Bicycle Lanes

[Kristina Travis]

So, I am in Chitown visiting some friends. I noticed that they do not have a lot of bicycle lanes especially in downtown - this is considering that they have those bicycles that you can rent for a few hours or days at the train stations ... I hope there are more bicycle lanes everywhere!

Yes, I don't care that it is so cold ... I still want to ride my bike ...

 

[Jspear]

So, I am in Chitown visiting some friends. I noticed that they do not have a lot of bicycle lanes especially in downtown - this is considering that they have those bicycles that you can rent for a few hours or days at the train stations ... I hope there are more bicycle lanes everywhere!

Yes, I don't care that it is so cold ... I still want to ride my bike ...

I don't know where "Chitown" is. Check your local laws. Plenty of states in the USA have pretty good bike laws. For example in VA we don't have to ride in designated bike lanes. We can ride on the road like normal motor vehicles. Of course you want to ride safely and you have to be very aware of your surroundings....point is depending on where you live, you don't HAVE to have bike lanes. You can still ride your bike.

 

[Archibald]

Chi-cago

it's a pity that we even need bike lanes, and that motorists (and riders) can't share the road together...

"All we are saaa-ying...
is give..."

 

[Arnout]

Chi-cago

it's a pity that we even need bike lanes, and that motorists (and riders) can't share the road together...

"All we are saaa-ying...
is give..."

Why? Bike lanes are the best things ever. The separation of traffic is why so many people cycle in the Netherlands (or in Denmark or Bogota for that matter). Cars will be continually slowed down by cyclists and you can't expect a faster vehicle to constantly adjust to a slower one. Cyclists will be much more relaxed on a bike path.

It's why we have sidewalks, to separate slow pedestrians from other faster moving objects.

 

[winkybiker]

Cars will be continually slowed down by cyclists and you can't expect a faster vehicle to constantly adjust to a slower one.

Really? My observation is that cars are overwhelmingly slowed down by other cars, rather than cyclists. They are hardly ever slowed down by cyclists. As an example I live just off Marine Drive in West Vancouver. A very popular route for cycling, in spite of being narrow and windy in places. Even when "full" of bikes on a sunny Saturday morning, motorists never have to wait long behind bikes to pass safely. And the vast majority of roads have no bikes on them whatsoever for most of the time, meaning that motorists really only inconvenience each other.

Being held up by a bike is completely and utterly trivial in terms of frequency and consequence. I am bemused that it makes motorists so angry and seems to be such a big deal. Can motorists simply not recognize that what they mostly see when looking out the windshield (between text messages) is the brake-lights of other cars, rather than the shapely rear end of a cyclist?

The reason for bike-lanes is safety for cyclists, not to avoid inconveniencing motorists.

I find bike lanes to be generally unsuitable for the type of riding I like to do. I much prefer to ride on the roads. And don't get me started on the shared-use paths, which are really just footpaths on which one is allowed to ride one's bike. I avoid them at all costs. Too dangerous.

 

[winkybiker]

Why? Bike lanes are the best things ever. The separation of traffic is why so many people cycle in the Netherlands (or in Denmark or Bogota for that matter). Cars will be continually slowed down by cyclists and you can't expect a faster vehicle to constantly adjust to a slower one. Cyclists will be much more relaxed on a bike path.

It's why we have sidewalks, to separate slow pedestrians from other faster moving objects.

Bike lanes in Bogota? Not so much. They have those great car-free Sundays, though.

 

[avanti]

The Denver-Boulder area must have hundreds of miles of vehicle traffic free bike paths. It is great area for cycling (however bike paths are shared with pedestrians. Biggest risk is on-coming cyclists in dark underpasses.
And riding the roads around Boulder the virtually all traffic is bike friendly.

 

[Arnout]

Bike lanes in Bogota? Not so much. They have those great car-free Sundays, though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bogotá's_Bike_Paths_Network

Obviously still in development but the idea is to create a separated cycle path network.

Really? My observation is that cars are overwhelmingly slowed down by other cars, rather than cyclists. They are hardly ever slowed down by cyclists. As an example I live just off Marine Drive in West Vancouver. A very popular route for cycling, in spite of being narrow and windy in places. Even when "full" of bikes on a sunny Saturday morning, motorists never have to wait long behind bikes to pass safely. And the vast majority of roads have no bikes on them whatsoever for most of the time, meaning that motorists really only inconvenience each other.

Being held up by a bike is completely and utterly trivial in terms of frequency and consequence. I am bemused that it makes motorists so angry and seems to be such a big deal. Can motorists simply not recognize that what they mostly see when looking out the windshield (between text messages) is the brake-lights of other cars, rather than the shapely rear end of a cyclist?

The reason for bike-lanes is safety for cyclists, not to avoid inconveniencing motorists.

I find bike lanes to be generally unsuitable for the type of riding I like to do. I much prefer to ride on the roads. And don't get me started on the shared-use paths, which are really just footpaths on which one is allowed to ride one's bike. I avoid them at all costs. Too dangerous.

Obviously the amount of times cars have to slow down per journey depends on the number of cyclists. If it is an insignificant number it's not cost-effective to create a cycle path.

In the Netherlands cycling is so popular because it is largely stress-free. I've cycled in France and Italy too and while motorists are generally very courteous there you still need to pay more attention and I generally find it less relaxing and as a result I started seeking out smaller roads which was fine for my recreational cycling but is obviously less of an option for commuters.

When I drive in the Netherlands I'm rarely held up by cyclists expect for red lights at intersections. I like that because I feel it's safer both for me and for the cyclist. Cyclists are small and slow and to expect from motorists to spot every single one of them at all times on a road with a 90kmh or 55mph speed limit is asking for trouble. I don't think it's fair to the motorist to do that if cyclists are frequent. If the motorist has a moment of inattention and causes an accident, the motorist will be scarred for the rest of his/her life too.

The speed limits as well as most roads are designed for cars and their protective barrier around the person in it. A cyclist doesn't have that and is at conflict with the car by default because of the speed difference. I don't like conflicts in traffic. Separation of traffic is the way to go if you want to make cycling more popular.

 

[Jspear]

Why? Bike lanes are the best things ever. The separation of traffic is why so many people cycle in the Netherlands (or in Denmark or Bogota for that matter). Cars will be continually slowed down by cyclists and you can't expect a faster vehicle to constantly adjust to a slower one. Cyclists will be much more relaxed on a bike path.

It's why we have sidewalks, to separate slow pedestrians from other faster moving objects.

Personally where I live, I like riding on the road. The main roads are where all the money goes (that's still not saying much - the roads still aren't always in good shape) - the bike lanes are in poor condition, infested with pedestrians and skaters....it's hard to sustain a good strong pace.

IMO the best thing to do (if you want to ride hard for exercise) is to get out of the cities...then bike lanes don't matter.

 

[Jspear]

Why? Bike lanes are the best things ever. The separation of traffic is why so many people cycle in the Netherlands (or in Denmark or Bogota for that matter). Cars will be continually slowed down by cyclists and you can't expect a faster vehicle to constantly adjust to a slower one. Cyclists will be much more relaxed on a bike path.

It's why we have sidewalks, to separate slow pedestrians from other faster moving objects.

Of course things are different where I live, so from my point of view, I disagree. Most roads are large enough where cyclist and cars can ride side by side without getting in each others way. You just have to know how to ride your bike in a steady line and cars just need to learn how wide they actually are. I have had so many drivers yell at me because I'm "in their way." If we stop at a light, I try to show them how there is actually plenty of room for them to pass me with no problems. In general cars don't have to be slowed down.

And again where I'm from, I won't be more relaxed on a bike lane. If the bike lane is in the city I have to constantly be on guard of cars thinking the bike lane is a street curb parking spot, or taxi's opening their doors, ect. In the city I'd rather be part of the main traffic...just my personal opinion....I feel like a have more control. If it is a bike lane completely separated from the road then it is often infested with pedestrians and skaters making it hard to sustain a good pace.

 

[Irondan]

After being seriously injured in a car vs. bike (I was the bike) I'm a firm believer in the bike lanes. Washington is supposed to be a share the road state but people here really like their cars, and don't like to share the road. Now that I think about it, they don't like to build bike lanes either. They pretty much just want cyclists to go away period...

 

[RedheadDane]

After being seriously injured in a car vs. bike (I was the bike) I'm a firm believer in the bike lanes. Washington is supposed to be a share the road state but people here really like their cars, and don't like to share the road. Now that I think about it, they don't like to build bike lanes either. They pretty much just want cyclists to go away period...

EVERYONE! We have a (former) bike on our forum!
So, how does it feel, being a bike?


I'll stop being silly now.

I'm with Arnout here, bike lanes are great.

 

[Arnout]

Of course things are different where I live, so from my point of view, I disagree. Most roads are large enough where cyclist and cars can ride side by side without getting in each others way. You just have to know how to ride your bike in a steady line and cars just need to learn how wide they actually are. I have had so many drivers yell at me because I'm "in their way." If we stop at a light, I try to show them how there is actually plenty of room for them to pass me with no problems. In general cars don't have to be slowed down.

And again where I'm from, I won't be more relaxed on a bike lane. If the bike lane is in the city I have to constantly be on guard of cars thinking the bike lane is a street curb parking spot, or taxi's opening their doors, ect. In the city I'd rather be part of the main traffic...just my personal opinion....I feel like a have more control. If it is a bike lane completely separated from the road then it is often infested with pedestrians and skaters making it hard to sustain a good pace.

Sure, roads in the US tend to be wider than in Europe, especially in Britain (the road width of French roads tend to be more comparable to the US).

However governments try to design roads to be as safely as possible. Despite that car manufacturers still feel the need, and rightfully so, to outfit their cars will all kind of safety systems like airbags, crumple zones and what not, because whenever multiple moving objects make use of the same space they will sometimes come together. Hence, not separating cyclists and cars will result in crashes no matter how much safety measures and public warnings are implemented. If you're willing to accept that, fine with me, but I will continue to protest against the militant cyclists who always blame cars because that simply not a realistic point of view.

 

[Jspear]

Sure, roads in the US tend to be wider than in Europe, especially in Britain (the road width of French roads tend to be more comparable to the US).

However governments try to design roads to be as safely as possible. Despite that car manufacturers still feel the need, and rightfully so, to outfit their cars will all kind of safety systems like airbags, crumple zones and what not, because whenever multiple moving objects make use of the same space they will sometimes come together. Hence, not separating cyclists and cars will result in crashes no matter how much safety measures and public warnings are implemented. If you're willing to accept that, fine with me, but I will continue to protest against the militant cyclists who always blame cars because that simply not a realistic point of view.

This is true. Unfortunately there will always be crashes...cars on cars, cars/bikes, cars/pedestrians.

That's a funny term. Personally, I only blame cars when they have broken the law. If a cyclist is at fault, I have no problem blaming a cyclist.

 

[Arnout]

This is true. Unfortunately there will always be crashes...cars on cars, cars/bikes, cars/pedestrians.

That's a funny term. Personally, I only blame cars when they have broken the law. If a cyclist is at fault, I have no problem blaming a cyclist.

Try Youtube. Some cyclists with a cycle cam are simply amazing in their ignorance, always blaming the other party (usually cars, preferably expensive ones) even if they're the ones at fault.

Also, I think one always needs to be cautious with the blame game. When a lorry driver hits someone who was in his/her blind spot the lorry driver may technically be at fault but at the same time it is important to accept that these things happen when you mix up traffic. Since cars are designed to cope with crashing into other cars reasonably well the balance between safety and mobility is relatively straightforward, but in comparison cyclists have a number of characteristics that stack against them so the consequences are often more severe.

 

[Jspear]

Try Youtube. Some cyclists with a cycle cam are simply amazing in their ignorance, always blaming the other party (usually cars, preferably expensive ones) even if they're the ones at fault.

Also, I think one always needs to be cautious with the blame game. When a lorry driver hits someone who was in his/her blind spot the lorry driver may technically be at fault but at the same time it is important to accept that these things happen when you mix up traffic. Since cars are designed to cope with crashing into other cars reasonably well the balance between safety and mobility is relatively straightforward, but in comparison cyclists have a number of characteristics that stack against them so the consequences are often more severe.

Oh I know and I agree...I've seen some pretty bad ones.
I'm just aware that it isn't a one way street.

 

[del1962]

It must be great living in a country like holland with proper cycle lanes which aren't just an afterthought.

In the UK we have some ludicrous cycle lanes that are just a dashed out part of the road that just disappear into the main traffic

 

[Jspear]

It must be great living in a country like holland with proper cycle lanes which aren't just an afterthought.

In the UK we have some ludicrous cycle lanes that are just a dashed out part of the road that just disappear into the main traffic

And cycling weekly has some pretty good articles and videos of the problems cyclist are having where you are at. I think your situation is worse than most.

 

[Archibald]

...people ... don't like to share the road.

This is the crux of the issue - it's purely about sharing the roads. Motorists just don't want to, and plenty don't want to share with other motorists!!

However governments try to design roads to be as safely as possible

I'd dispute this - try "cheaply as possible", otherwise they'd have wider lanes on the outer lanes, and an adequate number of lanes each way for the future..

Hence, not separating cyclists and cars will result in crashes no matter how much safety measures and public warnings are implemented.

maybe separate the cars from the cars/motorcycles/trucks/buses/etc... too.

If all have an attitude of sharing the roads with each other, then this alone would improve things.

In the UK we have some ludicrous cycle lanes that are just a dashed out part of the road that just disappear into the main traffic

got some of those here too. I especially like the token ones that are purely along the parking zones and right in line with all car doors - perfect for dooring riders

 

[RedheadDane]

In the UK we have some ludicrous cycle lanes that are just a dashed out part of the road that just disappear into the main traffic

I've heard about those. Don't they frequently just go Oh... so this is a bike lane. Let's place a random light pole in the middle of it!?

 

[winkybiker]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bogotá's_Bike_Paths_Network

Obviously still in development but the idea is to create a separated cycle path network.

Well I'll be. I stand corrected. Thanks. I never saw any of those when I was there (briefly). It's a great city, but is completely car-f%$#ed, like most large cities around the world. The resolve to support cycling as an alternative transportation is admirable.

And those car-free Sundays are awesome. Every city should do it.

 

[Catwhoorg]

One of out local multi-use trails. Happy to have it, but seriously no thought was put into certain sections.

 

[Irondan]

One of out local multi-use trails. Happy to have it, but seriously no thought was put into certain sections.

Looks like a great trail, until a clueless dog owner is standing on one side while the dog is on the other, with a leash of varying thicknesses across the trail. NO THANKS, but I would rather not kill some dog because the owner thinks the trail is only for fido to crap on.

 

[Irondan]

I didn't mean to quote the picture too! sorry.

 

[Oldman]

It must be great living in a country like holland with proper cycle lanes which aren't just an afterthought.

In the UK we have some ludicrous cycle lanes that are just a dashed out part of the road that just disappear into the main traffic

Seattle has an abundance of these at the behest of a politically active local cycling club. We do have isolated two-way lanes that parallel sidewalks and roadway. Watching clueless cyclists ignore oncoming, turning cars is both horrific and amusing at the same time. I'm still loving the moment when a jerk in a Tesla and a precious "racer" on his Cervelo are holding up traffic arguing over whom had the right of way. One block away from this arterial (and most of the major "bike lanes") is a quiet side street that sensible riders should take. Most commuting cyclists are sharp, sensible riders that can deal with cars but the dedicated lanes seem to be more of a Darwinian funnel of fun...