Log in:  

Register

Jörg Jaksche: Doping, hypocrisy and a dog called Bella

The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

Jörg Jaksche: Doping, hypocrisy and a dog called Bella

04 Sep 2012 13:56

Great article in features about (eventually) coming clean.

As usual it sounds like the UCI tried to sweep things under the carpet.
There were no further questions and to Jaksche’s knowledge, no further investigations were made by the UCI into any of the individuals or teams that he’d implicated.

“This is how you have to deal with the UCI. They try and protect their sport but they don’t know how to do that. They think that a sport without scandal is a clean sport and they have so many misleading people in their federation. There are so many cadavers. It’s like having a dead body in your basement festering away and going bad. That’s how the UCI treat doping. They gave me no hope and I felt worse treated by the UCI than if I hadn’t confessed and told them my story. It wasn’t the reaction I was hoping to get."

McQuaid said this and that but they would have liked me to have handled things differently. I don’t really know what they meant by that.”
I was awarded 'Most Aggressive Rider of the Day', generally given to the most spectacular loser of the day.

― David Millar, Racing Through the Dark
User avatar Don't be late Pedro
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2,443
Joined: 13 Aug 2010 08:51

04 Sep 2012 14:05

why Millar, Dekker and not Jaksche?
HTC and Slipstream were among the teams he tried to approach but for whatever reason, whether it was his doping past, his confession or his talent, they chose to ignore him.



And recall JV lauding Riis in the recent bicycling interview as one of the anti-doping crusaders of this era at the same level as Kimmage?
Me thinks Daniel Benson is more on the mark:
Hypocrisy was rife in cycling in the wake of Puerto. Bjarne Riis, Alexandre Vinokourov and an endless list of individuals vilified Jaksche claims.
sniper
Senior Member
 
Posts: 8,542
Joined: 15 Oct 2010 23:36

04 Sep 2012 14:11

sniper wrote:why Millar, Dekker and not Jaksche?

Doesn't Millar part own Garmin? Not sure about Dekker.

It is interesting that he says
But I wouldn’t be happy if I’d lied and then confessed something that wasn’t the whole truth and say I’m an anti-doping crusader.


Wonder if that is aimed at Millar or just a generalisation?
I was awarded 'Most Aggressive Rider of the Day', generally given to the most spectacular loser of the day.

― David Millar, Racing Through the Dark
User avatar Don't be late Pedro
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2,443
Joined: 13 Aug 2010 08:51

04 Sep 2012 14:13

absolutely baffling stuff regarding UCI 'welcoming' Jaksche's confession.
Not that we didn't know, but great to read about it on the CN frontpage.
bravo Daniel Benson (and JJ of course)
sniper
Senior Member
 
Posts: 8,542
Joined: 15 Oct 2010 23:36

04 Sep 2012 14:16

Don't be late Pedro wrote:...
It is interesting that he says
Wonder if that is aimed at Millar or just a generalisation?

sounds like Millar alright.
sniper
Senior Member
 
Posts: 8,542
Joined: 15 Oct 2010 23:36

04 Sep 2012 14:22

or Vaughters, or Riis.
Justcycling

...girls and ****ed 'em at school. All I know is that there were rumours he was into field hockey players

"the only thing worse than reading Cycling News is talking to them" Paul Kimmage

"The four most beautiful words in our common language: I told you so." Gore Vidal
User avatar Mrs John Murphy
Senior Member
 
Posts: 2,242
Joined: 03 May 2010 21:45
Location: Stamping on Cadel's dog

04 Sep 2012 14:25

This article, coupled with various riders (Arvesen & Sastre) commenting on Riis, is the start of pro cyclings current 'cover our ar**'s' campaign.

I'd like to feel sorry for any clean riders involved, I'd be even more interested to know if there were any.............. Sastre maybe? 'tarred with the same brush' comes to mind.
User avatar RichWalk
Junior Member
 
Posts: 197
Joined: 13 Jul 2012 08:56
Location: Birmingham, England

04 Sep 2012 14:29

sniper wrote:why Millar, Dekker and not Jaksche?


And recall JV lauding Riis in the recent bicycling interview as one of the anti-doping crusaders of this era at the same level as Kimmage?
Me thinks Daniel Benson is more on the mark:

JV didn't really laud Riis as an anti-doping crusader. He mentioned him as one of the ex-pros who, by confessing, had paved the road he was walking on with his own confession.

Anyway, massive respect for Jaksche. He was one of my favourite riders, and I was glad to see he had more of a moral compass than most in the sport.
User avatar hrotha
Senior Member
 
Posts: 13,405
Joined: 10 Jun 2010 20:45

04 Sep 2012 14:32

hrotha wrote:JV didn't really laud Riis as an anti-doping crusader. He mentioned him as one of the ex-pros who, by confessing, had paved the road he was walking on with his own confession.

Anyway, massive respect for Jaksche. He was one of my favourite riders, and I was glad to see he had more of a moral compass than most in the sport.


you're right, but it shows poor analytical skills if you name Riis in one breath with Kimmage, Landis and Jaksche, like JV did.
There are oceans between Riis and the other three and JV knows it but prefers to abide by the omerta.
sniper
Senior Member
 
Posts: 8,542
Joined: 15 Oct 2010 23:36

04 Sep 2012 14:35

hrotha wrote:JV didn't really laud Riis as an anti-doping crusader. He mentioned him as one of the ex-pros who, by confessing, had paved the road he was walking on with his own confession.

Anyway, massive respect for Jaksche. He was one of my favourite riders, and I was glad to see he had more of a moral compass than most in the sport.


IIRC, somewhere circa 2007 Vaughters praised Riis' anti-doping program.

Never mind that CSC still ended up as the best PT team.
User avatar roundabout
Senior Member
 
Posts: 12,003
Joined: 07 Jun 2010 11:43

04 Sep 2012 14:38

Maybe we should ask Vaughters (if he has the guts to come hear) why he didn't hire a guy like Jörg Jaksche but did Dekker and Millar? :rolleyes:
User avatar Walkman
Junior Member
 
Posts: 1,717
Joined: 04 Apr 2010 20:39

04 Sep 2012 14:40

Good luck with that. We've already touched upon that in the "JV talks" thread.

But I do remember the word talent being used. Maybe not in that thread, but in one of the zillion interviews Vaughters likes to give.
User avatar roundabout
Senior Member
 
Posts: 12,003
Joined: 07 Jun 2010 11:43

04 Sep 2012 14:41

Walkman wrote:Maybe we should ask Vaughters (if he has the guts to come hear) why he didn't hire a guy like Jörg Jaksche but did Dekker and Millar? :rolleyes:


'Red Flagged by the UCI' and a risk to the political status quo at the time, same as most things professional, you play the game, if you stick your head over the parapet, you risk it being shot off..........
User avatar RichWalk
Junior Member
 
Posts: 197
Joined: 13 Jul 2012 08:56
Location: Birmingham, England

04 Sep 2012 14:42

roundabout wrote:Good luck with that. We've already touched upon that in the "JV talks" thread.

But I do remember the word talent being used. Maybe not in that thread, but in one of the zillion interviews Vaughters likes to give.


In a sport like cycling, I'd like to ask JV how you determine such a thing. ;)
User avatar Walkman
Junior Member
 
Posts: 1,717
Joined: 04 Apr 2010 20:39

04 Sep 2012 14:48

There was supposedly a certain amount of physiological testing that Dekker had to do.

But as it had been mentioned, it's quite likely that Vaughters is a bit of fan of Dekker, so "talent" may not count for as much as it would with other riders.

It also remains to be seen how Dekker would next year and whether his "talent" level was worth it.
User avatar roundabout
Senior Member
 
Posts: 12,003
Joined: 07 Jun 2010 11:43

04 Sep 2012 14:50

RichWalk wrote:'Red Flagged by the UCI' and a risk to the political status quo at the time, same as most things professional, you play the game, if you stick your head over the parapet, you risk it being shot off..........


In other words...JV is a coward who doesn't want to be in the front line, even if it is regarding a matter he himself says is of great importance: To give the right signal to younger riders.
User avatar Walkman
Junior Member
 
Posts: 1,717
Joined: 04 Apr 2010 20:39

04 Sep 2012 14:52

hrotha wrote:Anyway, massive respect for Jaksche. He was one of my favourite riders, and I was glad to see he had more of a moral compass than most in the sport.


+1 on the massive respect for Jaksche. Especially juxtaposed with the piece on Wiggins in which all he had to say on the Armstrong/USADA affair is the standard omerta line that it is bad for the sport. Of course, that is half true: cheating your way to 7 TdF wins with the support of the UCI is bad for the sport, but having that exposed by the USADA isn't.
User avatar L'Etranger
Junior Member
 
Posts: 26
Joined: 22 Jan 2011 12:56

04 Sep 2012 14:55

I like Jorg. Good guy. Super smart. Extremely intelligent.

The reason he wasn’t hired because he was told by (PM) not to say anything and he wouldn’t ride again if he kept talking. It was the same for Patrick. He was told not to speak to the media otherwise no one would hire him. Being Germanic its within their nature to tell all. They’re not so good and saying “a little truth”.

Jaksche rode for Tinkoff as did Hamilton but one might remember that the team’s Giro invite was going to be pulled if either one rode the race. McQuaid was telling the team directors not to hire them and once they rode for Tinkoff he told the team they’d be no (ProTour) invites if either one rode.

Jaksche ended doing some small races for the team as did Hamilton.

Hamilton was dropped from the team and from memory ended up suing Tinkoff for loss of wages.
User avatar thehog
Senior Member
 
Posts: 16,686
Joined: 27 Jul 2009 20:00

04 Sep 2012 15:00

Walkman wrote:In other words...JV is a coward who doesn't want to be in the front line, even if it is regarding a matter he himself says is of great importance: To give the right signal to younger riders.


Yep, pretty much covers it, these guys are salesmen and marketing lead, take anyone in business and see how much of the full truth they tell..........
User avatar RichWalk
Junior Member
 
Posts: 197
Joined: 13 Jul 2012 08:56
Location: Birmingham, England

04 Sep 2012 15:00

sniper wrote:you're right, but it shows poor analytical skills if you name Riis in one breath with Kimmage, Landis and Jaksche, like JV did.
There are oceans between Riis and the other three and JV knows it but prefers to abide by the omerta.


i dont think it was poor analytical skill. I dont think JV is fond of Kimmage and lumped him in with others who are far below Kimmage's level. Riis is on a level below Bruyneel.

JV twisting and turning alng the road of omerta.

Good to see Jaksche talking candidly. But again he is out of the sport.

We do need to see hard questions asked in a long interview with winners in the current sport.
"ahaha, ever had the feeling you been cheated?" JL SF Jan'78.
User avatar Benotti69
Senior Member
 
Posts: 14,957
Joined: 26 May 2010 09:09

Next

Return to The Clinic

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: gooner, I Love To Dope, Live in the Now, More Strides than Rides, W_walker and 60 guests

Back to top