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The French hope of the century or the Colombian Messiah?

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Who is the best talent?

Thibaut Pinot
49
30%
Nairo Quintana
112
70%
 
Total votes : 161

05 Dec 2012 06:59

Ryo Hazuki wrote:you forget argiro ospina, who is already above level of dombrowski imo. but you will find out about him next year.


Alphabet wrote:Rolland's best bet would be the Vuelta or the Giro, I can't see him winning the Tour, even if he improves his TTing ability he probably won't be able to do much better than a podium place. With the way Unipublic create Vuelta routes, I think he should focus on it more so than the Giro. Also he really needs to move from Europcar if he wants to win one. They aren't capable of supporting him, and they aren't likely to gain invites to the Vuelta or Giro regularly.


Bye Bye Bicycle wrote:Wait - did you really just compare Pinot to Valverde? That's hilarious. :D


@BBB:For in the future. He does share characteristics at the moment. Pinot can climb just like Valverde and sprint so i was just saying that he could be like him in the future- the whole thread talks about these 2 basically as GT winners.

@RH: Stop giving away CQ picks.

@Alphabet: I agree but he could continue developing so that could allow him to win the TDF. Europcar have a team that can support him in Voeckler, Charteau, Cousin, Kern, Jerome...
I'd agree with you but then we'd both be wrong

The Grand Boucle wasn't just Europe's for the taking.

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greenedge
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05 Dec 2012 07:39

Ryo Hazuki wrote:and where is your proof that pinot has the engine to go 250 km in a classic? :rolleyes:


Exactly. It's not just about explosiveness or guys like Slagter would be way up there as future contenders for a Liege podium. They may still be, but nothing points to that right now.

Much shorter semi-classics or sub- 200 km hilly stages are a different matter ofc.
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18-Valve. (pithy)
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05 Dec 2012 07:48

Jason_Mercier wrote:The last year: 9th in Beghelli, race winned by Pozzato. 3rd in Tre Valli Varesine winned by Rebellin. Stage of St Savin (Rhone-Alpes Isère Tour)
In 2010: 14th in Montreal and 15th in Paris Camembert in his first professional season with 20 years. So those are the arguments. I dont write things without them. And i continue thinking the same. Pinot has more potential as a classics rider.


With you on this. Going for classics would not be a problem for Pinot.
However we probably won't know for a while since being French and a big GT hope means Pinot will be firmly focused on stage racing for the next few years.
Dazed and Confused
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21 Mar 2013 15:50

Volta a Catalunya

Real cycling fans - 2
2012 Tour de France fans - 0
The Hitch: Winner 2013 Vuelta cq game. Winner, Velorooms prediction game 2012, 2013. 2nd all time cq rankings.
The Father of Clean Cycling, Christophe Bassons wrote:When I look at cycling today, I get the impression that history is repeating itself: riders who are supposed to be rouleurs are climbing passes at the front of the race, and those who are supposed to be climbers are riding time trials at more than 50 kilometres per hour.

The story is beginning again, just as it did 14 years ago


journalist with integrity.
User avatar The Hitch
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21 Mar 2013 16:25

The Hitch wrote:Volta a Catalunya

Real cycling fans - 2
2012 Tour de France fans - 0


:rolleyes: that is pretty stupid. I think Pinot is a huge talent and I am not a 2012 Tour de France fan
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The great Alberto Contador :p
User avatar LaFlorecita
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21 Mar 2013 16:35

Considering this is Pinot's first race since month, and Quintana riding Paris Nice as preparation for this, he should be in much better shape.

Is this really a surprise :rolleyes:
Gloin22
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21 Mar 2013 16:36

The Hitch wrote:Volta a Catalunya

Real cycling fans - 2
2012 Tour de France fans - 0


Considering this is Pinot's first race since month, and Quintana riding Paris Nice as preparation for this, he should be in much better shape.

Is this really a surprise :rolleyes:
Gloin22
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21 Mar 2013 16:37

I don't know. I don't believen in them as GT podium finishers. Nairo will probably become a climber like Soler or Botero to fight for Polka dot in the Tour. Pinot is rather a future Voeckler.
User avatar airstream
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21 Mar 2013 16:40

airstream wrote:I don't know. I don't believen in them as GT podium finishers. Nairo will probably become a climber like Soler or Botero to fight for Polka dot in the Tour. Pinot is rather a future Voeckler.


What? Pinot is already a better climber Voeckler ever was in my opinion.

Quitnana has few weakness, and for now is rather a climber than a GC contender. But can't judge him until he rode his first GT as total leader.
Gloin22
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21 Mar 2013 16:41

airstream wrote:I don't know. I don't believen in them as GT podium finishers. Nairo will probably become a climber like Soler or Botero to fight for Polka dot in the Tour. Pinot is rather a future Voeckler.


What? Pinot is already a better climber Voeckler ever was in my opinion.

Quitnana has few weakness, and for now is rather a great climber than a true GC contender obviously. But can't judge him until he rode his first GT as total leader.
Gloin22
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21 Mar 2013 16:55

Thing of beauty watching that Quintana climb today. So fluid and effortless. He's got my vote.
Carstenbf
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21 Mar 2013 17:28

airstream wrote:I don't know. I don't believen in them as GT podium finishers. Nairo will probably become a climber like Soler or Botero to fight for Polka dot in the Tour. Pinot is rather a future Voeckler.

Quintana is already different to those two. Especially Botero. Really comparing Quintana with Botero is out of whack. Completely different built.

I was very excited with Quintana last year but is looking better and better since he is so young and already beating the other experienced riders.

How can somebody see weaknesses in Quintana so far? We don't have enough history to see that. Not like Uran. He will probably show weaknesses in the future but so far they are limited. And please don't come back to tell me that he cannot TT like Wiggins because that's also a silly comparison for a rider of his size.
User avatar Escarabajo
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21 Mar 2013 18:27

airstream wrote:I don't know. I don't believen in them as GT podium finishers. Nairo will probably become a climber like Soler or Botero to fight for Polka dot in the Tour. Pinot is rather a future Voeckler.


You do realize that Botero was a gt podium finisher? Soler's career of course was cut short before he could show his true worth. Soler was polka dot winner quite early in his career in a Tour where unlike many past KoM winners he was consistently climbing with the elite gc riders. I think the fact that Quintana reached the 3rd week of the Vuelta with the form to climb with 3 of the best climbers in the world bodes well for his gt prospects beyond just KoM titles exclusively.

Pinot has shown that he can reach the Tour gc top 10 without benefit of being allowed to reach that position by way of a non-threatening breakaway. Like Quintana his climbing with the elite gc riders in the last week of grand tour is a decent indication that he just may be capable of sustaining and likely surpassing that effort in the future.
If he's allowed to ride other grand tours (being French that will be hard, at least in the near future) he could potentially reach the podium. If his climbing talents continue to improve I could see him getting close to a Tour podium, at a Tour with a parcours complimentary to his talents (very unlike the 2012 Tour).
"It's a little bit scarey when Contador attacks." Tommie Voeckler
User avatar Angliru
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22 Mar 2013 01:27

The Hitch wrote:Volta a Catalunya

Real cycling fans - 2
2012 Tour de France fans - 0


One month since Pinot rode for the last time before Catalunya. Quintana cames from Paris Nice.

See you in Pays Basque.
User avatar Jason_Mercier
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22 Mar 2013 01:51

Angliru wrote:You do realize that Botero was a gt podium finisher? Soler's career of course was cut short before he could show his true worth. Soler was polka dot winner quite early in his career in a Tour where unlike many past KoM winners he was consistently climbing with the elite gc riders. I think the fact that Quintana reached the 3rd week of the Vuelta with the form to climb with 3 of the best climbers in the world bodes well for his gt prospects beyond just KoM titles exclusively.

Pinot has shown that he can reach the Tour gc top 10 without benefit of being allowed to reach that position by way of a non-threatening breakaway. Like Quintana his climbing with the elite gc riders in the last week of grand tour is a decent indication that he just may be capable of sustaining and likely surpassing that effort in the future.
If he's allowed to ride other grand tours (being French that will be hard, at least in the near future) he could potentially reach the podium. If his climbing talents continue to improve I could see him getting close to a Tour podium, at a Tour with a parcours complimentary to his talents (very unlike the 2012 Tour).

Good summary. Either way, these two (IMO) are the most exciting young climbing prospects getting around but it is still too early both in the season and their careers to say one is definitely stronger than the other.

FWIW Quintana has the upper hand ATM as he's carrying Vuelta form and started his season earlier while Pinot slowed after the TdF. Having said that Quintana's 3rd week at the Vuelta, the Emilia win and his ride at Lombardia give him my vote. I also hope he sets the Giro alight.

However, don't be surprised if Pinot outrides him later in the season when his goals come along.
How to ride like a Tour champion!

proof noun (SHOWING TRUTH)

B2 [C or U] a fact or piece of information that shows that something exists or is true

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dict...ritish/proof_1


evidence noun [U] uk /ˈev.ɪ.dəns/ us

B2 one or more reasons for believing that something is or is not true

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dict...itish/evidence
User avatar 42x16ss
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22 Mar 2013 01:57

42x16ss wrote:Good summary. Either way, these two (IMO) are the most exciting young climbing prospects getting around but it is still too early both in the season and their careers to say one is definitely stronger than the other.

FWIW Quintana has the upper hand ATM as he's carrying Vuelta form and started his season earlier while Pinot slowed after the TdF. Having said that Quintana's 3rd week at the Vuelta, the Emilia win and his ride at Lombardia give him my vote. I also hope he sets the Giro alight.

However, don't be surprised if Pinot outrides him later in the season when his goals come along.



As much as id love to see quintana at the giro, if you do see a movistar jersey setting the race alight it will likely be benat inxausti or Eros cappechi.
The Hitch: Winner 2013 Vuelta cq game. Winner, Velorooms prediction game 2012, 2013. 2nd all time cq rankings.
The Father of Clean Cycling, Christophe Bassons wrote:When I look at cycling today, I get the impression that history is repeating itself: riders who are supposed to be rouleurs are climbing passes at the front of the race, and those who are supposed to be climbers are riding time trials at more than 50 kilometres per hour.

The story is beginning again, just as it did 14 years ago


journalist with integrity.
User avatar The Hitch
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Location: London.

22 Mar 2013 02:15

Quintana isn't doing the Giro? Any ideas why?
How to ride like a Tour champion!

proof noun (SHOWING TRUTH)

B2 [C or U] a fact or piece of information that shows that something exists or is true

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dict...ritish/proof_1


evidence noun [U] uk /ˈev.ɪ.dəns/ us

B2 one or more reasons for believing that something is or is not true

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dict...itish/evidence
User avatar 42x16ss
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22 Mar 2013 02:43

42x16ss wrote:Quintana isn't doing the Giro? Any ideas why?


Movistar said they wanted to copy sky in every way.

That includes the policy of making recruits from the empire domestique for the oficial leader at the tour, rather than ride for themselves elsewhere. Especially the ones with superior climbing skills to the leader.
The Hitch: Winner 2013 Vuelta cq game. Winner, Velorooms prediction game 2012, 2013. 2nd all time cq rankings.
The Father of Clean Cycling, Christophe Bassons wrote:When I look at cycling today, I get the impression that history is repeating itself: riders who are supposed to be rouleurs are climbing passes at the front of the race, and those who are supposed to be climbers are riding time trials at more than 50 kilometres per hour.

The story is beginning again, just as it did 14 years ago


journalist with integrity.
User avatar The Hitch
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Location: London.

22 Mar 2013 02:48

42x16ss wrote:Quintana isn't doing the Giro? Any ideas why?
Ask Alejandro, he may be able to help answer that question.
Do you want to watch better bike racing? => Team radios (not race radio) must go!
User avatar cineteq
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06 Apr 2013 15:39

The Hitch wrote:Volta a Catalunya

Real cycling fans - 2
2012 Tour de France fans - 0


To update the score

Real cycling fans -4
2012 tour de France fans -0
The Hitch: Winner 2013 Vuelta cq game. Winner, Velorooms prediction game 2012, 2013. 2nd all time cq rankings.
The Father of Clean Cycling, Christophe Bassons wrote:When I look at cycling today, I get the impression that history is repeating itself: riders who are supposed to be rouleurs are climbing passes at the front of the race, and those who are supposed to be climbers are riding time trials at more than 50 kilometres per hour.

The story is beginning again, just as it did 14 years ago


journalist with integrity.
User avatar The Hitch
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Posts: 26,287
Joined: 14 Jun 2010 10:58
Location: London.

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