Basso suggests Sky doping? Likens them to Armstrong/USPS

[thehog]

“Look. It’s the same discussion as always, it’s like watching the Tour when Lance [Armstrong] or [Miguel] Indurain raced. You could try to attack, get ahead, but then what are you going to do? Just to have a laugh?” Basso said, sitting on the steps of the team bus.

“If he [Wiggins] goes as they have been, where Richie Porte is pulling and you are on the wheel pushing 420 watts, then explain to me, where are you going to go?

http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/07/news/basso-its-useless-to-try-to-stop-sky_230769

- Basso has seen it all from the inside. He's know what they're up to.

 

[D-Queued]

I like Basso. Even more now.

Dave.

 

[hrotha]

That's as accusatory as it gets in the peloton.

We shouldn't forget that the first one to compare Sky to US Postal and Banesto was Wiggins himself.

 

[Ferminal]

He is stating a racing fact. It helps people understand how futile it is to attack them early.

How they got there is not relevant to most people, Basso knows that cycling is nine tenths preparation and that superior preparation is respected.

Nice of Basso to be so frank about it.

 

[mewmewmew13]

I've always liked Ivan.
Good for him.

 

[hrotha]

He is stating a racing fact. It helps people understand how futile it is to attack them early.

How they got there is not relevant to most people, Basso knows that cycling is nine tenths preparation and that superior preparation is respected.

Nice of Basso to be so frank about it.

I don't think this kind of veiled messages, like the one we got from Evans ("they're all in the form of their lives"), is meant to be taken like that. Even dopers have standards, because in their mind they're not cheating on everyone. If you overdo it, *then* you're cheating, you're going beyond what the sport requires, you're making the rest of them look like fools and you become a liability because you're risking getting caught, which would be a disaster for everyone in the peloton (or you have the UCI on your side, which is even worse).

 

[veganrob]

That's as accusatory as it gets in the peloton.

We shouldn't forget that the first one to compare Sky to US Postal and Banesto was Wiggins himself.

Good on Basso.

You are correct on both accounts.

 

[spalco]

I don't read that as accusatory, and anyway, Basso is pretty much the last one who'd have a right to insinuate anything. Has he even owned up to his doping yet or is he still sticking to the "I was only planning to do it" crap?

 

[Turner29]

While I have always maintained that a moral problem with doping is that it does not "level the playing field." Rather, the outcome of competition is essentially decided by the level of doping sophistication.

Having said that, what is the speculation on exactly what Sky is doping to circumvent tests , more specifically blood passports that obviously severely limit the options of other riders?

 

[veganrob]

I don't read that as accusatory, and anyway, Basso is pretty much the last one who'd have a right to insinuate anything. Has he even owned up to his doping yet or is he still sticking to the "I was only planning to do it" crap?

Why does he not have the right to insinuate anything? He is an expert. I think most will agree that he doped pretty heavily and with succes in the past and is clean"er" now.
I have no problem with his comments if they are seen as accusatory. And hope they were intended as such.

 

[Ferminal]

I don't think this kind of veiled messages, like the one we got from Evans ("they're all in the form of their lives"), is meant to be taken like that. Even dopers have standards, because in their mind they're not cheating on everyone. If you overdo it, *then* you're cheating, you're going beyond what the sport requires, you're making the rest of them look like fools and you become a liability because you're risking getting caught, which would be a disaster for everyone in the peloton (or you have the UCI on your side, which is even worse).

Hopefully OPQS/Sky are just an aberration then, and things come back together (for better or worse) with time. The problem is if only a few have the resources to securely deliver a better-than-the-rest program.

 

[spalco]

Having said that, what is the speculation on exactly what Sky is doping to circumvent tests , more specifically blood passports that obviously severely limit the options of other riders?

Because he's a hypocrit if he couldn't even confess his own doping.

 

[mastersracer]

That's only accusatory if you take it out of context. He's praising Sky throughout that interview. The part about Porte is a reference to how well Sky protects Wiggans, and, most importantly:

If he meant that as a doping reference he would not mention Indurain.

 

[thehog]

Good on Basso.

You are correct on both accounts.

Correct. If anyone would know it would be him. He knows what its like on both sides. Especially these days any linkage to USPS means one thing.

Good on him. He's right you know. All you can do is laugh.

It's a joke.

 

[Svetty]

That's only accusatory if you take it out of context. He's praising Sky throughout that interview. The part about Porte is a reference to how well Sky protects Wiggans, and, most importantly:

If he meant that as a doping reference he would not mention Indurain.

+1 The OP is selectively quoting to give a misleading version of the interview to suit his own agenda. Basso calls Wiggins a champion and is giving him respect NOT calling him out.

 

[Bonkstrong]

Correct. If anyone would know it would be him. He knows what its like on both sides. Especially these days any linkage to USPS means one thing.

Good on him. He's right you know. All you can do is laugh.

It's a joke.

The only joke is that you're stating your interpritation of what he's said as an actual fact. He didn't accuse Sky of doping, he accused them of being stronger than everyone else. If that's how you want to take it then that's fine but don't pedal it is the truth.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

“Look. It’s the same discussion as always, it’s like watching the Tour when Lance [Armstrong] or [Miguel] Indurain raced. You could try to attack, get ahead, but then what are you going to do? Just to have a laugh?” Basso said, sitting on the steps of the team bus.

“If he [Wiggins] goes as they have been, where Richie Porte is pulling and you are on the wheel pushing 420 watts, then explain to me, where are you going to go?

http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/07/news/basso-its-useless-to-try-to-stop-sky_230769

- Basso has seen it all from the inside. He's know what they're up to.

What a bone-idle ****.

 

[Maxiton]

He is stating a racing fact. It helps people understand how futile it is to attack them early.

How they got there is not relevant to most people, Basso knows that cycling is nine tenths preparation and that superior preparation is respected.

Nice of Basso to be so frank about it.

Basso is a master of Omerta. Always has been. Under Omerta, the only way to make your point, when you have one to make, is to couch it inside praise. If what we've seen from Sky were merely "preparation" don't you think the entire GC would have done it?

I don't think this kind of veiled messages, like the one we got from Evans ("they're all in the form of their lives"), is meant to be taken like that. Even dopers have standards, because in their mind they're not cheating on everyone. If you overdo it, *then* you're cheating, you're going beyond what the sport requires, you're making the rest of them look like fools and you become a liability because you're risking getting caught, which would be a disaster for everyone in the peloton (or you have the UCI on your side, which is even worse).

If a high percentage of fans, and even French farmers think it's obvious

then how could we say they're not "over doing" it?

That's only accusatory if you take it out of context. He's praising Sky throughout that interview. The part about Porte is a reference to how well Sky protects Wiggans, and, most importantly:

If he meant that as a doping reference he would not mention Indurain.

Regarding the first bold, see above. About the second, regarding EPO-durain: Indurain is the prototype of advanced, over-the-heads-of-everyone-else "preparation". So why would he not mention him?

 

[mastersracer]

See above. And regarding the bold: Indurain is the prototype of advanced, over-the-heads-of-everyone-else "preparation". So why would he not mention him?

Because a rider simply would not throw Indurain under the bus. He is loved by fans and is one of the untouchables.

 

[131313]

Because a rider simply would not throw Indurain under the bus. He is loved by fans and is one of the untouchables.

it doesn't mean he's loved by the riders. being that he was coached by one of Conconi's men, he's well aware of the truth about Indurain, who was one of the biggest frauds of all.

 

[Maxiton]

Because a rider simply would not throw Indurain under the bus. He is loved by fans and is one of the untouchables.

I wouldn't exactly call a sideways mention couched as praise "throwing him under the bus." I'd call it pointing up the obvious - about Sky.

 

[alberto.legstrong]

I hate to say it but it appears to me that Sky has found a better 'program' and the rest are playing catch up. Basso is aware of it and since he is involved with the same shenanigans what can he do but congratulate them for building a better mousetrap.

It's been asked elsewhere, what is the latest and best program? It looks like someone found a better harder to detect dope. Sorry for those of you who feel they are clean, I think that's fantasy. We can agree to disagree.

 

[hfer07]

I applaud Basso for his observation on the Sky scam- He's the rightful person to speak out about this matter, having already dealt with the US Postal farce a years past, just to encounter the same BS 8 years later....

What matters to me about his commentary is the fact that he's very "discrete & reserved" when the topic covers doping-having in mind his own doping affairs he wouldn't be entitle to judge so-but then he finds himself in a situation where he has to say it like it is, because is so evident & obvious what's happening at Sky.....

 

[wirral]

+1 The OP is selectively quoting to give a misleading version of the interview to suit his own agenda. Basso calls Wiggins a champion and is giving him respect NOT calling him out.

+2

This is the OP's construction of this extract. It doesn't seem to be an accusation to me.

 

[Deagol]

.... Under Omerta, the only way to make your point, when you have one to make, is to couch it inside praise...

subtle and nuanced, brilliant...