All is ok, Jens has given his reasoned decision

[Basecase]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/voigt-says-he-can-still-race-at-age-41-because-cycling-is-cleaner

Thanks for the clarity and lessons in morality Jens.

 

[Benotti69]

He isn't fooling no one.

Jens is lying and protecting the omerta.

Jens is a good servant to the omerta.

 

[Baroh1488]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/voigt-says-he-can-still-race-at-age-41-because-cycling-is-cleaner

Thanks for the clarity and lessons in morality Jens.

And that is because:

A: He is the only one who is still doping???

B: A clean 41 year old can compete with a clean 25-34 year old???

????

(Don't get me wrong. I like Jens Voigt no matter what he has or hasn't done in the past)

 

[peterst6906]

I think he's been reading Anna:

http://150wattsofawesome.blogspot.com.au/2012/10/should-lance-armstrong-confess.html

It's the Trojan Jens.

 

[RHRH19861986]

He isn't fooling no one.

Jens is lying and protecting the omerta.

Jens is a good servant to the omerta.

100% agree. Jens better´d go home, and speaking three prayers for never having been caught.

 

["Jeff"]

Jens need to feed how many 6/7? children. He needs to continue.

You have to wonder why some riders (Voigt, Boogerd) speak so openly about the subject. If they have something to hide, why not just shut the **** up like so many others. They are only digging a hole for themselves. This will only come back to haunt you if they do get busted in the future unless...(fill in the blanks).

 

[Baroh1488]

100% agree. Jens better´d go home, and speaking three prayers for never having been caught.

He grew up in the DDR so he doesn't have to face the lord when everything is over

You have to wonder why some riders (Voigt, Boogerd) speak so openly about the object. If they have something to hide, why not just shut the **** up like so many others. They are only digging a hole for themselves. This will only come back to haunt you if they do get busted in the future unless...(fill in the blanks).

One thing is Jens Voigt speaking about it, another is Indurain even mentioning the Armstrong case, much less defending Armstrong. He could have laid low until the storm was over. He is still a popular. Unlike Rominger, I don't think Indurain has been involved in anything after his career ended.

 

[jyhjyh]

Link to Jens Voigt's blog

Jens need to feed how many 6/7? children. He needs to continue.

You have to wonder why some riders (Voigt, Boogerd) speak so openly about the object. If they have something to hide, why not just shut the **** up like so many others. They are only digging a hole for themselves. This will only come back to haunt you if they do get busted in the future unless...(fill in the blanks).

Exactly.

Here is the link to his blog where he talks about Hushovd and Julich too (3 pages).
http://bicycling.com/blogs/hardlyserious/2012/10/30/turbulent-times/

 

["Jeff"]

One thing is Jens Voigt speaking about it, another is Indurain even mentioning the Armstrong case, much less defending Armstrong. He could have laid low until the storm was over. He is still a popular. Unlike Rominger, I don't think Indurain has been involved in anything after his career ended.

Indurain made a complete fool of himself. I was quite shocked by his comments, definitely because he never said anything significant during his career. I wish he said something interesting back then !

He never tested positive (one small case from what I remember) but of course has a lot to hide as well. Armstrong has been found guilty based on witnesses and you understand Big Mig might fear this will happen to him as well. He needs to make clear that what has happened to Lance was bull****. I'm not a fan of the American justice system based on witness testimony either but +20 people and some good old friends is another story...even I cant deny this.

 

["Jeff"]

One thing is Jens Voigt speaking about it, another is Indurain even mentioning the Armstrong case, much less defending Armstrong. He could have laid low until the storm was over. He is still a popular. Unlike Rominger, I don't think Indurain has been involved in anything after his career ended.

Indurain made a complete fool of himself. I was quite shocked by his comments, definitely because he never said anything significant during his career. I wished he said something interesting back then !

He never tested positive (one small case from what I remember) but of course has a lot to hide as well. Armstrong has been found guilty based on witnesses and you understand Big Mig might fear this will happen to him as well. He needs to make clear that what has happened to Lance was bull****. I'm not a fan of the American justice system based on witness testimony either but +20 people and some good old friends is another story...even I cant deny this.

 

["Jeff"]

One thing is Jens Voigt speaking about it, another is Indurain even mentioning the Armstrong case, much less defending Armstrong. He could have laid low until the storm was over. He is still a popular. Unlike Rominger, I don't think Indurain has been involved in anything after his career ended.

Indurain made a complete fool of himself. I was quite shocked by his comments, definitely because he never said anything significant during his career. I wished he said something interesting back then !

He never tested positive (one small case from what I remember) but of course has a lot to hide as well. Armstrong has been found guilty based on witnesses and you understand Big Mig might fear this will happen to him as well. He needs to make clear that what has happened to Lance was bull****. I'm not a fan of the American justice system based on witness testimony either but +20 people, including some good old friends is another story...even I cant deny this.

 

[RHRH19861986]

You have to wonder why some riders (Voigt, Boogerd) speak so openly about the subject. If they have something to hide, why not just shut the **** up like so many others.

I think Jens Voigt totally lives in his own world. There´s the world around cycling, the world of cycling, and he lives somewhere in between. I think that has enabled him to stay pro for so long, and also never being caught.
He´s a guy you could always be confronted with a lie detector test, and the test certainly would show "says the truth", though he lied.

 

[Cloxxki]

Indurain made a complete fool of himself. I was quite shocked by his comments, definitely because he never said anything significant during his career. I wished he said something interesting back then !

He never tested positive (one small case from what I remember) but of course has a lot to hide as well. Armstrong has been found guilty based on witnesses and you understand Big Mig might fear this will happen to him as well. He needs to make clear that what has happened to Lance was bull****. I'm not a fan of the American justice system based on witness testimony either but +20 people, including some good old friends is another story...even I cant deny this.

I agree. Indurain undid all those years of being a modest, silent recluse. He'll go into history as the last apologetic buffoon. And I thought he was so silent and inactive (could have made similar money to Lance feeding of his reputation) due to the burden of shame pressing on his shoulders. Perhaps he was just tired of defending himself, and was now called by one of those who facilitated his doping to take the stand, his turn.

 

[Fidolix]

Long live the clinic and it´s "experts"

 

[workingclasshero]

Long live the clinic and it´s "experts"

aye been wrong about everything so far, those "experts" haven't they

 

[Polyarmour]

What a bunch of cynics.
There is nothing Jens could say that could sway the conspiracy theorist mindset of hardcore Clinic posters.
For mine I believe he is clean and I'm glad he wrote this account.
At least he didn't sit back and say nothing like most of the peloton.

 

[irongrl]

He isn't fooling no one.

Jens is lying and protecting the omerta.

Jens is a good servant to the omerta.

I would say he is as clean as any other 40+ year old that is riding as well as he is.

 

[DirtyWorks]

For mine I believe he is clean and I'm glad he wrote this account.

Guys like Verbruggen, McQuaid and Armstrong are just going to keep making a fool out of you each and every year then... I don't know what else to say. Entertainment Wrestling has more credibility than Pro cycling.

I'm not sure why you feel the need to be lied to like that on an on-going basis is okay. You are even seeking the abuse out at this point. It's probably something worth examining.

Jens is very entertaining on the bike. He has an aggressive, long-odds style of racing that is hard to dislike and exciting. It's unfortunate he's had to dope and thinks that people will just take him at his word when it comes to doping. Oh wait, Polyarmour has....

 

[Lukenwolf]

While I'm not prepared to take everything at face value, Jens has one thing going for him - he says at least something. Most of the peloton falls into one of two extremes. One half feeds us this "it's in the past, let's move on" crap and other one says "I hate dopers, how dare they steal my wins".

His view seems pretty balanced to me. I don't like how people go on and dismiss him as a liar just because he's 40 and can still stick it to younger guys at times. But they conveniently forget that he had won nothing between 2010 and this years Tour Of Somewhere in Americaland. Hardly comparable to his prime. And there have always been people, who can preserve their stamina far into the 30s. We don't age alike. Some lose their strength earlier, some later. Some people are very fit at the age of 70, while others can hardly walk anymore.

Fact is, he has gone out on a limb by saying what he said and one thing I'm prepared to believe is that he wouldn't do that, knowing that someone has ever seen him doping. He still may have done so unseen by others, but he is one of the riders, whom I'm prepared to give the benefit of doubt.

 

[taiwan]

Sincerely, looking forward to the time when it comes out what was truly going on in cycling in these years.

 

[fat_boy_fat]

JV on Twitter:

I get upset when I see riders feeling forced to lie. But then I remember, I lied too, and that I shouldn't reserve my anger for them.

 

[Lukenwolf]

And that goes in which context with the topic of the thread?

 

[Baroh1488]

http://bicycling.com/blogs/hardlyserious/2012/10/30/turbulent-times/

And there’s shocking news of how a massive doping system was organized. And some of you might even be asking yourself, “Oh my god, is Jens next?” I can answer that question easy and quickly: No! There is nothing to confess or admit in my career, so relax, people. There is no bad news coming from my side.

Why is it so hard to say straight out "I have never doped". The above statement doesn't mean that he didn't dope.

This is what an expert in "lieology" has to say. And I think it applies to alomost every public liar that I have heard.

http://liespotting.com/2011/06/liespotting-lance-armstrong-part-2-expert-analysis/

One of the most significant behaviors observed is the fact that during the entire clip (2 minutes, 7 seconds), (he) only definitively denied taking performance-enhancing drugs one time. Why is this significant? When a truthful person is accused of wrongdoing, his tendency is to dwell on the facts of the situation, which are his most important ally. In addition, there is usually some form of direct denial, such as “I didn’t do it.” In those cases where the allegations are true, and “I didn’t do it” is not a reality that the untruthful individual can psychologically rely upon, he must focus his comments elsewhere. That focus is quite often on what we call “convincing behavior,” or “convincing statements.” In the deception detection field we refer to the phenomenon as “convince vs. convey” – the aim of the deceptive person is to convince us of something rather than to convey factual information.


(I sincerely hope that Jens is clean, but 20 + years in the peloton without being implicated in or having seen anything....)

 

["Jeff"]

No matter what everyone is thinking. Jens age should not be an argument IMO. He became professional at a very late age. If you prepare yourself well than this is possible. 41 is definitely special butthere are several other examples between 35-40.

You also see an early decline with riders who were immediately great when they entered the peloton at a young age (Giuseppe Saronni, Fons de Wolf, Freddy Maertens etc etc). Cycling is a tough sport and very few can compete at a high level for more than 10 years.

 

["Jeff"]

http://bicycling.com/blogs/hardlyserious/2012/10/30/turbulent-times/

Nice link, thanks. I absolutely do NOT agree with some of this guy's opinion at all (not you but that expert).

This expert says;

When Armstrong was asked if he “can unequivocally say” that he has never used an illegal substance, he responded with a number of convincing statements. Although he made his one denial in his response to this question, he spent much more time trying to convince us of his innocence by saying such things as, “Why would I then enter into a sport and dope myself up and risk my life again?” and “I would never do something like that.” To the untrained ear, such statements often sound logical and compelling, which is how the untruthful person hopes they’ll be heard. But in actuality, those statements don’t really answer the question. In this case, the truthful answer would have simply been, “Yes, I can unequivocally say I haven’t used an illegal substance.”

Although I agree with him that an untruthfull person hopes to be heard by comments like that. It's also something I would say if I really was telling the truth instead of a comment like “Yes, I can unequivocally say I haven’t used an illegal substance.”

That's something I would not feel comfortable about either.