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Race Design Thread

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07 Oct 2011 17:24

Bubban wrote:The area around Lillehammer has some good climbs. Would want to see something like this in next years tour of Norway.

http://tracks4bikers.com/tracks/show/70424

Or a one day race with start and Finish in Lillehammer adding Torpavegen to that route before those climbs


I designed an almost identical Hamar - Lillehammer stage a while back, even down to the uphill finish at the ski jump.

I think that tracks4bikers doesn't register a couple of tunnels and bridges there as you've got a couple of climbs averaging 30%+ with a max of 65%!


I've updated the OP to include everybody's parcours who has clearly defined the course so far.
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07 Oct 2011 17:32

The Hitch wrote:I eagerly await the Amgen Tour of Romania presented by Jens Attacks where every team has to have a minimum of 3 failed dope tests between them and every stage is an mtf.


fortunately it's impossible to fail a test here because there isn't such thing as that.they can't catch even the steroids:p
rasmussen and riccardo,that's all what i can await for...serbia did it,they are good.
Vino 4ever
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07 Oct 2011 17:36

Libertine Seguros wrote:I designed an almost identical Hamar - Lillehammer stage a while back, even down to the uphill finish at the ski jump.

I think that tracks4bikers doesn't register a couple of tunnels and bridges there as you've got a couple of climbs averaging 30%+ with a max of 65%!


I've updated the OP to include everybody's parcours who has clearly defined the course so far.


Yeah a lot of routes looks totally crazy in norway thanks to tunnels but i think this route is free from tunnels. It`s the same thing with Tindevegen (Fardalvegen) starting in Øvre Årdal. According to that program that climb start with a 90% section:) and as far as i know that climb is free from tunnels.
Bubban
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07 Oct 2011 17:40

Could easily still be bridges though, because there's no way that main roads include 65% gradients in them, even in Norway! Plus, all the climbs that are at "average 27%" or "average 33%" are incredibly short and at main road sections... obviously something awry with the tracker.
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07 Oct 2011 17:44

Stage of the Tour of Britain in the heart of the peak district, using all these climbs that the supposed Queen stage of the ToB (the Stoke on Trent stage) just doesn't use :(

MACCLESFIELD - MATLOCK
142.6km

Image

Image

Summit finish on Bank Road in Matlock, 1.1km climb, average 16% with sections at 22%

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oA2hVmDsC3M&feature=related
Image
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07 Oct 2011 17:46

Libertine Seguros wrote:Could easily still be bridges though, because there's no way that main roads include 65% gradients in them, even in Norway! Plus, all the climbs that are at "average 27%" or "average 33%" are incredibly short and at main road sections... obviously something awry with the tracker.


http://maps.google.com/maps?q=%C3%98vre+%C3%85rdal,+Norge&hl=sv&ie=UTF8&ll=61.316313,7.787743&spn=0.011123,0.038581&sll=47.981946,4.715646&sspn=7.944653,19.753418&vpsrc=6&hnear=%C3%98vre+%C3%85rdal,+%C3%85rdal+kommun,+Sogn+og+Fjordane+fylke,+Kongeriket+Norge&t=m&z=15&layer=c&cbll=61.316313,7.787743&panoid=dmpfnrvvKFDFwIn2DrfRwQ&cbp=12,307.44,,0,0.8

Thats a 100% section according to the program:p so yeah obviously something is strange. The total average for climbs when you create routes still show upp fairly correct.
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07 Oct 2011 18:04

Somebody should do design indian race concentrating in north india with its mountains esp himachal pradesh where its a bit like the Alps...i cant be arsed to do it.
Testing the bounds of reality.
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Giro fantasy stage

07 Oct 2011 18:08

I've made this potential queen stage of Giro. It's not as long as I wanted to be (previously I added another climb instead of that flat part, but that would be probably just too much, but it is of course possible), but I think the altitude gain is quite good.

http://www.mapmyride.com/routes/view/52736620/

Climbs:
Passo di Pennes(45km, 4,2%, with last 8km at 8,5%)
Passo di Monte Giovo(15km, 7,5%) http://tinyurl.com/montegiovo
Passo Rombo(29km, 6,2%) http://tinyurl.com/passorombo
Otzaler Gletscherstrasse(13km, 10,7%) http://tinyurl.com/6jbd7eh
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07 Oct 2011 18:21

That's another one I've done something very similar to - the Jaufenpass - Rombo - Rettenbachferner triple is just too good to pass up. The Rettenbachferner in particular is going tragically unused at the moment - it's more or less the Mortirolo, but at 1000m higher altitude.
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07 Oct 2011 18:56

Libertine Seguros wrote: you've got a couple of climbs averaging 30%+ with a max of 65%!



Giro course change, start to move to Norway?
The Hitch: Winner 2013 Vuelta cq game. Winner, Velorooms prediction game 2012, 2013. 2nd all time cq rankings.
The Father of Clean Cycling, Christophe Bassons wrote:When I look at cycling today, I get the impression that history is repeating itself: riders who are supposed to be rouleurs are climbing passes at the front of the race, and those who are supposed to be climbers are riding time trials at more than 50 kilometres per hour.

The story is beginning again, just as it did 14 years ago


journalist with integrity.
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07 Oct 2011 19:31

Second time around for me posting some stage races, second time in a not-exactly-unexpected place.

There is already a version of this race, but it lasts but three days and is only for amateurs; I'm looking at beefing it up a bit for the pros. So, here it is, the Vuelta a Navarra (or Nafarroako Itzulia if you'd prefer).

It is perhaps the last thing people would expect of yours truly, but I'm starting off with a - pause, swallow, try to compose oneself and overcome the torrent of shame overwhelming me - flat stage.

Stage 1: Sangüesa - Muniáin de la Solana, 140km

Image

Though there are a couple of smallish climbs that can break the group up, there is more than enough time to bring everything back together again.

Image

Climbs:
Puerto de San Isidro del Pinar (cat.3), 3,1km @ 4,1%
Alto de Funes (cat.3), 3,8km @ 4,1%

The main reasoning behind this is that the southern half of Navarre is flat, but prone to becoming very hot, and large areas are very exposed, and this could be a punishing stage even at such a short length. The finish is on a circuit that includes a small climb into Dicastillo, followed by the run-in, which is mostly easy but for a very tricky set of corners about 500m from the line. There is then a short stretch on very poor roads before the drag back up to Dicastillo.

Nevertheless this should be one for the fast men to have their fun, even though the drag may derail the occasional train and the tricky corners - including a hairpin - may allow a lone forager to foil the bunch.

Sangüesa:
Image

Muniáin de la Solana:
Image
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07 Oct 2011 19:45

RownhamHill wrote:OK, I'm not sure how to do the fancy profiles or maps, or embed pictures (if anyone can advise I'll try and edit), but I saw something saying GB might bid for the World Championships the other day, and it got me thinking about a fantasy world champs course in my hometown Bristol.

I reckon you could start next to the harbourside on Anchor Road, go up St Michael's Hill - which is about a kilometer that must be around 10% average gradient, with (considerably) steeper sections, through Clifton and across the Suspension bridge, then loop around the top of Ashton Court park (This is all fairly flat ) before the descent round the South of the Park (which is probably about three/four kilometers at an average of about -8% and not particularly technical).

Then back up Rownham Hill to the bridge - there's a link to a Strava profile below which says its 9% average with 16-17% section. Once you cross back into Bristol proper, turn left and descend down onto the Portway, which takes you underneath the Suspension bridge and back onto Anchor Road for the start finish - I reckon it's about 20 kilometers a lap, so eight laps, 16 kilometers of proper climbing, about 25 kilometers of fast descending, and the rest flat, all with a beautiful/historic back drop.

There might be a problem with using the bridge in two directions (and more to the point the approach roads, as the bridge itself is naturally split into two carriageways) especially if the field splits, but assuming you could overcome that I reckon it would be fantastic - no idea who would win either!

Some context:

Here's a map I made http://friendfit.com/routeview.php?rtnum=75596&from=fitblog

A photo of St Michaels Hill http://www.yourlocalweb.co.uk/images/pictures/16/38/st-michaels-hospital-161360.jpg)

A profile of the second climb http://www.strava.com/segments/rownham-hill-short-bristol-670831

Some images of the Suspension Bridge: http://www.google.co.uk/search?tbm=isch&hl=en&source=hp&biw=1280&bih=933&q=clifton+suspension+bridge&gbv=2&oq=clifton+sup&aq=0sS&aqi=g-sS1g-S4&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=1634l2774l0l4191l11l8l0l0l0l0l162l969l2.6l8l0


Ah.. takes me back to my student days. Would make a great circuit. Libertine's Tour of the French Basque region would be beautiful (countryside and racing). I'm away at the moment, but I'll try and design a Tour of the Cambrian Mountains (the ascent of the Bwlch y Groes from the south would be a certainty, last 1.5k is around 16%, did it in the summer from the easy north side :o). Possibly a tour of the Knockmealdowns/Galtees in the south of Ireland.
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07 Oct 2011 19:50

Of course, my generosity to the men whose riding their bikes entertains me couldn't last, and we're back to the norm.

Stage 2: Morentin - Salinas de Oro, 153km

Image

The first trips into the mountains for the péloton, finishing with a final run-in familiar to those who know of the amateur Vuelta a Navarra, the short downhill into Salinas de Oro after cresting the Alto d'Etxauri.

Image

Climbs:
Puerto de Urbasa (cat.1) 9,0km @ 4,6%
Puerto de Lizarraga (cat.1) 9,3km @ 5,4%
Puerto de Guembe (cat.2) 6,1km @ 5,1%
Alto d'Etxauri (cat.1) 6,9km @ 6,4%

None of these climbs are especially arduous, though estimates of the actual climb of Lizarraga vary from 9,3km @ 5,4% as quoted above to 9,0km @ 6,1%. Either way, the long and gradual descents and short flat sections should ensure that all of the main candidates for the GC arrive at Etxauri together ready for the short duel on the final climb.

The final climb (with bizarrely Hispanicized name):
Image

In reality, I expect this to trim the group down to a small bunch but not break everything apart too much; we will be most likely to have a sprint from the GC contenders when we pass the salt mines and finish in the small town of Salinas de Oro:

Image
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07 Oct 2011 20:30

Stage 3: Zizur Mayor - Goizueta, 174km

Image

Starting with a trip through the outskirts of Pamplona, this stage begins off undulating, with a couple of medium-sized climbs. As we head towards the business end of the race, a long descent is followed by the drag up to the Puerto de Ezkurra, before descending into the Basque-Navarrese stronghold of Goizueta, finishing with a short but very steep (up to 20%) and narrow uphill scrap just to the north of the town that should favour a puncheur who has been able to hold on on the gradual but continual climbs earlier in the day, but also allow the contenders for the GC to fight for vital seconds and open up potentially decisive gaps.

Image

Climbs:
Tunel de Aoiz (cat.3) 2,2km @ 5,6%
Puerto de Meskiritz (cat.3) 4,1km @ 3,5%
Puerto de Egozkue (cat.2) 5,5km @ 5,5%
Puerto de Belate (cat.3) 6,5km @ 3,9%
Puerto de Ezkurra (cat.2) 8,8km @ 3,6%
Goizueta (Subida Final)(cat.2) 1,4km @ 9,5%

Zizur Mayor:
Image

Goizueta:
Image

The hill on the right there is where the finish will be.
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07 Oct 2011 20:37

TeamSkyFans wrote:The tour of Cornwall



Has a pro peloton ever ridden in Cornwall?

A little excitement's fine, but 200 riders on Cornish roads would be mental. Constant up and downs, constant sharp bends, often one after another, ie. you'll get a 20% descent and, right at the bottom, you'll get a 90 deg. turn. The roads are narrow and usually bordered by stone fences, with no grass verges in between. Cornwall's wet and windy and, quite frequently, fairly heavily wooded, so you get stretches of roads where you cannot see anything beyond an upcoming bend.

Honestly, I can't think of more dangerous place for a peloton to ride.
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07 Oct 2011 20:47

King Of The Wolds wrote:Has a pro peloton ever ridden in Cornwall?

A little excitement's fine, but 200 riders on Cornish roads would be mental. Constant up and downs, constant sharp bends, often one after another, ie. you'll get a 20% descent and, right at the bottom, you'll get a 90 deg. turn. The roads are narrow and usually bordered by stone fences, with no grass verges in between. Cornwall's wet and windy and, quite frequently, fairly heavily wooded, so you get stretches of roads where you cannot see anything beyond an upcoming bend.

Honestly, I can't think of more dangerous place for a peloton to ride.


Sounds perfect.
Ryo Hazuki wrote:horrible. boonen just the same guy as years before and this course is too hard for him. that's why he rode like a coward there were at least 3 guys stronger than boonen today and none of them won: sagan, ballan, pozzato


The Hitch wrote:Goss will woop boonens candy a[color="Black"]ss[/color] in a sprint he cares about, any day of the week
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revenge is a dish best served cold

07 Oct 2011 20:50

Zomegan's revenge
giro queen stage Bolzano to San Genesio 6800m of climbing..taking in San pellegrino passo rolle passo levaze amongst others finishing on possibly hardest climb that could be included in a grand tour...
http://www.mapmyride.com/routes/view/53499830/?open_ive_done=1&new_route=1
profile of finish.....
http://www.climbbybike.com/profile.asp?Climbprofile=San-Genesio---Edelweiss&MountainID=3498
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07 Oct 2011 20:52

El Pistolero wrote:Sounds perfect.


I'm not joking, it would be carnage. They scare me in my car, driving at 40kph.
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07 Oct 2011 20:58

User Guide wrote:Zomegan's revenge
giro queen stage Bolzano to San Genesio 6800m of climbing..taking in San pellegrino passo rolle passo levaze amongst others finishing on possibly hardest climb that could be included in a grand tour...
http://www.mapmyride.com/routes/view/53499830/?open_ive_done=1&new_route=1
profile of finish.....
http://www.climbbybike.com/profile.asp?Climbprofile=San-Genesio---Edelweiss&MountainID=3498


So that's, in order: Passo Nigra, Costalunga, Passo San Pellegrino (PS you lose points from me for not going north to Arabba and climbing the - admittedly easier - other side of Passo Fedaia), Forcella Aurine, Passo di Cereda, Passo Rolle, Passo Lavazè, Passo Nigra and then San Genesio?
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07 Oct 2011 21:06

Libertine Seguros wrote:So that's, in order: Passo Nigra, Costalunga, Passo San Pellegrino (PS you lose points from me for not going north to Arabba and climbing the - admittedly easier - other side of Passo Fedaia), Forcella Aurine, Passo di Cereda, Passo Rolle, Passo Lavazè, Passo Nigra and then San Genesio?

I wont even begin to pretend I know all the names but yes , north side of the loop first.Also looked on google earth and after San Genesio is a white road of 3-4km @5% that leads too Frassinetto with a good road too descend, so San Genesio could be used as a pass.
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