Fatty Acids Identified in the Burmese Python Promote Beneficial Cardiac Growth

[bike_framed]

Like me, one of the announcer's first thoughts was of the potential sporting applications of this:

http://www.cbc.ca/informationmornin...ns-to-its-heart-that-might-help-human-hearts/

Article in Science:

http://www.sciencemag.org/content/334/6055/528.full

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Very interesting.

 

[MarkvW]

Like me, one of the announcer's first thoughts was of the potential sporting applications of this:

http://www.cbc.ca/informationmornin...ns-to-its-heart-that-might-help-human-hearts/

Article in Science:

http://www.sciencemag.org/content/334/6055/528.full

Maybe there should just be open leagues where the biochemical/biomechanical attributes of the racers are ignored. Sooner or later we're going to see genetically engineered freaks who will effortlessly dominate un-engineered riders. We're going to have to fairly integrate those freaks into sport, but we're also going to want to give "natural" racers a fair experience.

Brave new world.

 

[happychappy]

Is python meat on the 2012 prohibited list?

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Is python meat on the 2012 prohibited list?

I hope so. I've enjoyed his posts.

 

[Benotti69]

Maybe there should just be open leagues where the biochemical/biomechanical attributes of the racers are ignored. Sooner or later we're going to see genetically engineered freaks who will effortlessly dominate un-engineered riders. We're going to have to fairly integrate those freaks into sport, but we're also going to want to give "natural" racers a fair experience.

Brave new world.

i suspect the freaks will stand out and their profiling will tell us that vo2 max, lung capacity never mind the record breaking performances etc.....

and i imagine the same 'freaks' who enjoy www (wrestling) will enjoy it, like most of the road forum.

 

[L'arriviste]

I hope so. I've enjoyed his posts.

Priceless!

Can't wait to see Pippo's snakeskin Sidis next year.

 

[MarkvW]

i suspect the freaks will stand out and their profiling will tell us that vo2 max, lung capacity never mind the record breaking performances etc.....

and i imagine the same 'freaks' who enjoy www (wrestling) will enjoy it, like most of the road forum.

The problem is that the freaks will distort the bike race itself. The non-freak racers should be able to get an un-freaky race experience.

We're approaching a time where genetic or biomedical modifications can be a healthy and reasonable course of action. People modified ought to have a fair crack at sports.

We're seeing the beginning of this with the South African amputee sprinter whose biomechanical legs give him a huge advantage. Some people want to keep him from racing, others don't. It is a tough problem, but I think it is wrong to keep him from participating.

 

[ramjambunath]

Priceless!

Can't wait to see Pippo's snakeskin Sidis next year.

I hope it covers his snake properly.

The problem is that the freaks will distort the bike race itself. The non-freak racers should be able to get an un-freaky race experience.

We're approaching a time where genetic or biomedical modifications can be a healthy and reasonable course of action. People modified ought to have a fair crack at sports.

We're seeing the beginning of this with the South African amputee sprinter whose biomechanical legs give him a huge advantage. Some people want to keep him from racing, others don't. It is a tough problem, but I think it is wrong to keep him from participating.

So safety of the sportsperson and those near him is not to be taken into consideration? Does it mean that we should support a rider or a medicine? Problem with doped up freaks is that a situation like Chris Benoit (WWF wrestler) is just waiting to happen.

On topic, interesting piece and misuse of such inconsequential (as of now) things will be tried. More importantly, will it lead to unsustainable snake farming or poaching. I hope neither of these things happen.

 

[Benotti69]

The problem is that the freaks will distort the bike race itself. The non-freak racers should be able to get an un-freaky race experience.

We're approaching a time where genetic or biomedical modifications can be a healthy and reasonable course of action. People modified ought to have a fair crack at sports.

We're seeing the beginning of this with the South African amputee sprinter whose biomechanical legs give him a huge advantage. Some people want to keep him from racing, others don't. It is a tough problem, but I think it is wrong to keep him from participating.

the definition of 'fair crack' is important. are you arguing that someone who could never win a 3 week GT should get a treatment/modification in order to have a 'fair crack' for example per chance

 

[MarkvW]

I hope it covers his snake properly.



So safety of the sportsperson and those near him is not to be taken into consideration? Does it mean that we should support a rider or a medicine? Problem with doped up freaks is that a situation like Chris Benoit (WWF wrestler) is just waiting to happen.

On topic, interesting piece and misuse of such inconsequential (as of now) things will be tried. More importantly, will it lead to unsustainable snake farming or poaching. I hope neither of these things happen.

What if a person gets the snake treatment for a heart ailment and it causes him permanent and drastic improvement--and gives him a huge advantage over other competitors. Should that person be banned?

 

[MacRoadie]

This could be quite interesting. The Burmese Python is a VERY popular pet snake here in The States (I'd venture to guess it might be THE most popular). They can be found in most pet shops, and are pretty much mandatory stock in any shop specializing in reptiles.

You also hear of them turning up in sewers and parks and wooded areas quite often as people let them loose in the wild when they get too big (another testament to their popularity and the fact that so many people buy them without fully undertstanding how to care for them, or how big they get).

Will we see them disappearing off of pet shop shelves, purchased by people who curiously never come back in to buy the steady stream of feed mice the snakes need?

 

[biokemguy]

Just eat the FA's?

Will we see them disappearing off of pet shop shelves, purchased by people who curiously never come back in to buy the steady stream of feed mice the snakes need?

Eating snake will be unnecessary. The precise mixture of Fatty Acids used to get the heart growth is defined in the paper. But they infused it directly into the blood stream rather than feeding it to the mice or pythons.

Given the lack of regulations on the supplement industry, you'll probably soon see some supplement with this mix of fatty acids in it with all sorts of fantastical claims on the label.

Since Garmin is in Boulder where this study was done, they'll have a *diet change* next season that turns them into world beaters.

 

[ramjambunath]

What if a person gets the snake treatment for a heart ailment and it causes him permanent and drastic improvement--and gives him a huge advantage over other competitors. Should that person be banned?

Of course, for ethical purposes (in this hypothetical case) nothing can be done but many assumptions have to be made for this to ever be possible. One big assumption made, without any human trials, is that there will be a definite rise in performance. Another assumption that can be made is whether this form of medication, if ever it becomes one, will be recognised in all countries. If an athlete fails a test in one of the countries which don't recognise the diagnosis, will they consider it as being a medical treatment (though the athlete may have had the test/diagnosis in another country) or will it be considered as medical enhancement.

Can medical engineering of sportsmen be institutionalised? I think not, mainly because there would be more than a few sportsmen who would wish to push it to the very edge, if not further. Even in this doping taboo era, examples of Ricco are around which could have easily resulted in his death. Even the WWF(E) has anti doping programs in place where tests are made for anabolic steroids, HGH, clen, diuretics along with various other drugs (it's in their website). In reality, if anything, the world is moving further away from legalised medical engineering in sport.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Maybe there should just be open leagues where the biochemical/biomechanical attributes of the racers are ignored. Sooner or later we're going to see genetically engineered freaks who will effortlessly dominate un-engineered riders. We're going to have to fairly integrate those freaks into sport, but we're also going to want to give "natural" racers a fair experience.

Brave new world.

If it's a foregone conclusion, then you first.

I'll cut you some slack and you can start with the more mundane controlled substances it's illegal for you to have like EPO. Get a hormone replacement program started with a regular MD.

You should ease into the python extracts sometime next year along with a CERA/EPO/HGH cocktail.

What are you waiting for? It's going to happen, right?

On the pythons as pets thing, apparently they are a BIG problem in the Florida everglades. No predators.

 

[MarkvW]

If it's a foregone conclusion, then you first.

I'll cut you some slack and you can start with the more mundane controlled substances it's illegal for you to have like EPO. Get a hormone replacement program started with a regular MD.

You should ease into the python extracts sometime next year along with a CERA/EPO/HGH cocktail.

What are you waiting for? It's going to happen, right?

On the pythons as pets thing, apparently they are a BIG problem in the Florida everglades. No predators.

It's going to happen. It hasn't happened yet. But it will. Not only the unsafe options you mention, but safe ones--ones that are obviously desirable. How do we treat those choices and the people who opt for them?

It's not an easy question.

 

[Benotti69]

It's going to happen. It hasn't happened yet. But it will. Not only the unsafe options you mention, but safe ones--ones that are obviously desirable. How do we treat those choices and the people who opt for them?

It's not an easy question.

safe ones? things like this only become safe are a lot of study and testing. who is gonna fund that?

best humans accept their limitations athletically and deal with it.

 

[DirtyWorks]

best humans accept their limitations athletically and deal with it.

Exactly right! IOC athletics has learned that they are much better off keeping the forbidden fruit out of competition. Not that the IOC is really interested in doing that, but they are well aware of the very high value the appearance of a strong anti-doping stance. It attracts viewers worldwide. And viewers == money. Lots and lots of money.

Markvw,

As for your "it's going to happen" belief, it already has. The 90's EPO party is proof. And what were the consequences? Scandal. You'll note that U.S. baseball was negatively affected by drug scandals too. Congress put an end to it by having a very public dog and pony show and bringing up the possibility of ending their monopoly protections. Viewers/voters strongly prefer the appearance of clean athletes.

And, what's your doping plan? You seem fine with doping, so you first. Are you going to pay someone to do the injections for you? When will you start doing the injections yourself? C'mon now, if you believe so strongly that PED's should be the norm, then it's time to put your words into action. Or, maybe it's more cheap talk from armchair dopers?

 

[MarkvW]

Exactly right! IOC athletics has learned that they are much better off keeping the forbidden fruit out of competition. Not that the IOC is really interested in doing that, but they are well aware of the very high value the appearance of a strong anti-doping stance. It attracts viewers worldwide. And viewers == money. Lots and lots of money.

Markvw,

As for your "it's going to happen" belief, it already has. The 90's EPO party is proof. And what were the consequences? Scandal. You'll note that U.S. baseball was negatively affected by drug scandals too. Congress put an end to it by having a very public dog and pony show and bringing up the possibility of ending their monopoly protections. Viewers/voters strongly prefer the appearance of clean athletes.

And, what's your doping plan? You seem fine with doping, so you first. Are you going to pay someone to do the injections for you? When will you start doing the injections yourself? C'mon now, if you believe so strongly that PED's should be the norm, then it's time to put your words into action. Or, maybe it's more cheap talk from armchair dopers?

I think EPO is dangerous. I don't think you would disagree with me. The medical materials I've seen all stress that EPO is very dangerous. I'm not talking about dangerous performance enhancements. I'm talking about safe performance enhancements.

And I'm not talking about the idiots who take PEDS just to win a stupid bike race (or to help somebody else win a stupid bike race). I'm talking about people who take PEDs for legitimate medical or quality-of-life purposes.

When there are SAFE drugs or procedures that enhance people's lives with no counterbalancing adverse health effect, then people will take them. They won't take them because they want to win a stupid bicycle race with a lot of old men with body image problems--they will take them because they are going to prolong or enhance their lives. People will soon be augmenting themselves, because augmentation will be good for them. Things like bionic body parts, artificially manufactured muscles, brain enhancements, etc. It is not happening yet, but it is going to happen.

Imagine a pill that will forestall Alzheimers and also radically improve your hand eye coordination. Are you not going to take it because it might disqualify you in a bicycle race with a bunch of Type-A obsessives? Of course not! Compared to preventing Alzheimers, participation in a bike race is trivial. Are you going to be banned from racing because you elected to avoid Alzheimers?

What about the nine year old kid with an unhealthy hormone deficiency, whose parents decide to have him treated with gene therapy? What if the kid post-treatment becomes hulk-on-a-bike and can solo away from every other kid in his age group? You're not advocating that the kid shouldn't get the treatment, I'm sure. But are you also arguing that the kid should be deprived of his chance to excel in sport--at his chance to maximize his athletic potential?

In your eagerness to put words in my mouth, you have entirely missed my point. There is soon going to come a time when people augment their bodies for good reasons (not cheating reasons). How will those people be integrated into sport? I have no plan. This is a very hard question.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I think EPO is dangerous. I don't think you would disagree with me. The medical materials I've seen all stress that EPO is very dangerous. I'm not talking about dangerous performance enhancements. I'm talking about safe performance enhancements.

And I'm not talking about the idiots who take PEDS just to win a stupid bike race (or to help somebody else win a stupid bike race). I'm talking about people who take PEDs for legitimate medical or quality-of-life purposes.

When there are SAFE drugs or procedures that enhance people's lives with no counterbalancing adverse health effect, then people will take them. They won't take them because they want to win a stupid bicycle race with a lot of old men with body image problems--they will take them because they are going to prolong or enhance their lives. People will soon be augmenting themselves, because augmentation will be good for them. Things like bionic body parts, artificially manufactured muscles, brain enhancements, etc. It is not happening yet, but it is going to happen.

Imagine a pill that will forestall Alzheimers and also radically improve your hand eye coordination. Are you not going to take it because it might disqualify you in a bicycle race with a bunch of Type-A obsessives? Of course not! Compared to preventing Alzheimers, participation in a bike race is trivial. Are you going to be banned from racing because you elected to avoid Alzheimers?

What about the nine year old kid with an unhealthy hormone deficiency, whose parents decide to have him treated with gene therapy? What if the kid post-treatment becomes hulk-on-a-bike and can solo away from every other kid in his age group? You're not advocating that the kid shouldn't get the treatment, I'm sure. But are you also arguing that the kid should be deprived of his chance to excel in sport--at his chance to maximize his athletic potential?

In your eagerness to put words in my mouth, you have entirely missed my point. There is soon going to come a time when people augment their bodies for good reasons (not cheating reasons). How will those people be integrated into sport? I have no plan. This is a very hard question.

Your difficulty is that "your point" is wrong.
Pretty much everything you wrote is not "Performance Enhancing" - it is correcting an original deficiency.

To the highlighted - augmenting their bodies? How and what would satisfy Performance Enhancing? And how would that relate to sport?

 

[MarkvW]

Your difficulty is that "your point" is wrong.
Pretty much everything you wrote is not "Performance Enhancing" - it is correcting an original deficiency.

To the highlighted - augmenting their bodies? How and what would satisfy Performance Enhancing? And how would that relate to sport?

Your premise is that it is not "performance enhancing" if it correct an original deficiency?" But what if it does both? If I get a surgical implant that restores my ability to walk and also turns me into a freak who can sustain 400W for five hours, that would definitely be correcting an original deficiency (I can walk!), and also performance enhancing (I can dominate!).

This isn't about word meanings. The future is coming at us full speed ahead!

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Your premise is that it is not "performance enhancing" if it correct an original deficiency?" But what if it does both? If I get a surgical implant that restores my ability to walk and also turns me into a freak who can sustain 400W for five hours, that would definitely be correcting an original deficiency (I can walk!), and also performance enhancing (I can dominate!).

This isn't about word meanings. The future is coming at us full speed ahead!

"If"!
I understand your point is a hypothetical but it makes little sense.

You think there will be a drug or gene that will do that? Restore a deficiency and makes you better, indeed much much better and beyond current human limitations?

 

[MarkvW]

"If"!
I understand your point is a hypothetical but it makes little sense.

You think there will be a drug or gene that will do that? Restore a deficiency and makes you better, indeed much much better and beyond current human limitations?

Replace the treatment in that hypothetical with gene therapy, then.

Look at the amputee in South Africa whose artificial legs give him a decided advantage in sprinting. We're now artificially growing muscles to help repair war-wounded soldiers. Stem cell treatments are effecting regeneration of limbs in animals. I have no doubt that gene therapy will be effecting amazing things in the future.

What if a therapy is developed to increase the oxygen exchange capacity of the lungs to help COPD patients? What if it could then be used to benefit everybody, without health risk? Any sane active person would take the therapy. But how would/should sport sort it all out? I don't think this kind of speculation is that far-fetched.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Replace the treatment in that hypothetical with gene therapy, then.

Look at the amputee in South Africa whose artificial legs give him a decided advantage in sprinting. We're now artificially growing muscles to help repair war-wounded soldiers. Stem cell treatments are effecting regeneration of limbs in animals. I have no doubt that gene therapy will be effecting amazing things in the future.

Again - all these methods are not enhancing*, they are making up for an injury or deficiency.

*With the exception of the amputee runner - who has special prosthetic's for running.

What if a therapy is developed to increase the oxygen exchange capacity of the lungs to help COPD patients? What if it could then be used to benefit everybody, without health risk? Any sane active person would take the therapy. But how would/should sport sort it all out? I don't think this kind of speculation is that far-fetched.

If (& its still an 'if') there is potential for abuse - then this is more likely.
Using a method designed for a specific and athletes using it for enhancement (same as traditional PEDs now).

But again your theory falls down on the examples you give.
Firstly - in the case of COPD patients - well the theory of gene therapy would be to address the obstruction, not enhance the lung itself.
Second, if "everyone" benefits from something then there is no issue - and again, I can only see that being used to eliminate conditions not enhance quality of life.

 

[MarkvW]

Again - all these methods are not enhancing*, they are making up for an injury or deficiency.

*With the exception of the amputee runner - who has special prosthetic's for running.


If (& its still an 'if') there is potential for abuse - then this is more likely.
Using a method designed for a specific and athletes using it for enhancement (same as traditional PEDs now).

But again your theory falls down on the examples you give.
Firstly - in the case of COPD patients - well the theory of gene therapy would be to address the obstruction, not enhance the lung itself.
Second, if "everyone" benefits from something then there is no issue - and again, I can only see that being used to eliminate conditions not enhance quality of life.

If you don't accept the possibility of non-therapeutic and healthy augmentation of the human body, then the hypothetical future situation I present is never going to happen and the ethical and moral issues I allude to are never going to arise.

I'm convinced that non-therapeutic and healthy augmentation of the human body will be available within the next decade and beyond. The moral and ethical issues surrounding it are huge. Sport is just one facet of the problem.