5 km pursuit

[avanti]

One race I miss is the 5,000 meter individual men's pursuit race. This was the distance for professional men in the world championships from 1946 to 1992. When the pursuit became open to both pro and amateur men the pursuit was standardized at 4,000 meters.

I would love to see the distance set at 5,000 meters again.

 

[oldcrank]

There was also four rounds back then as well: qualifying,
quarters, semis and finals.

Do you want to bring motor-pace back again too?

 

[Echoes]

Great thread, Avanti.

UCI treat riders as p*ssies.

At about the same time, they set a limit of 210km for every non (then) World-Cup single-day road race.

A pursuit is 5km, period ! Why reduce the distance? I've never accepted it.


But the great pursuit of Coppi, Bracke, Ritter, etc. was 5km !

 

[Alex Simmons/RST]

I dunno.

More distance doesn't seem to add much interest to a road race for me. Just adds more dull precession time before the real action starts.

As for pursuit, what's so appealing about 5km over 4km? Or is it just a nostalgic thing?

 

[oldcrank]

I doubt the change of distance from 4000 to 5000 would
change the results.
I, for one, am okay with the changes the UCI have made
to the track program. If we are to get all nostalgic, the
World Championships once consisted only of sprint and motor
pace for pros and amateurs. No women, no kilo, no pursuit,
no points, no team pursuit, no madison, etc. I don't think
we want to go back to those days.

 

[Echoes]

Yeah nostalgia ... Always the same empty arguments from modernists who don't want to understand anything at anything.

First, I hate team pursuit. Should get rid of it.

Second, madison was raced everywhere, in Sixes.

Third, it's a rule. NEVER make a race easier than it is. Except GT's, which should be cut down but of course they aren't.

I am still bitter at the UCI cutting down the Arrow and Paris-Brussels, among others and I haven't waited for this thread to claim that a professional pursuit is 5k and not 4. If you reduce is it to 4, then why not to 3. I guess 4km is too long and riders are tempted to dope...

 

[oldcrank]

....modernists....

I'm still rocking traditional pedals with steel toe-clips
and leather straps, my friend. Are you?

 

[Alex Simmons/RST]

Yeah nostalgia ... Always the same empty arguments from modernists who don't want to understand anything at anything.

First, I hate team pursuit. Should get rid of it.

Second, madison was raced everywhere, in Sixes.

Third, it's a rule. NEVER make a race easier than it is. Except GT's, which should be cut down but of course they aren't.

I am still bitter at the UCI cutting down the Arrow and Paris-Brussels, among others and I haven't waited for this thread to claim that a professional pursuit is 5k and not 4. If you reduce is it to 4, then why not to 3. I guess 4km is too long and riders are tempted to dope...

I asked a question, I didn't pose an argument against nostalgia. What is it that I don't understand - can you explain the reasons?

I love TP, my favourite event as a rider.

Making a race shorter does not imply it is easier.

 

[oldcrank]

Yeah nostalgia ... Always the same empty arguments from modernists who don't want to understand anything at anything...

As previously mentioned, my friend, I'm still rocking steel pedals,
toe clips and leather straps...and on my morning spin using my
pursuit bike on the rollers I noticed I'm still using Aussie wine
corks for bar end plugs. Probably more a traditionalist
than a modernist in many ways, but as I said I've accepted
the changes the UCI has made in the track program.

 

[Ferminal]

TP or IP?

IP it wouldn't really matter as the winner would in most cases be the same as the one over 4km. TP I think it would ruin the current balance you have where a team of IPers can be beaten by a team of riders whose individual specialty varies. It'd be a bit like making the kilo 1500m. For the same reason the Women's 500m TT should be 750m.

Hypothetically I wouldn't mind seeing a ~2km IP/TT to see how Clancy goes against the pure pursuiters.

 

[Echoes]

I hate being called a nostalgist. That is one of the worst insults, for me.

There are objective reasons to oppose the 4km distance.

It does not change anything for an ind. pursuit? Then why on earth did the UCI decide to reform it??? If it ain't broke, don't fix it !

I was 10 when it happened but I did remember it and of course I was already against it. Why should I have changed my mind 20 years after? Just because it was a long time ago.

The 5km distance is the pro pursuit distance, period. The 4km advocate have to put up the arguments in its favour. Not the 5km ones.

 

[Alex Simmons/RST]

I hate being called a nostalgist. That is one of the worst insults, for me.

There are objective reasons to oppose the 4km distance.

It does not change anything for an ind. pursuit? Then why on earth did the UCI decide to reform it??? If it ain't broke, don't fix it !

I was 10 when it happened but I did remember it and of course I was already against it. Why should I have changed my mind 20 years after? Just because it was a long time ago.

The 5km distance is the pro pursuit distance, period. The 4km advocate have to put up the arguments in its favour. Not the 5km ones.

OK, no insult intended, I don't personally see nostalgia as a bad thing in any case.

So the argument is that's how we've always done it, so don't change it. Why was 5km picked originally, what was the rationale for that?

List of WC winners, which is the professional 5km event listed up to 1992, then for the combined pro/am 4km event thereafter:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UCI_Track_Cycling_World_Championships_–_Men's_individual_pursuit

Here are the Olympic (4km) medallists from 1964 to 2008:
http://www.databaseolympics.com/sport/sportevent.htm?sp=CYC&enum=150


The change came with the admission of professional sports people into the Olympics and a decision to standardise to the existing Olympic distance, and perhaps may also have something to do with the move to standardise most indoor tracks to 250m, meaning less distance between riders.

Although the track in Atlanta (1996) was 250m it was outdoors. I've actually ridden on that track, although not in Atlanta, it was relocated to Canada, about an hour or so drive outside of Montreal

Some other categories (women, paras etc) race over different distances of course, and the event has lost quite a bit of interest due to the elimination from Olympic competition altogether. That really is unfortunate.


For fun, I was looking at the times in the Olympics database. My paracycling and masters aged 4km time was good enough to medal at 1964 Tokyo Olympics, the year of my birth. lol

Much different conditions and equipment of course!