.


Orica should have the whole team at the Winery Ride together with a training camp - Reckon they are losing their Australian focus.

Porte seemed quite indecisive in an interview on SBS Cycling Central - He reckoned Gerrans would be a great addition to his TDF team - There is a reason why Orica wouldn't give Gerrans a GC ride in 2018 - And Porte managed to have a pot shot at Orica - Porte should focus on the Giro as it usually has a more straight-forward course which suit his limitations - Anyway Porte stated he would ride the TDF and the Vuelta.


Thinking you are making overmuch of the Winery Ride; nor do I agree that they should drag ALL their riders out to AUS at this time of year. There is potentially a case to be made for bringing out some riders, especially new signings, to perhaps do some testing at AIS so they can have some "baselines" to work off but for many others, I do not see the cost/benefits equation coming down in favour of such a move if they already have some plans in place for camps elsewhere.

As for Richie; he merely provided more Grade 1 evidence for the case that he lacks the necessary intelligence; racing and otherwise; to be any more than what he has already shown himself to be.


Teams usually have 2 pre-season camps, so there is no harm for an Australian badged team to have one in Australia - Of course, I wouldn't be suggesting this if it was winter in Australia !

Porte had a crack at Orica in his interview on the SBS Podcast - Couldn't understand why Orica didn't send Gerrans to the TDF and wants him as his road captain - Richie is conveniently forgetting that Gerrans is a DNF in five of his last 7 GT's and that Gerrans has shown no aptitude as a road captain - Porte also criticised Orica for not sending Ewan to the TDF - So Porte wants to win a GT with a road captain who may not finish a GT and a sprinter ( albeit a high class sprinter ) who will provided Porte with little or no support - Enough said !
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Re: Re:

08 Nov 2017 17:28

StryderHells wrote:
yaco wrote:
claude cat wrote:
yaco wrote:No Winery ride for Orica which was supposed to happen on the 19th of November - Something has gone wrong - Anyway Gerry Ryan had a share in the Melbourne Cup winner Rekindling - Porte interviewed on Cycling Central has says some interesting things !


I've seen very little publicity about the winery ride this year. I was wondering if it was going ahead.


Orica should have the whole team at the Winery Ride together with a training camp - Reckon they are losing their Australian focus.

Porte seemed quite indecisive in an interview on SBS Cycling Central - He reckoned Gerrans would be a great addition to his TDF team - There is a reason why Orica wouldn't give Gerrans a GC ride in 2018 - And Porte managed to have a pot shot at Orica - Porte should focus on the Giro as it usually has a more straight-forward course which suit his limitations - Anyway Porte stated he would ride the TDF and the Vuelta.


Why should Orica bring anyone out for the Winery Ride? I really can't see the appeal of this thing for anyone, paying to ride with pro riders feels ridiculous to me, ride around enough and you'll come across a pro or ex-pro at some stage and it's free!

If Porte is ever to podium at a GT it will be the Tour with a slim chance to do that at the Vuelta, he should stay far far far away from the Giro.


I believe Porte's lack of a podium at a GT is probably 50% luck and 50% race-craft - Let's face it Froome has had his share of falls at the 2016 TDF and twice at the 2017 Vuelta but got away unharmed, so there is always an element of luck - Porte can podium at a GT and even win if he has a super 3 weeks - For me he needs a straight forward course which is strictly divided into mountain stages, sprint stages and non-complicated transitional stages - Think he can get into less trouble at the Giro in the non-mountain stages, while the longer alpine climbs at the Giro can allow him to display his climbing superiority - The way TDF courses are structured which are tailored for clever riders doesn't suit his characteristics, while the sharp muritos at the Vuelta are a worry - I'll also add Porte is at the wrong team to support his GC ambitions.
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Re: Re:

08 Nov 2017 20:17

StryderHells wrote:
yaco wrote:
claude cat wrote:
yaco wrote:No Winery ride for Orica which was supposed to happen on the 19th of November - Something has gone wrong - Anyway Gerry Ryan had a share in the Melbourne Cup winner Rekindling - Porte interviewed on Cycling Central has says some interesting things !


I've seen very little publicity about the winery ride this year. I was wondering if it was going ahead.


Orica should have the whole team at the Winery Ride together with a training camp - Reckon they are losing their Australian focus.

Porte seemed quite indecisive in an interview on SBS Cycling Central - He reckoned Gerrans would be a great addition to his TDF team - There is a reason why Orica wouldn't give Gerrans a GC ride in 2018 - And Porte managed to have a pot shot at Orica - Porte should focus on the Giro as it usually has a more straight-forward course which suit his limitations - Anyway Porte stated he would ride the TDF and the Vuelta.


Why should Orica bring anyone out for the Winery Ride? I really can't see the appeal of this thing for anyone, paying to ride with pro riders feels ridiculous to me, ride around enough and you'll come across a pro or ex-pro at some stage and it's free!

If Porte is ever to podium at a GT it will be the Tour with a slim chance to do that at the Vuelta, he should stay far far far away from the Giro.

The winery ride comes too far out from any racing to have a compulsory training camp. Most pros have only been back on their bike a week or two, if at all.

As Stryderhells said, why would you pay a small fortune to ride with pros? Even a small city like Brisbane has guys like Hepburn, McCarthy, Schulz and a bunch of ex Drapac guys like Kerby and Rudolph. If I want to ride with them I just go to my local Saturday morning crit :confused:
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Re: Re:

08 Nov 2017 23:10

yaco wrote:
StryderHells wrote:
yaco wrote:
claude cat wrote:
yaco wrote:No Winery ride for Orica which was supposed to happen on the 19th of November - Something has gone wrong - Anyway Gerry Ryan had a share in the Melbourne Cup winner Rekindling - Porte interviewed on Cycling Central has says some interesting things !


I've seen very little publicity about the winery ride this year. I was wondering if it was going ahead.


Orica should have the whole team at the Winery Ride together with a training camp - Reckon they are losing their Australian focus.

Porte seemed quite indecisive in an interview on SBS Cycling Central - He reckoned Gerrans would be a great addition to his TDF team - There is a reason why Orica wouldn't give Gerrans a GC ride in 2018 - And Porte managed to have a pot shot at Orica - Porte should focus on the Giro as it usually has a more straight-forward course which suit his limitations - Anyway Porte stated he would ride the TDF and the Vuelta.


Why should Orica bring anyone out for the Winery Ride? I really can't see the appeal of this thing for anyone, paying to ride with pro riders feels ridiculous to me, ride around enough and you'll come across a pro or ex-pro at some stage and it's free!

If Porte is ever to podium at a GT it will be the Tour with a slim chance to do that at the Vuelta, he should stay far far far away from the Giro.


I believe Porte's lack of a podium at a GT is probably 50% luck and 50% race-craft - Let's face it Froome has had his share of falls at the 2016 TDF and twice at the 2017 Vuelta but got away unharmed, so there is always an element of luck - Porte can podium at a GT and even win if he has a super 3 weeks - For me he needs a straight forward course which is strictly divided into mountain stages, sprint stages and non-complicated transitional stages - Think he can get into less trouble at the Giro in the non-mountain stages, while the longer alpine climbs at the Giro can allow him to display his climbing superiority - The way TDF courses are structured which are tailored for clever riders doesn't suit his characteristics, while the sharp muritos at the Vuelta are a worry - I'll also add Porte is at the wrong team to support his GC ambitions.


Porte rode the same descent in the Dauphine and almost fell twice, once after Froome cut him off then he did the sensible thing and backed off. It was the worst descent of the race and Porte and his team already knew about it. When bad luck becomes a habit is it still bad luck ? If it's not falls it's something else. Porte simply had to do what he did in the Dauphine and the worst thing about it apart from his own injuries which could have been a lot worse, was that he also ruined Dan Martin's race and also almost ruined Uran's. Martin is much improved in GTs in the past few years and was riding crippled up for quite a few days with his back injury. He would have finished higher up on GC the way he was riding. Situations like that are where race intelligence comes into play and Porte has shown in the Tour and before that it's his biggest weakness.
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09 Nov 2017 05:17

Hence my post about 50% luck and race craft - The bad luck comes into play when you consider Froome fell in the 2016 TDF and twice in the 2017 Vuelta for no injury - The race craft comes into play in selecting the best GT for your abilities, choosing the right team and having the right support riders - When he wants Gerrans as his road captain, a rider who has DNF'ed 5 of his last 7 GT's, has shown little or no aptitude as a road captain, then you wonder - 2018 World's selection will be interesting - Porte would seem to be suited to the parcours, but he's shown little in one day races - It will be interesting to see how strong and wise are the Australian selectors,
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Re:

09 Nov 2017 05:23

yaco wrote:Hence my post about 50% luck and race craft - The bad luck comes into play when you consider Froome fell in the 2016 TDF and twice in the 2017 Vuelta for no injury - The race craft comes into play in selecting the best GT for your abilities, choosing the right team and having the right support riders - When he wants Gerrans as his road captain, a rider who has DNF'ed 5 of his last 7 GT's, has shown little or no aptitude as a road captain, then you wonder - 2018 World's selection will be interesting - Porte would seem to be suited to the parcours, but he's shown little in one day races - It will be interesting to see how strong and wise are the Australian selectors,

If Porte wants a ride, he’ll get it. Even though his only real showing at a one day race was at San Sebastián in 2010, he’s probably Australia’s best chance to go deep into the race. Simon Clarke’s best form is long gone and Haig’s is still building.
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Re: Re:

09 Nov 2017 13:24

42x16ss wrote:
yaco wrote:Hence my post about 50% luck and race craft - The bad luck comes into play when you consider Froome fell in the 2016 TDF and twice in the 2017 Vuelta for no injury - The race craft comes into play in selecting the best GT for your abilities, choosing the right team and having the right support riders - When he wants Gerrans as his road captain, a rider who has DNF'ed 5 of his last 7 GT's, has shown little or no aptitude as a road captain, then you wonder - 2018 World's selection will be interesting - Porte would seem to be suited to the parcours, but he's shown little in one day races - It will be interesting to see how strong and wise are the Australian selectors,

If Porte wants a ride, he’ll get it. Even though his only real showing at a one day race was at San Sebastián in 2010, he’s probably Australia’s best chance to go deep into the race. Simon Clarke’s best form is long gone and Haig’s is still building.


Well Porte was doing well in a difficult Olympic road race until he fell on another descent ! But from what I remember I think someone fell in front of him. I'd say Porte will be there and yes Simon Clarke is not the rider he was, Gerrans obviously isn't and neither is Adam Hansen even though his stamina is not under question ! Gerrans knows how to read a race well and is very experienced but he simply isn't performing and won't be there at the critical moments near the end of the race based on the past two years anyway. I think Gerrans was a bad choice for BMC and I can't understand their thinking. He doesn't strike me as a road captain at all. I think Gerrans signing was probably one of the worst signings of the season. Sometimes BMC seem clueless.
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Re: Re:

09 Nov 2017 15:02

42x16ss wrote:
yaco wrote:Hence my post about 50% luck and race craft - The bad luck comes into play when you consider Froome fell in the 2016 TDF and twice in the 2017 Vuelta for no injury - The race craft comes into play in selecting the best GT for your abilities, choosing the right team and having the right support riders - When he wants Gerrans as his road captain, a rider who has DNF'ed 5 of his last 7 GT's, has shown little or no aptitude as a road captain, then you wonder - 2018 World's selection will be interesting - Porte would seem to be suited to the parcours, but he's shown little in one day races - It will be interesting to see how strong and wise are the Australian selectors,

If Porte wants a ride, he’ll get it. Even though his only real showing at a one day race was at San Sebastián in 2010, he’s probably Australia’s best chance to go deep into the race. Simon Clarke’s best form is long gone and Haig’s is still building.


Agree that Porte will be the protected rider with Haig a Plan B - Apparently Porte is riding both the TDF and the Vuelta which may not be the best preparation for the World's - This is one year when you don't need to take a full compliment of riders - Women's are in a more precarious predicament - Suppose Spratt and Gillow will be on an equal footing and again you don't need to take a full team.
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Re: Re:

09 Nov 2017 15:04

movingtarget wrote:
42x16ss wrote:
yaco wrote:Hence my post about 50% luck and race craft - The bad luck comes into play when you consider Froome fell in the 2016 TDF and twice in the 2017 Vuelta for no injury - The race craft comes into play in selecting the best GT for your abilities, choosing the right team and having the right support riders - When he wants Gerrans as his road captain, a rider who has DNF'ed 5 of his last 7 GT's, has shown little or no aptitude as a road captain, then you wonder - 2018 World's selection will be interesting - Porte would seem to be suited to the parcours, but he's shown little in one day races - It will be interesting to see how strong and wise are the Australian selectors,

If Porte wants a ride, he’ll get it. Even though his only real showing at a one day race was at San Sebastián in 2010, he’s probably Australia’s best chance to go deep into the race. Simon Clarke’s best form is long gone and Haig’s is still building.


Well Porte was doing well in a difficult Olympic road race until he fell on another descent ! But from what I remember I think someone fell in front of him. I'd say Porte will be there and yes Simon Clarke is not the rider he was, Gerrans obviously isn't and neither is Adam Hansen even though his stamina is not under question ! Gerrans knows how to read a race well and is very experienced but he simply isn't performing and won't be there at the critical moments near the end of the race based on the past two years anyway. I think Gerrans was a bad choice for BMC and I can't understand their thinking. He doesn't strike me as a road captain at all. I think Gerrans signing was probably one of the worst signings of the season. Sometimes BMC seem clueless.


Will agree that BMC seem clueless in how to construct a team - They've gone through the last 8 years with one gun rider in Evans, Gilbert, Van Avermaat and not much else - A strange team.
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11 Nov 2017 18:06

Does anybody have an idea about the main schedules for the main riders next year?

How would they divide the Giro, Tour and Vuelta. Any interviews or anything.
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Re:

11 Nov 2017 18:35

Escarabajo wrote:Does anybody have an idea about the main schedules for the main riders next year?

How would they divide the Giro, Tour and Vuelta. Any interviews or anything.


Not likely to see/hear anything until they have a much fuller picture re the routes of all 3 GTs. Both Yates go off contract at the end of next year so its likely that each will get leadership at one GT and at least one of them ride as a "B option" at another. Also likely that Haig will be a "B option" at one.
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11 Nov 2017 19:06

The Giro and the Vuelta are the two GC targets for 2018 - I guess this is to avoid Froome and probably because the parcours of the TDF is not overly suitable for Orica's GC riders - Of course if Froome rides the Giro priorities may change.
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