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Geraint Thomas

A place to discuss all things related to current professional road races. Here, you can also touch on the latest news relating to professional road racing. A doping discussion free forum.

10 Jul 2014 10:53

Hawkwood wrote:Did he jam the rear brake on? Should have followed the example of Sean Yates, have your rear brake set up so the brake blocks don't engage with the rim no matter how much you pull the lever!


Several riders had problems on the same corners that stage - Thomas was not alone but yes maybe a brake set up not suited to the conditions. I think the corners were damper than expected, it was foggy and some corners had tightening radius so late braking caused some issues. Anyhow he's had no such problems on the cobbles.
Cookster15
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10 Jul 2014 10:54

Cookster15 wrote:Totally agree. Plus I just need to add that picture of Geraint and Richie in the mud yesterday will be pulled out for years to come. Simply epic. These are the kind of scenes that make professional road racing what it is. Other examples are Evans and Vino in Strade Bianche stage of 2010 Giro and Andy Hampsten in the snow storm in '88 Giro.


Image

Thomas the Tank Engine.
User avatar Geraint Too Fast
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10 Jul 2014 10:55

Cookster15 wrote:Totally agree. Plus I just need to add that picture of Geraint and Richie in the mud yesterday will be pulled out for years to come. Simply epic. These are the kind of scenes that make professional road racing what it is. Other examples are Evans and Vino in Strade Bianche stage of 2010 Giro and Andy Hampsten in the snow storm in '88 Giro.


Yep, bike racing is not just about the winners, it's something that's very attractive about the sport and images like that live on.

I hope he leaves Sky but I don't think it'll happen until Sky decide it's time for him to move on.
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User avatar King Boonen
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10 Jul 2014 10:59

Geraint Too Fast wrote:Thomas the Tank Engine.


What a cracking image, Porte must have felt like he was behind a motorbike.
Hawkwood
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10 Jul 2014 11:07

Cookster15 wrote:Several riders had problems on the same corners that stage - Thomas was not alone but yes maybe a brake set up not suited to the conditions. I think the corners were damper than expected, it was foggy and some corners had tightening radius so late braking caused some issues. Anyhow he's had no such problems on the cobbles.

Iirc in an interview he said that the second crash was because the wheels were still slippery from the dew off the grass in the first crash.

Does the amount of track work these guys do mean that their (outdoor) bike skills are not quite as good as the betters riders? In, say, the team pursuit you have to be pretty precise in your handling. However, it is just one skill that is repeated to perfection. On the road it may not be as second nature as it is to some of the better bike handlers.

Someone like Sagan of course is just freakily good and I doubt you can ever teach that.
I was awarded 'Most Aggressive Rider of the Day', generally given to the most spectacular loser of the day.

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User avatar Don't be late Pedro
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10 Jul 2014 11:12

Don't be late Pedro wrote:Iirc in an interview he said that the second crash was because the wheels were still slippery from the dew off the grass in the first crash.

Does the amount of track work these guys do mean that their (outdoor) bike skills are not quite as good as the betters riders? In, say, the team pursuit you have to be pretty precise in your handling. However, it is just one skill that is repeated to perfection. On the road it may not be as second nature as it is to some of the better bike handlers.

Someone like Sagan of course is just freakily good and I doubt you can ever teach that.


I would have thought track riding actually leads to better skills. They will all have grown up riding at high speed, occasionally behind durneys, in large packs before moving to specialised events like TP. Add to that the fact there is little room for error on the track, the fixed gear limits what evasive maneuvers are available and I think track riders probably end up being very good bike handlers, obviously with exceptions. Cav has always be lauded for his ability to find gaps and wheels and he has said it is because of his track days.

Sagan is a mountain biker. We're obviously much better than you road guys ;)
Vincenzo Nibali:
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Reduce your carbon footprint, ride steel.
User avatar King Boonen
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10 Jul 2014 11:16

Don't be late Pedro wrote:Iirc in an interview he said that the second crash was because the wheels were still slippery from the dew off the grass in the first crash.

Does the amount of track work these guys do mean that their (outdoor) bike skills are not quite as good as the betters riders? In, say, the team pursuit you have to be pretty precise in your handling. However, it is just one skill that is repeated to perfection. On the road it may not be as second nature as it is to some of the better bike handlers.

Someone like Sagan of course is just freakily good and I doubt you can ever teach that.


I suppose it depends on the disciplines track riders follow, I think you'd need extreme bike handling skills for events such as the madison and derny pace. Also track riders will probably do lots of miles on the road. Wiggins certainly used to do huge miles on the road, even when he was focused on the track, and these were in one of the wettest parts of the UK, so you'd think he'd be able to handle wet roads.
Hawkwood
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10 Jul 2014 11:25

Hawkwood wrote:I suppose it depends on the disciplines track riders follow, I think you'd need extreme bike handling skills for events such as the madison and derny pace. Also track riders will probably do lots of miles on the road. Wiggins certainly used to do huge miles on the road, even when he was focused on the track, and these were in one of the wettest parts of the UK, so you'd think he'd be able to handle wet roads.


Wiggins' main problem at the Giro wasnt so much the conditions but the fact his heart wasnt in it. If he really wanted to win the race he'd have got back on his bike straight away and got on with it
willbick
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10 Jul 2014 11:45

willbick wrote:Wiggins' main problem at the Giro wasnt so much the conditions but the fact his heart wasnt in it. If he really wanted to win the race he'd have got back on his bike straight away and got on with it


I agree, I think his mind is a bit fragile at times. I also think that you need to be able to disengage your brain on tricky descents.
Hawkwood
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10 Jul 2014 11:48

King Boonen wrote:I would have thought track riding actually leads to better skills. They will all have grown up riding at high speed, occasionally behind durneys, in large packs before moving to specialised events like TP. Add to that the fact there is little room for error on the track, the fixed gear limits what evasive maneuvers are available and I think track riders probably end up being very good bike handlers, obviously with exceptions. Cav has always be lauded for his ability to find gaps and wheels and he has said it is because of his track days.

Sagan is a mountain biker. We're obviously much better than you road guys ;)


There's a great clip of Cav winning a derny event at a Six Day, I think the Ghent one. It's impressive just how fast the guys were going on quite a small track. I've read that as one paced rider passes over another there's a danger of the draft from the derny pushing them off their own pacer.
Hawkwood
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10 Jul 2014 11:54

King Boonen wrote:I would have thought track riding actually leads to better skills. They will all have grown up riding at high speed, occasionally behind durneys, in large packs before moving to specialised events like TP. Add to that the fact there is little room for error on the track, the fixed gear limits what evasive maneuvers are available and I think track riders probably end up being very good bike handlers, obviously with exceptions. Cav has always be lauded for his ability to find gaps and wheels and he has said it is because of his track days.

I certainly agree with that but on the (indoor) track you do not (typically) get rain , wind, people on the track, dogs on the track, people dressed as pandas... well hopefully you get my point. It is just a completely different environment. There is a bit more predicability on the track in the sense that you only need to be aware of the riders and not so much as to what is around you. Throw in the weather and it is different set of skills.
Sagan is a mountain biker. We're obviously much better than you road guys ;)

But then you also have Michael Rasmussen who for a mountain biker could be shocking some days.
I was awarded 'Most Aggressive Rider of the Day', generally given to the most spectacular loser of the day.

― David Millar, Racing Through the Dark
User avatar Don't be late Pedro
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10 Jul 2014 11:56

Hawkwood wrote:I suppose it depends on the disciplines track riders follow, I think you'd need extreme bike handling skills for events such as the madison and derny pace. Also track riders will probably do lots of miles on the road. Wiggins certainly used to do huge miles on the road, even when he was focused on the track, and these were in one of the wettest parts of the UK, so you'd think he'd be able to handle wet roads.

Though it is quite different when you throw in the peloton all fighting for position. Of course there are some guys that will naturally be good bike handlers but I do wonder if that side of things is affected
I was awarded 'Most Aggressive Rider of the Day', generally given to the most spectacular loser of the day.

― David Millar, Racing Through the Dark
User avatar Don't be late Pedro
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10 Jul 2014 12:09

Geraint Too Fast wrote:Image

Thomas the Tank Engine.


Impressive ride indeed,G and Stannard look like they really enjoy cycling,they are not so much anchored in that harsh Sky routine.
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10 Jul 2014 12:21

His problem is his versatility which is also of course his strength.

He is very useful over any terrain and weather. He is strong on the cobbles, has good speed from track and lead-out work, good TT (very good at prologues) and is decent in the mountains.

He is the perfect super-domestique in many ways.
Jan the Man
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10 Jul 2014 12:33

Don't be late Pedro wrote:I certainly agree with that but on the (indoor) track you do not (typically) get rain , wind, people on the track, dogs on the track, people dressed as pandas... well hopefully you get my point. It is just a completely different environment. There is a bit more predicability on the track in the sense that you only need to be aware of the riders and not so much as to what is around you. Throw in the weather and it is different set of skills.


I suppose, but it will certainly build quick handling at high speed which will stand them in good stead for avoiding things on the road.

But then you also have Michael Rasmussen who for a mountain biker could be shocking some days.


Yeah, there's always an exception or two that prove the rule :) We don't want Froome back by the way!!
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User avatar King Boonen
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10 Jul 2014 12:36

King Boonen wrote:Yeah, there's always an exception or two that prove the rule :)


Image

Haters gonna hate.
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10 Jul 2014 12:51

I told you, we don't want him!! :D
Vincenzo Nibali:
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Reduce your carbon footprint, ride steel.
User avatar King Boonen
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10 Jul 2014 12:58

Jan the Man wrote:His problem is his versatility which is also of course his strength.

He is very useful over any terrain and weather. He is strong on the cobbles, has good speed from track and lead-out work, good TT (very good at prologues) and is decent in the mountains.

He is the perfect super-domestique in many ways.


Yup, problem for him is that he doesn't excel at a particular discipline and doesn't have a killer move to win a cobbled classic. Good domestique but not much more really.
JRanton
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10 Jul 2014 13:03

Don't be late Pedro wrote:Though it is quite different when you throw in the peloton all fighting for position. Of course there are some guys that will naturally be good bike handlers but I do wonder if that side of things is affected


Take a look at them fighting it out in madisons, there's a few videos about.
Hawkwood
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10 Jul 2014 13:15

Hawkwood wrote:Take a look at them fighting in out in madisons, there's a few videos about.

I have been to a fair few track events and so I appreciate the skill that is required. I am purely speculating and have no definitive opinion.
I was awarded 'Most Aggressive Rider of the Day', generally given to the most spectacular loser of the day.

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