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Boni Seconds In The Tour? Bring it Back?

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Boni Seconds in the tour? Bring it Back?

Poll ended at 02 Apr 2013 20:44

Yes.
31
42%
Yes but only on flat stages.
6
8%
Yes but limited (eg. 10/6/4)
16
22%
No.
21
28%
 
Total votes : 74

Boni Seconds In The Tour? Bring it Back?

23 Dec 2012 20:43

So do you think ASO should bring back?

If so just like before? (20,12,8) or maybe limited?
User avatar Miburo
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23 Dec 2012 20:48

Of course they can, but they should think about where to put them. This year's Tour would have been a lot different had there been boni sec's at intermediate sprints and tops of mountain passes. That would encourage attacking a lot more than just boni's at the finish imo.
User avatar Pentacycle
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23 Dec 2012 20:55

Pentacycle wrote:Of course they can, but they should think about where to put them. This year's Tour would have been a lot different had there been boni sec's at intermediate sprints and tops of mountain passes. That would encourage attacking a lot more than just boni's at the finish imo.

+1

I would really like to see Bonus Seconds on top of mountains. Most for HC, fewer for first cat and so forth.
Cancellara is like The Black Album. Really good but way overrated.
User avatar Netserk
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23 Dec 2012 21:04

Yes, stage races should do much more for bringing the GC stars into action:
smaller teams
Bonus seconds (fixed bonus all stages to mix the players)
opportunities to gain time in 10+ stages (if GT)
etc
Dazed and Confused
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23 Dec 2012 21:23

No. It falsifies the race.
diggercuz wrote:second post ever after reading the forum for the last few years and one thing i must say, ACF94 is probably the most intelligent poster here, never biased to BMC or Cadel, and never gets worked up over anything.
User avatar auscyclefan94
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23 Dec 2012 21:32

auscyclefan94 wrote:No. It falsifies the race.


lol, love the idea bonus secs should be a key driver behind falsifying results.
Carry on.
Dazed and Confused
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23 Dec 2012 21:34

auscyclefan94 wrote:No. It falsifies the race.

But everyone in a group getting the same time doesn't? :confused:
Cancellara is like The Black Album. Really good but way overrated.
User avatar Netserk
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23 Dec 2012 21:36

Dazed and Confused wrote:lol, love the idea bonus secs should be a key driver behind falsifying results.
Carry on.


Simply because it is not based on the true time of the event therefore the person who completes the course in the fastest time is not necessarily the winner every time. That is how it falsifies the results.
diggercuz wrote:second post ever after reading the forum for the last few years and one thing i must say, ACF94 is probably the most intelligent poster here, never biased to BMC or Cadel, and never gets worked up over anything.
User avatar auscyclefan94
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23 Dec 2012 21:38

Netserk wrote:But everyone in a group getting the same time doesn't? :confused:


Totally different. That is a matter of safety and logic because not everyone can be at the front and the time differences lost and made because of those sprints is negligible.
diggercuz wrote:second post ever after reading the forum for the last few years and one thing i must say, ACF94 is probably the most intelligent poster here, never biased to BMC or Cadel, and never gets worked up over anything.
User avatar auscyclefan94
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23 Dec 2012 21:42

auscyclefan94 wrote:Totally different. That is a matter of safety and logic because not everyone can be at the front and the time differences lost and made because of those sprints is negligible.

It still 'falsifies' the time of the riders ;)
Cancellara is like The Black Album. Really good but way overrated.
User avatar Netserk
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23 Dec 2012 21:43

auscyclefan94 wrote:Simply because it is not based on the true time of the event therefore the person who completes the course in the fastest time is not necessarily the winner every time. That is how it falsifies the results.


Noble course, but I disagree. A try is worth more than a field goal etc.
Dazed and Confused
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23 Dec 2012 22:47

Voted no.

Anyone going for an advantage, say a climber versus a tt-specialist stage rider, should attack far away and not just suck wheel and go for a small sprintvictory that is awards with several extra seconds.
biopass
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23 Dec 2012 22:51

I dont care about bonus seconds usually, but if theres a ttt in there you have to give the people that start the race with a deficit somewhere to get the time back.
The Hitch: Winner 2013 Vuelta cq game. Winner, Velorooms prediction game 2012, 2013. 2nd all time cq rankings.
The Father of Clean Cycling, Christophe Bassons wrote:When I look at cycling today, I get the impression that history is repeating itself: riders who are supposed to be rouleurs are climbing passes at the front of the race, and those who are supposed to be climbers are riding time trials at more than 50 kilometres per hour.

The story is beginning again, just as it did 14 years ago


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User avatar The Hitch
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23 Dec 2012 22:57

I say yes to bonus seconds so long as they are not too big. I think they offer a good balance between the TTers and the climbers. If it's a really TT heavy Tour like this year, then I wouldn't mind bonus seconds being bigger.
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User avatar Afrank
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23 Dec 2012 23:17

Yes. Bonus seconds = incentive for great racing!
They should be big enough, similar to next year's Giro (20, 12, 8), otherwise they're useless.

I have no idea why people want them only on flat stages. :confused:

Absolute time is overrated.
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User avatar cineteq
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24 Dec 2012 02:13

They should be in all GT's. The Giro and the Vuelta had them and at the worst they ended the garbage of gift victories. I don't know why the tour doesn't do them except for the fact that they like doing the same boring format each year. I'd totally be up for more bonus seconds during other parts of the stage as well.
rzombie1988
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24 Dec 2012 02:53

auscyclefan94 wrote:Totally different. That is a matter of safety and logic because not everyone can be at the front and the time differences lost and made because of those sprints is negligible.
On some finish climbs you can see several riders get ST when there were clear gaps between them.
The last rider in the 'group' might be 5-10 secs back from the first but thanks to no two riders being more than a full second apart they get ST. If they changed the allowable gap to say 0.5 secs it would sort those cases out whilst not compromising the safety for sprint finishes.

Re bonifications, yes at all KOM points proportional to points on offer.
User avatar swuzzlebubble
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24 Dec 2012 03:27

It adds more excitement to the first week - regarding sprinters chasing the yellow for a day (which they deserve, as they're the dominant riders of the first week).

Those saying it falsifies the result - the same goes for the group getting the same time. Obviously the argument here is for safety, however at the end of the day Cavendish is still going to finish well ahead of Schleck in a sprint stage - even disregarding all safety aspects.

It also means you see the sprinters have a crack in the prologue - which adds to that event. As it is, the prologue is basically only contested by time triallers and prologue specialists. Loads of sprinters are decent prologue riders who can figure in the top 10-20 in that stage.

At the top of mountain stages they shouldn't be too big - you don't want to give someone a big bonus just by out sprinting their rival - as generally you get much less 'grouping' by the commissaires on mountain stages anyway. But some small bonuses just to split up guys on level times etc would be nice.
abbaskip
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24 Dec 2012 05:32

Unless a sprinter is a good prologue rider or they are in a team with a strong TTT it has an effect on the yellow jersey. Bonuses worked in the Vuelta but I would prefer the TTT to be scrapped or only be short or have a short TTT in the morning and a short road stage in the afternoon. But it is better to have the three grand tours doing things differently. Most of the Tour wins since Armstrong's reign have been close victories except for 2012 and 2009. This is what Prudhomme wants.
movingtarget
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24 Dec 2012 06:08

I would say no, because I'm afraid it'll encourage GC riders to leave it as late as possible on mountain finishes. Why would they attack to gain half a minute with 5 km still to climb when they could do the same (with the 20 second bonus, of course) in the final kilometre?
User avatar Alphabet
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