Denial, non-denial, creadability and lies

[I Watch Cycling In July]

I'm trying to complete a record of who said what, when. This article has some of it. Here's a list of people who are directly or indirectly identified by the allegations in Landis' emails.

Johan Bruyneel: Denial; Radioshack counsel describes Landis accusations as false, incredible and baseless.
Lance Armstrong: Denial; Denies bribing UCI. Denies Bruyneel taught Landis to dope.
Hein Verbruggen: (hearsay) UCI categorically rejects the allegation that Verbruggen was bribed.
George Hincapie: Non-denial; Says he has a reputation for working hard, honestly and honorably. Denial via team statement?
Michael Barry: Denial; Points out that Landis has changed story.
Allen Lim: Non-denial; States he wouldn't work with athlete who he knew used performance enhancing drugs, but doesn't respond to allegations he assisted with transfusion.
Levi Leipheimer: No Comment; I'm not worried, I have nothing to say. Denial via team statement?
Jose Azevedo: No comment - no link
Andy Rihs: Denial; Claims either he nor team management knew that Floyd Landis was doped (3rd to last paragraph)
Jim Ochowitz: (hearsay) Denial. States that allegations against BMC management team and one rider are not true.
John Lelangue: Denial; will cooperate in investigations to help show that accusations are not founded.
Dave Zabrisky: No comment/Non-denial; When told that Landis was at ToC replied... "He’s here, really?” Zabriskie saidsarcastically. “Tell him I said hi. How’s he doing?” Jonathan Vaughters has said he believes Zabriskie is riding clean now. It's unclear whether that comment was on behalf of Zabriskie.
Kristin Armstrong (ex wife named as witness): Reportedly "helping with inquiries"

Michele Ferrari, Chechu Rubiera, Peter Park, Matthew White, Team doctor (2003), Geert Duffelaar, Team bus driver (2004), Manuel Beltran, Vjatceslav Ekimov, Benjamin Noval, Pavel Padrnos, Jose Luis Rubiera. Anyone know of any comments from the above?

Comments from former Armstrong teammates not implicated by Landis:
Christian Vande Valde: Unfortunate the past keeps getting dug up. Nobody's going to give much credence to Floyd, after a long stream of lies.
Steffen Kjærgaard: If there is ANY truth in any of this, I must have been inside the hell of naïve. Has no reason to believe Armstrong wasn't clean. Says he belonged in no way in the world presented in this story. (info from here)
Frankie Andreu: When you have that kind of detail like Floyd’s throwing out there, you can’t just make that stuff up.
Jonathan Vaughters: Going to move forward and team is clean. Supports WADA in truth seeking role. 100 percent surethat his team was doping-free, but is aware that cycling’s dark past looms.
Steve Swart: I'd say he's been let down by the code of silence that exists in bike racing and fells like he has nowhere else to turn, so he might as well go out with a bang. (Transcript of TVNZ interview)

Some of those denials include some obvious ...erm...factual lapses....

 

[theswordsman]

Take your pick for Zabriskie:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/landis-makes-an-appearance-at-the-amgen-tour-of-california

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/23/sports/cycling/23cycling.html

This from my twitter a day ago. I hope he follows through
Vaughters said he was “100 percent sure” that his team was doping-free, and that he would release riders’ blood records to prove it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/24/sports/cycling/24cycling.html

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

Thanks swordsman, I had seriously run out of steam. Couldn't help noticing this in one of your NYT articles:

First came George Hincapie, the United States road racing champion. “The American legend is charging!” the race announcer shouted.

 

[theswordsman]

Thanks swordsman, I had seriously run out of steam. Couldn't help noticing this in one of your NYT articles:

First came George Hincapie, the United States road racing champion. “The American legend is charging!” the race announcer shouted.

There are way too many threads to juggle on this. Hopefully the one with links will stay active and uncluttered. I imagine we'll have some quiet news days coming up to sort through everything.

I missed some days of the races due to an attack on my computer. I'm ready to focus on the Giro and the French Open for the next six days. Sports should be fun.

I wonder if some of the older guys might decide to ride one more Tour de France, experience it all one last time, and then talk?

 

[Anonymous]

Phil Liggett - Denial

Does he count?

 

[Hillavoider]

UCI's responce

 

[Colm.Murphy]

How about the guy from Cervelo? Vroomen...is that the name. Something about a short-term pain but a long-term gain?

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

@hillavoider - its under verbrugen - the link is under the word rejects. It was actually Verbruggen that Landis accused in the stuff we have seen so far. So its a little odd that the UCI is so prepared to back him up personally, without checking....

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

@dim & Colm, I'll put those in the general links on the other thread.

Basically, claims are being made that most people implicated are rubbishing Flandis' allegations. So I'm collecting all the responses from those directly implicated or otherwise tainted through guilt by team association.

The NYT article linked above "Accusations Ring Loud, but Not the Denials" pretty much makes the point....but I'm still keen to hear about the reactions from non anglophone riders.

 

[Colm.Murphy]

@dim & Colm, I'll put those in the general links on the other thread.

Basically, claims are being made that most people implicated are rubbishing Flandis' allegations. So I'm collecting all the responses from those directly implicated or otherwise tainted through guilt by team association.

The NYT article linked above "Accusations Ring Loud, but Not the Denials" pretty much makes the point....but I'm still keen to hear about the reactions from non anglophone riders.

Funny, all I seem to hear from that side of the pond is crickets.

The silence is deafening.

 

[Pantani_lives]

Michele Ferrari, Chechu Rubiera, Pepe, the team "trainer" (2003), Matthew White, Team doctor (2003), "Duffy" who was at that time Johans assistant of sorts (2004), Team bus driver (2004), Jose Azevedo, Manuel Beltran, Vjatceslav Ekimov, Benjamin Noval, Pavel Padrnos, Jose Luis Rubiera, John Lelangue. Anyone know of any comments from the above?

John Lelangue: denial (in telephone interview with Renaat Schotte on Belgian television)

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

Thanks pirate

 

[SpartacusRox]

@dim & Colm, I'll put those in the general links on the other thread.

Basically, claims are being made that most people implicated are rubbishing Flandis' allegations. So I'm collecting all the responses from those directly implicated or otherwise tainted through guilt by team association.

The NYT article linked above "Accusations Ring Loud, but Not the Denials" pretty much makes the point....but I'm still keen to hear about the reactions from non anglophone riders.

Probably not a lot given they were all juiced up to the eyeballs

 

[gjdavis60]

I'm most interested in what Jeff Novitzky says.

 

[santacruz]

I was actually happy for Rogers success after coming back from a lot of adversity until I heard him use his platform as race winner to enforce Omerta. Nice job Mick, you're full of it. Have fun at the Tour, can't think of any reason to waste my life watching your rolling drug wagon this summer.

Amen BikeCentric!!

 

[issoisso]

Michele Ferrari, Chechu Rubiera, Pepe, the team "trainer" (2003), Matthew White, Team doctor (2003), "Duffy" who was at that time Johans assistant of sorts (2004), Team bus driver (2004), Jose Azevedo, Manuel Beltran, Vjatceslav Ekimov, Benjamin Noval, Pavel Padrnos, Jose Luis Rubiera. Anyone know of any comments from the above?

Azevedo didn't deny. He just said no comment.

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

Thanks isso.

Looks like there really is hardly a squeak from the european riders so far.

Is say-as-little-as-possible-and-wait-for-it-all-to-blow-over the usual MO? Or does the lack of comment mean something? (apart from the obvious, being anyone claiming they're all denying it, is full of ****).

 

[theswordsman]

Thanks isso.

Looks like there really is hardly a squeak from the european riders so far.

Is say-as-little-as-possible-and-wait-for-it-all-to-blow-over the usual MO? Or does the lack of comment mean something? (apart from the obvious, being anyone claiming they're all denying it, is full of ****).

I think it's still seen as an American (US) investigation right now, so they're probably waiting to see if they need to respond. There are still a lot of people who tread softly around all things Bruyneel.

Officials are paying attention, though. I posted a link that has the Belgian Cycling Federation instructing a Federal prosecutor to watch the case slowly to see if they need to take action against Bruyneel or cyclists, or I guess management. The people who need to focus on this seem to be coming forward.

http://www.standaard.be/artikel/detail.aspx?artikelid=DMF20100525_137&postcode=1570

 

[tofino]

Stapleton pretty much kicks

team owner Stapleton pretty much agrees when you read between the lines. I would have loved to see his facial expressions when he said this (end NYT article).

I’m all for the older generation racing and succeeding and passing the drug tests, but they don’t define the sport anymore. Lance Armstrong doesn’t define the sport anymore. There’s a new generation of riders and teams who operate under a whole new set of rules.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/24/sports/cycling/24cycling.html

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

All the "cycling has changed" comments amuse me no end. Those people are now somewhat committed to acknowledging that there was a problem when Floyd was riding. Otherwise they imply that the change was in fact a change for the worse.

 

[velocycling]

I hope these riders continue to deny. When Jeff Novitzky calls them in for sworn testimony, they will deny. He will get them on prejury charges not doping charges. This guy may not have gotten Barry Bonds but I do not think there are many Greg Anderson's who will do 2 years in a fed pen who are cyclists.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Lelangue's "denial" is now on the front page of CN. Link here.

But he says he'll cooperate, but seems to imply he'll be cooperating with the UCI. Didn't mention a thing about federal investigation, if there is one. As I don't trust he UCI, this statement means little to me.

There are other names in the script you could add. Kristin, Tyler for that matter.

Correct, velocycling. IF it comes to that. Who knows if an investigation will even try to get that far. But if it does, all these people happily denying to the UCI will find a vastly different audience they are talking to.

 

[filipo]

You said it, Alpe. From the NYT article Roadent just posted:

"Fraud is something the government takes quite seriously, particularly where a lot of money is involved and conduct is flagrant.” -- Daniel C. Richman, a professor of law at Columbia University and former federal prosecutor

 

[Berzin]

"Cycling is cleaner than ever"-Jonathan Vaughters.

How can this be true when the average speeds haven't dropped?

Also, if he is so sure of this, he must have more than anecdotal information on what went on when he was riding.

I guess only a federal investigator can get at the truth at this point.

 

[riobonito92]

The most repeated "party" line now seems to be something like it is time to move on, cycling was dirty in the past but now it is clean; all these accusations are killing the sport. etc.etc.

Are we moving towards an amnesty?